24
   

11/22/63 -- for us old-timers only

 
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 06:01 am
@edgarblythe,
The conspiracy industry is always healthy whenever a tragedy occurs.
I heard a discussion on NPR's "Science Friday" in which two forensic experts in ballistics did exhaustive testing and concluded (from available bullet fragments) that Oswald acted alone and all the wounds from 2 shells are accounted for.
The "third shot" could hve been a miss or an echo
Im not certain whether they found two or three shell csings of that particular calibre
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 06:31 am
@farmerman,
There was an interview yesterday on CBC with a gentleman who wrote a book, the burden of which was basically, "Oswald acted alone, noe get over it." He had every frame of the Zapruder film enlarged and digitally enhanced, and one of the first things he said was that the first shot missed. He gave the relevant frame numbers in sequence of the Zapruder film showing the miss, the "magic bullet" hitting Connally (the lapel of his suit jacket lifts up as the bullet exits), and the frame in which the final shot hits Kennedy.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 12:38 pm
@Setanta,
I remember seeing an analysis done on how the bullet had to travel from the time it entered Kennedy's head. It was impossible for one shooter to have shot Kennedy and Connally.



Setanta
 
  0  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 05:37 pm
@cicerone imposter,
You were misinformed.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 06:32 pm
@Setanta,
From JFK the assassination.
Quote:
The crux of the issue here, concerning the "magic bullet",
is that the alleged gun used by Oswald
CANNOT hit JFK at frame 313 and then
hit Governor John Connally at frame 324
(less than a second later at 18 fps).

The first JFK wound (throat) was before frame 225,
(the Warren Report says wound was between 210-225)
and the last JFK wound in the temple at frame 313.

Oswald theorists claim that 1 bullet accounts for
Connally's hit (frame 324) and JFK's throat (before 225).
Its clear on the video that
Connally was not hit till 5 seconds after JFK's throat wound.


http://www.jfkpage.com/magic_bullet/
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 07:12 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Vincent Bugliosi has completed a massive 1600+ book that's examined everything, and concludes Oswald acted alone, and there was only a single bullet.
http://hnn.us/article/41490

I don't know if it's Bugliosi that Setanta referred to in his last post, but I saw him in at least 2 interviews this week, and his almost microscoptic examination of the evidence, and his attention to detail in doing so, is awesome, and he's most persuasive.
Quote:
"Reclaiming History : The Assassination of President JFK": Interview with Vincent Bugliosi
July 8th, 2012

Vincent Bugliosi's "Reclaiming History: The Assassination of President John F. Kennedy" (W. W. Norton & Company; May 15, 2007) is quite possibly the single greatest book ever written on the tragic events of November 22, 1963 and its aftermath. "Reclaiming History," at 1,648 pages sans footnotes, is more a collection of volumes than one single book on the assassination of President Kennedy.
Included are a 320 page minute-by-minute, hour-by-hour narrative of the tragedy entitled "Four Days in November," as well as a 280 page biography of the assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald.
Along with Larry M. Sturdivan's "The JFK Myths: A Scientific Investigation of the Kennedy Assassination," "Reclaiming History" is the strongest refutation of the conspiracy mythology that has haunted this tragedy for almost 50 years.
This interview was conducted on "The Leonard Lopate Show" on WNYC-Radio in NYC, NY on May 15, 2007. Vincent Bugliosi (born August 18, 1934) is an American attorney and author, best known for prosecuting Charles Manson and other defendants accused of the Tate-LaBianca murders, and for defending Stephanie Stearns in the Sea Wind murders of 1974.
His most recent books are "Reclaiming History: The Assassination of President John F. Kennedy" (2007), "The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder" (2008), and "Divinity of Doubt: The God Question" (2011). NOTE: For some reason I am unable to fathom this video cuts off the last 15 seconds of the interview. Bugliosi ends by saying: "The Los Angeles Times" said that this is a book for the ages and when I wrote the book that was my intent to write a book for the ages and the "Times" says "'Reclaiming History' may finally move those accusations of conspiracy beyond civilized debate. At last someone has done it - put all of the pieces together. It is a book for the ages."
http://shelf3d.com/L9DQ_oM4cQc#"Reclaiming History: The Assassination of President JFK": Interview with Vincent Bugliosi


You can watch the video interview at the above link.


farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 07:28 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Connally was not hit till 5 seconds after JFK's throat wound.
That was long as the entire incident. <aybe you meant 0.005 sec.
The bullet left Kennedy's throat wund and began tumbling and hit Connolly as a series of 3 separate entry points. There was a remaining segment of slug that was able to be compared with the lnds and grooves of Oswald's rifle. THE FRAG WAS FROM OSWALD'S GUN
ossobuco
 
  3  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 07:32 pm
Please, do we have to read all this investigation stuff here again right now?

The black horse.

http://horseandman.com/wp-content/uploads/Caisson-photo2.jpg
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Nov, 2013 08:06 pm
@farmerman,
The "5 seconds" was taken directly from the piece I copied. The URL is the source.

