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New York politicians pushing Scientology

 
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2004 05:54 pm
Hubbard's book "Dianetics" gives adherents the tools to "clear" without spending money. They offer the service at high prices to those unable or unwilling to go it alone (actually with a supporting friend with the same goal).
When I lived alone in Long Beach, CA, for a time I attended their services and read some books. I can only say, in retrospect, that the leaders seem to cause Scientology to have a split personality. Most of what I saw and heard was extremely sane. I only learned later of the unsavory activities of some high ranking members.
Probably the most famous celebrity Scientologist is John Travolta.
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Phoenix32890
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2004 05:56 pm
edgarblythe - Don't forget about Tom Cruise.
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edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2004 06:00 pm
I was unaware of Cruise, an actor I have only watched in two films (Rain Man and Vanilla Sky. I didn't enjoy Vanilla Sky)
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Dartagnan
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2004 06:01 pm
Speaking of the Rajneeshees, we have a brewery in Seattle that makes a "Bhagwan's Best Bitter" which is, of course, an India Pale Ale. And quite good it is, too. The only problem is that I have to explain to some of the youngsters who the Bhagwan was...
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Tarantulas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2004 06:15 pm
IIRC he sent his followers to big cities to grab a bunch of street people and bring them back to Antelope with promises of free food and sex. They established residency and became voting citizens, and pretty soon he had control of the city. Almost like the "Free State" project that's going on now, in a way.
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hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2004 06:25 pm
Is JZ Knight (Ramtha) Still living outside of Tacoma?
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kirsten
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2004 09:53 pm
hobitbob wrote:
Titus wrote:
OK, I'll bite.

What exactly is Scientology?

I've heard about it for years and know it was founded by the sci-fi author, L. Ron Hubbard, but beyond that, I have never been able to learn any details.

Does anyone know what they believe, don't believe, etc.?

A) Humans are physical traps for souls o f aliens who lost in a war millions of years ago.
B) those souls were trapped in a volcano by strange lizardy things.
C) By spending a lot of money on Scientology stuff, you can free yourself from re-incartnations and have sex with Penelope Cruz. Very Happy


Just saw today where Cruise and Cruz have gone their separate ways, because she wouldn't convert. Smart girl!
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littlek
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Mar, 2004 10:03 pm
My aunt is a scientologist. I stayed with her in LA for a month or 2 (was supposed to be a week or 2) after college. I learned some about the whole 'religion'. There are some excellent tenets to it. And the drug detox system seems to work ok, but it ties directly into dianetics and therefore scientology.

Anyway, the suspected methodology is that they get people to divulge THE sensitive personal info that makes them most vulnerable. And then that can be held over their heads if they try to leave. Or sue.

The whole of the population of scientologists in LA seem to run a barter system. Obviously, not everyone can offer a good or service, but if you can, you barter.

This is what I picked up on while out there.
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IronLionZion
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Apr, 2004 12:32 am
They are not "pushing scientlogy." They wrote a letter of support to a group they felt was helping distraught firefighters, which had links to scientology, and it inadvertantly ended up being used to raise funds. Lets be clear on that.

In any case, politicians routinely endorse organizations with strong links to religion, particulary Christianity. It is worth noting that many of the people who are getting their panties in a bunch about this are the same people who don't bat an eye when politicians support pro-Christian groups. It is blatent hypocrisy.

May I venture to ask what your point is, Tarantulas?

Tarantulas wrote:
IIRC Scientology was invented by L. Ron Hubbard after many of his other inventions failed. I think it was Wayne Green who was telling the story of being at Hubbard's house when he came up with the idea for Scientology. You can search for it on the web and find a more accurate description, but basically it assumes that your mind is all screwed up and you need an expert to "clear" you. The treatments cost you money and do you no good at all. There is a science fiction component to it, since Hubbard was a scifi author. The back story talks about a guy named Xenu who murdered millions, and the souls of the dead are inhabiting your body right now.

Scientology is illegal in Germany if I'm not mistaken. And there are stories about people who oppose it and get followed and spied on and persecuted. Anyway, here's a website where you can read what an opponent says:

http://www.xenu.net/

And here's the official website:

http://www.scientology.org/


Heh.

Its funny to watch religious people decrying the absurdity of competing belief systems, when thier own delusion of choice is so patently ridiculous.

See Christianity: Take several non-eyewitness accounts of some obscure events, none of which even remotely agree with eachother, wait 300 years and have a convention of beauracrats in Nicea decide what should and should not be in the good book, rewrite them, expurgate stuff you don't like and make the texts homogeneous, still fail to make texts agree with eachother, sell it by force to all of Europe, kill millions in the process, stifle scientific inquiry for a thousand years, subjucate the native peoples of countless foreign shores, then preach brotherhood, while praying to a baby-killing homophobic egotist.

