8
   

what is OBAMACARE'S Fatal Flaw?

 
 
roger
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 01:12 pm
@tsarstepan,
He expressed the same thought several years ago. I believe JPB and myself agreed - depending on the details, of course.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  0  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 02:36 pm
@tsarstepan,
tsarstepan wrote:

McGentrix?! You just BLEW my mind! A conservative like you vouching for the most liberal of health care systems! I'm staggering now.




But wait! There's more! That's why I absolutely hate Obamacare. All it did was enrich Insurance companies and destroy small businesses.

I was and am totally behind having a single payer system of health care that would cover all Americans. THAT is the ONLY way healthcare costs ever get fixed in this country.

The only other possible option would be to open insurance between state lines so they could be competitive across the country. But, Insurance company lobbyists would never allow that and everyone knows government is controlled by the lobbyists.

Oh, and I am not vouching for anything. It's not what it should be therefore it should be destroyed and I will vote for whomever says they will do that.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 04:08 pm
@McGentrix,
I seriously doubt that a single payer system can do much to get costs down, we need a single owner system as well as patent law reform, and maybe liability law reform.

you are not thinking big enough.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 04:12 pm
@hawkeye10,
Maybe get the costs down; maybe not. At least we won't have to be stepping over sick and bleeding bodies to the into the hospitals.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 04:34 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

I seriously doubt that a single payer system can do much to get costs down, we need a single owner system as well as patent law reform, and maybe liability law reform.

you are not thinking big enough.


Ideally, it would be single payer and single employer... We would pay x amount of money as a tax which would be to cover healthcare costs. Dr and Nurses and techs and everyone that works for the healthcare industry would be paid by the government. Yep, they'd all be govt employees unless they wanted to stay as a private Dr. accepting cash or trade or barter or whatever.

The Govt would own hospitals, clinics, etc and they would buy equipment and medicine and every single thing associated with healthcare. One stop shopping. You get sick, you go to hospital, get what you need and leave. No bills, no hassle. You already pay through taxation.

You would need to be a tax payer though and you would need to actually be a payer... I don't believe the system would be able to afford subsidies though. Some things may cost additional though like elective surgeries and breast implants etc. Insurance shouldn't pay for that.

That's what I think anyways.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 04:51 pm
@McGentrix,
one of the major killers of the current system is that so much revenue is devoted to paying off stakeholders. we should be able to provide care with fewer people, and if we would stop profit taking we would save a ton of money. I dont see why we could not put non profit NGO's to work managing a government owned system using mechanisms that have long been in place to manage utility systems.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 05:37 pm
@hawkeye10,
The Obama-disaster news conference
BY JENNIFER RUBIN

Quote:
Obama’s answers were long, rambling and at times hard to understand. What is clear is there is no arguing Obamacare can’t be touched or that this administration knows what it is doing. It was a remarkable confession about his own and the federal government’s ineptness, a virtual ad against big government — especially ones dependent on IT procurement. In admitting this was about shifting blame to insurers, he made crystal clear that his conduct is and has been about damage control, not permanently fixing an unworkable bill. He certainly gave satisfaction to Republicans who have been making many of these arguments all along. And it will no doubt convince Democrats to run as fast and as far as they can from this hapless president.
Having rolled back his promise that the Web site will be running 100 percent by the end of the month and conveying that the law is likely to change some more, he has given people a disincentive to sign up on the exchanges, which may depress the already meager sign-up numbers.
This is a president adrift, confused and entirely over his head. He has, in essence, confirmed what his harshest critics have long been arguing: he is incompetent and unknowledgable about how the world operates. And we have three more years left of this.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2013/11/14/the-obama-disaster-news-conference/?hpid=z2

Yowza, it is looking like the tactic of being so opposed to this law that they shut down the government trying to stop it is going to pay off for R's years before I expected.
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 06:24 pm
The Democrats and Obama are truly spineless...
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 08:20 pm
@panzade,
panzade wrote:

The Democrats and Obama are truly spineless...
when they ramrodded this into law were they spineless then? the problem is incompetence in governing, which has consequences. That Obama is a prick does not help matters, he has ignored congressional relationship building ever since Rahm left, and now he will pay for that neglect. Now that congressional D's see that Obama did not care enough about Obamacare to make sure that it was implemented well they will abandon Obamcare like rats leaving a sinking ship, there is no loyalty built up to stay for.
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 09:19 pm
@hawkeye10,
Obama’s political malpractice

By Ruth Marcus
Quote:
The promise and the apology are the bookends of effective politics. President Obama has, tragically and perhaps irreparably, flubbed both.
.
.

Listening to the president Thursday was painful. He acknowledged the need “to win back some credibility.” He “fumbled the rollout” of health care. He is “letting . . . down” congressional Democrats who took the risk of supporting Obamacare. Although he’s sometimes been “slapped around a little bit unjustly,” the president said, “This one’s deserved, all right? It’s on us.”

Can he recover? I’m sorry to say: I’m not at all confident.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ruth-marcus-political-malpractice-of-the-highest-order/2013/11/14/e6b95abe-4d69-11e3-be6b-d3d28122e6d4_story.html?hpid=z2

When a liberal is talking about a D president this way you know things are going badly.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 15 Nov, 2013 09:22 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

you dont help individuals by systematically impoverishing the nation. inflation adjusted median household income has been going down for ever a decade with no end in site, we cant afford to spend $8k per person per year for medical, much less what it will be after Obamacare. Some people must be told no.

But it's really not just some people, is it? You advocate telling everyone "no" who can't pay. Not all poor people are poor because they lived like fools. Some are poor, even though they did their best, from various forms of bad luck. If a man works hard and loses his job, you want his kids to die from curable diseases because he can't pay. You want elderly people on low fixed income who did their best all their lives to decide between medicine and eating. Far from some societies that respect and care for their ancestors, you want them to die and not ask you for help. It's contemptible.
RABEL222
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Nov, 2013 09:45 pm
@Brandon9000,
I think their called compassionate christians. Or is that conservatives.
0 Replies
 
ldhoffmeister
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 09:05 pm
@hawkeye10,
The only thing that has conservatives peeing in their pants is the 1-3% GDP hit this is going to cause. Can you say "Recession". Thanks Obama.
0 Replies
 
ldhoffmeister
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 09:11 pm
@hawkeye10,
Youth don't have to buy in to make it unaffordable. It already is unaffordable. Many people I know have already gotten letters from their insurers showing their premiums are basically doubling for the same coverage. The lie Pesoli told was this was due to the minimum insurance coverage requirement the law imposes. but that's not true. I took my daughter policy and compared it to what the HC Site was showing for the a Gold Plan which was less than equivalent to her current coverage and the premium was double her current plan.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 10:55 pm
Watch this video!
http://moneymorning.com/ext/obamacare/video.php?promo=163049&src=cb-cpa&pub_id=840163
0 Replies
 
 

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