From the same article.
Quote:
Oswald theorists have spent all their lives making this
single bullet from before Zapruder frame 225 match the path of
JFK's throat wound and the back, wrist and leg wounds of
Governor John Connally of Texas.
Yet Governor Connally does not react from his various wounds
until after frame 324, over 5 seconds later (18 fps).
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 02:10 am
@cicerone imposter,
You are being misinformed.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 05:30 am
@Setanta,
Yeh, its Conspiracy Inc at worst and its a misquote at best.

CI, just by common sense. After a bullet in Owalds gun left the barrel it was travelling at almost 3000 feet per second. Time between a shot , damage to Kennedy-s nck, and then Connaly being 5 seconds apart is unbelievable . The bullet hd lost little energy after it left Kennedy's neck so even at2/3 the speed it would be trvelling at almost 2000 feet per second that's about 10000 feet in 5 seconds. Where did it go to pend that 10000 feet of energy?

REMEMBER , forensics has determined from bullet frags that the neck wound and Connaly's wounds were all from 1 bullet (the ballistics showed that and the entry and exit wounds confirmed that).

Theres lots of mistaken information about Kennedy and real conclusions , based upon modern analyses of film and ballistics and path analyses have fairly cleared up the FOG that the various conspiracy tales have made.
Im certainly no expert on anything relevant but were I on the jury to consider who goes to jail, Id be able to intelligently deliberate with the latest data from forensics
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 05:42 am
@Rockhead,
Rockhead wrote:

I'm too short for this ride...

but I was old enough to know tricky dick was really a crook.
Yes; as a Quaker, he secretly harbored anti-gun sentiments
and in his 2nd Administration (immune from losing the next election),
he was going to attack and subvert our 2nd Amendment rights to carry guns,
but for some reason, he was distracted.

Jerry Ford did not feel that way.





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 05:45 am
@ossobuco,
ossobuco wrote:
I was at the counter at Leed's shoe store, buying fetching tiny heel shoes,
now called.. kitten. The radio above the counter said what was happening. I paid and got out of there.

I walked back to campus.
Were u wearing the shoes ?
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 06:10 am
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
Vincent Bugliosi has completed a massive 1600+ book that's examined everything,
and concludes Oswald acted alone, and there was only a single bullet. . . .
Yes, for sure, but he fired thrice and hit Kennedy twice
(if I remember correctly); very accurate shooting.
The conspiracy claims were all a lot of foolishness.

The best and most thorough analysis, a visually demonstrated dissection of events
was rendered by the History Channel; it was fully definitive n dispositive.





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 06:17 am
@Lustig Andrei,
Lustig Andrei wrote:
Every year, it seems, on this date somebody posts a thread on this subject.
This year nobody seems to have done so yet, so I nominate myself to ask - -

Where were you on Nov. 22, 1963 when they plugged JFK in Big D?
I was out on Long Island, NY. I had witnesses. My alibi was solid.
Toward the end of November 1963, my friends were greeting me
by asking: "Just get back from Dallas ? "





David
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  3  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 10:49 am
Many people don't think, or remember, much about the fact that Lee Harvey Oswald killed two men on 11/22/63.

The widow of the other man killed--police officer J.D. Tippit--this week, for the first time, publicly shared the extremely gracious and compassionate letter of condolence she received from Jacqueline Kennedy.
Quote:
Almost 50 years ago, two strangers were forever linked by an unspeakable tragedy.

On the afternoon of Nov. 22, 1963, first lady Jackie Kennedy watched helplessly as her husband died at her side. President John F. Kennedy had been traveling with her through the streets of Dallas in a presidential motorcade, when 24-year-old Lee Harvey Oswald is believed to have shot him.

But Kennedy wasn't the only victim that day. As the alleged murderer fled the scene, a heroic police officer named J.D. Tippit intercepted him. Oswald shot Tippit four times, killing him on the spot and leaving yet another woman a widow.

As her husband's and Kennedy's death anniversary approaches, Marie Tippit, now 85, has opened up about the sorrow that brought her and Jackie Kennedy together -- and how the former first lady comforted her in her time of grief.

In an interview with NBC Nightly News, Tippit described how Kennedy wrote her a moving letter in the days after their husbands' deaths. The handwritten note reads:

Dear Mrs Tippit,

What can I say to you - My husband's death is responsible for you losing your husband. Wasn't one life enough to take on that day?

I lit a flame for Jack at Arlington [Cemetery] that will burn forever. I consider that it burns for your husband too and so will everyone who ever sees it.

With my inexpressible sympathy, Jacqueline Kennedy


According to NBC Nightly News, this is the first time the heartbreaking letter has been shown to the public.

"That's the thing that you always want," Tippit told the news outlet of Kennedy's gesture. "That somebody can just understand how you feel -- and she did. She recognized that I was suffering too and isn't that wonderful? That we had a First Lady who was so caring for everyone."

After her husband's death, Tippit, who is now a great-grandmother, was left alone to care for her three children. Life has been challenging without him, she says.

"It’s been so much more difficult not to have J.D. there so I could depend upon him," she recently told the Daily Mail. "I miss him terribly. He was a hero. To me a hero is how he lived his life every day."