You cannot attack a politician for having tenuous links to a religious organization while turning a blind eye to Christian politicians who promote thier religious beliefs, and exploit the beliefs of others. That is why its so ridiculous to make a big deal about Schumer and Maloney's feeble - and possibly inadvertant - connections to scientology when other politicians constantly and blatently connect themselves to Christianity.

foxfyre wrote:
It is interesting that there is no outrage here that a U.S. Senator seems to be pushing a religious belief. Would there be no exression of indignant offense if the Senator was Republican?


Your post would be better if a) it made sense b) it wasn't so patently hypocritical. Show me where Schumer or Maloney pushes Scientology. Thanks.
0 Replies
 
husker
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Apr, 2004 09:35 am
D'artagnan wrote:
Speaking of the Rajneeshees, we have a brewery in Seattle that makes a "Bhagwan's Best Bitter" which is, of course, an India Pale Ale. And quite good it is, too. The only problem is that I have to explain to some of the youngsters who the Bhagwan was...


My X-brotherinlaw used to be a Rajneeshee - had to kidnap him off the ranch.
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Apr, 2004 09:38 am
Tarantulas wrote:
IIRC he sent his followers to big cities to grab a bunch of street people and bring them back to Antelope with promises of free food and sex.

Free food and sex? Where do I sign up?
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Apr, 2004 09:50 am
Quote:
Free food and sex? Where do I sign up?

No signup required. It's an informal arrangement. If, very late at night, you head to a park near my place, just follow any of the woodland paths, and when reaching an unemptied trash container, just bend over and help yourself while some else does as well.
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joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Apr, 2004 09:58 am
blatham wrote:
Quote:
Free food and sex? Where do I sign up?

No signup required. It's an informal arrangement. If, very late at night, you head to a park near my place, just follow any of the woodland paths, and when reaching an unemptied trash container, just bend over and help yourself while some else does as well.

Wow, that really brings back some memories. Thanks, blatham!
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Apr, 2004 10:04 am
LOL
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IronLionZion
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Apr, 2004 12:25 pm
I'm still waiting for somebody the explain away the assbackwardness of the allegations being levelled in this thread. Anybody?
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Fedral
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Apr, 2004 01:53 pm
The part about Scientology that they DON'T want you to know:

Many, MANY years ago, during the great Golden Age of Science Fiction, a group a Sci-Fi authors were sitting around late one night (The authors of that era were few and far between and tended to a rather 'tight' community)

Several of the 'Legends' of the field were supposedly present.(Asimov, Heinlein, etc .. no one knows for sure ) But a fairly well respected author by the name of L. Ron Hubbard was present.

During the evening, over many glasses of alcohol, the subject of these well written men turned to the topic of religion.

There were many arguments over just HOW Christianity 'took off' so fast and strong.

Well, to make a long story short, Mr. Hubbard said that all you need is a believable message that people could understand and the people would 'flock to your banner'.

Well, many of the other author there that night disagreed and finally, Mr. Hubbard made a proposition.

He claimed he could start a completely new 'religion' and within 10 years have over 100,000 members/adherents.

The others claimed he was crazy, but he insisted that if they accepted the wager, he would have a group within 10 years that met all the criteria of a 'religion'.

Well, serious money was placed on the table that night and entrusted to a neutral party.

L.Ron Hubbard went out and started Scientology...

Ten years later, Scientology had well over 200,000 worshipers and growing.

He won the bet, but discovered that a few unexpected things had happened:

1) The adherents, took it VERY seriously and didn't want to hear that their belief was part of some 'gentlemens wager'

2) He no longer had any control over the hiearchy of his religion. (The 'True Believers had taken that post over)

3) No one would take him seriously as a Sci-Fi author since he started some sort of 'cult' and thus he was selling no more Sci-Fi books.

4) The followers of his religion threatened 'dire consequences' if he revealed the 'truth' behind it's formation.
.
.
.
.
.

So Mr. Hubbard, accepted a generous cash settlement from his 'Church' as long as he ever commented on Scientology and left the 'Church' completely.

And now you know ... the rest of the story
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Apr, 2004 01:58 pm
fedral

Once again, you do not know what you are speaking of. Where on earth did you read that?
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hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Apr, 2004 02:19 pm
Actually, Blatham, I think he's right.
If you read Larry Niven's "Inferno," there is a veiled reference to the conversation. Very Happy
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Apr, 2004 02:27 pm
hobit

Nah, I have several years of research on this, and though the bet may have taken place, there is no compelling evidence that it did. But his points 1 through 4 are high silliness. Gerry Armstrong is an old friend of mine, though Fedral likely won't know who that is.
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Apr, 2004 02:31 pm
I'm gonna have to pitch in with Fedral and hobitbob on this one.
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