According to the Associated Press, Dallas police say they will be paying tribute to J.D. Tippit this month in commemoration of the 50th anniversary of his death. Police badges bearing his name, number and date of death will be on sale this month.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/11/20/jackie-kennedy-letter-widow_n_4311773.html

panzade
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 11:42 am
@firefly,
Thanks for reminding us about officer Tippit.
He was gunned down in cold blood in front of many witnesses.
When six policemen cornered him in the Texas theater he pulled his pistol and tried to kill them. Luckily one officer grabbed the cylinder so it wouldn't fire.Officer McDonald then hit Oswald in the face with the butt of his pistol

Oswald said "Well, it is all over now."

Another man just missed being assassinated before that morning in Dallas.
Quote:
In March 1963, Oswald purchased a 6.5 mm caliber Carcano rifle by mail-order, using the alias "A. Hidell",[79] as well as a .38 Smith & Wesson Model 10 revolver by the same method.[80]

The Warren Commission concluded that on April 10, 1963, Oswald attempted to kill retired U.S. Major General Edwin Walker, firing his rifle at Walker through a window, from less than 100 feet (30 m) away, as Walker sat at a desk in his home; the bullet struck the window-frame and Walker's only injuries were bullet fragments to the forearm.[81] (The United States House Select Committee on Assassinations stated that the "evidence strongly suggested" that Oswald carried out the shooting.)[82]

General Walker was an outspoken anti-communist, segregationist, and member of the John Birch Society. In 1961, Walker had been relieved of his command of the 24th Division of the U.S. Army in West Germany for distributing right-wing literature to his troops.[83][84] Walker's later actions in opposition to racial integration at the University of Mississippi led to his arrest on insurrection, seditious conspiracy, and other charges. He was temporarily held in a mental institution on orders from President Kennedy's brother, Attorney General Robert Kennedy, but a grand jury refused to indict him.


It seems odd that he would miss Walker from 100 ft and yet hit Kennedy twice from 200 feet
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 11:46 am
When I used to do some shooting, I made some incredibly good shots, followed by some incredibly bad or at least not as good, shots.
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 11:49 am
@edgarblythe,
...there ya go edgar
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Nov, 2013 12:58 pm
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
Many people don't think, or remember, much about the fact that Lee Harvey Oswald killed two men on 11/22/63.

The widow of the other man killed--police officer J.D. Tippit--this week, for the first time, publicly shared the extremely gracious and compassionate letter of condolence she received from Jacqueline Kennedy.
Quote:
Almost 50 years ago, two strangers were forever linked by an unspeakable tragedy.

On the afternoon of Nov. 22, 1963, first lady Jackie Kennedy watched helplessly as her husband died at her side. President John F. Kennedy had been traveling with her through the streets of Dallas in a presidential motorcade, when 24-year-old Lee Harvey Oswald is believed to have shot him.

But Kennedy wasn't the only victim that day. As the alleged murderer fled the scene, a heroic police officer named J.D. Tippit intercepted him. Oswald shot Tippit four times, killing him on the spot and leaving yet another woman a widow.

As her husband's and Kennedy's death anniversary approaches, Marie Tippit, now 85, has opened up about the sorrow that brought her and Jackie Kennedy together -- and how the former first lady comforted her in her time of grief.

In an interview with NBC Nightly News, Tippit described how Kennedy wrote her a moving letter in the days after their husbands' deaths. The handwritten note reads:

Dear Mrs Tippit,

What can I say to you - My husband's death is responsible for you losing your husband. Wasn't one life enough to take on that day?

I lit a flame for Jack at Arlington [Cemetery] that will burn forever. I consider that it burns for your husband too and so will everyone who ever sees it.

With my inexpressible sympathy, Jacqueline Kennedy


According to NBC Nightly News, this is the first time the heartbreaking letter has been shown to the public.

"That's the thing that you always want," Tippit told the news outlet of Kennedy's gesture. "That somebody can just understand how you feel -- and she did. She recognized that I was suffering too and isn't that wonderful? That we had a First Lady who was so caring for everyone."

After her husband's death, Tippit, who is now a great-grandmother, was left alone to care for her three children. Life has been challenging without him, she says.

"It’s been so much more difficult not to have J.D. there so I could depend upon him," she recently told the Daily Mail. "I miss him terribly. He was a hero. To me a hero is how he lived his life every day."

According to the Associated Press, Dallas police say they will be paying tribute to J.D. Tippit this month in commemoration of the 50th anniversary of his death. Police badges bearing his name, number and date of death will be on sale this month.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/11/20/jackie-kennedy-letter-widow_n_4311773.html
Good work, Firefly.





David
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

HAPPY ANNIVERSARY, EVERYONE! - Discussion by OmSigDAVID
WIND AND WATER - Discussion by Setanta
Who ordered the construction of the Berlin Wall? - Discussion by Walter Hinteler
True version of Vlad Dracula, 15'th century - Discussion by gungasnake
ONE SMALL STEP . . . - Discussion by Setanta
History of Gun Control - Discussion by gungasnake
Where did our notion of a 'scholar' come from? - Discussion by TuringEquivalent
 
Copyright © 2021 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.04 seconds on 05/08/2021 at 03:38:14