40
   

Is free-will an illusion?

 
 
Johnjohnjohn
 
  0  
Reply Fri 11 Dec, 2015 06:12 pm
@MoralPhilosopher23,
I couldn't be an atheist. I dont have enough faith.

Having faith in soemthing being read off of being told things and reading things that seem logical rather than having personal experiences with God.

I don't know how you achieve a faith that high Laughing
0 Replies
 
Briancrc
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Dec, 2015 06:24 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
I'm talking about macro-economics. There's a huge difference of choice between some individual living in a third world culture vs developed contemporary ones. Having the wherewithal to travel the world vs an individual living in a third world culture have considerable differences in choice.


Yes, there certainly are differences between penurious and wealthy nations, but what is your point as it relates to free will?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Dec, 2015 06:28 pm
@Briancrc,
Free will entails all of the possibilities of human activity. Economics has much to do about the ability to participate in activities that are based on the ability to pay for them.
Olivier5
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2015 02:12 am
@ossobuco,
We used to get along. I don't what bee got in his bonnet.
martinies
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2015 03:18 am
@Olivier5,
Objects are illusion reality is the relativity that exists between the objects in the illusion. N thats ya consciousness.
0 Replies
 
Ragman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2015 07:17 am
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Naw, I'm more Irish than Italian. My name is taknamara.

Ahaha! good one! Keep the sunny-side up.
0 Replies
 
martinies
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2015 10:18 am
@Olivier5,
An observer in an illusion cant be moving in that illusion.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2015 02:53 pm
@martinies,
Are you an observer? What are you doing on a2k?
martinies
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2015 06:07 pm
@cicerone imposter,
The same as you I presume. Answering a question about illusion with an answer about illusion. What is your purepose if you have one.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2015 06:16 pm
@martinies,
There are many forms of illusions. I'm curious to find out if you live in it, and what form(s) you experience from it/them.
martinies
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2015 07:41 pm
@cicerone imposter,
For there to be illusion there has to be an observer in that illusion that is not of the illusion. If the illusion is physics its self the observer cant be a part of physics to know that the physics is illusion. Free will then must be free will of spirit outside of physics . Spirit being consciousness as conscience. So free conscience is free will.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2015 07:51 pm
@martinies,
First of all, one must be correct in what is being experienced is not an illusion. Who determines whether it is or isn't?
martinies
 
  1  
Reply Sun 13 Dec, 2015 02:02 am
@cicerone imposter,
Spirit is singular and a singular thing cannot be a split moving thing . So from this moving things are illusion relative to the unmoving singularity of spirit which is in its self the relativity in the moving changing illusion . Consciousness is spirit so spirit is relativity or nonlocality. All locality being illusion to the nonmoving nonlocal spirit. The collapse of the wave function in quatum physics shows this.
0 Replies
 
martinies
 
  1  
Reply Sun 13 Dec, 2015 02:37 am
@cicerone imposter,
The changing thing can only be determined as an illusion by an observation as being unmoving. The observation its self must be determined as unmoving such as the observation of c the speed of light as being a constant in all moving changing reference frames of physics.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 13 Dec, 2015 03:13 pm
@martinies,
Nothing is static; the observer or the observed.
martinies
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2015 05:11 am
@cicerone imposter,
Its how you define the identity of the observed that makes them the observer moving or static. I would define the observer as the measurer as consciousness. And I would define consciousness as being nothing or the relativity that a moving thing has by its nature under light speed.
martinies
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2015 05:35 am
@martinies,
Or to put it another way the consciousness of the observer exists independent of the brain and is the static measurer as meta relativity in the event. Or a universal meta referenc frame to all phisics. The status of physics is then illusion relative to the meta frame of consciousness.
Briancrc
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2015 06:13 am
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Free will entails all of the possibilities of human activity. Economics has much to do about the ability to participate in activities that are based on the ability to pay for them.


Personal limitations due to political or economic conditions are important in a general sense, but I think other factors deserve credit as an account for why a person behaves in a given way. This is not to say that politics or economics don't have an important role to play. They certainly do. But if you look within any given political, social, and economic system, people are behaving (I.e., doing things) for reasons. The question is whether you believe that the person behaves for reasons that transcend one's biology and experiences.
martinies
 
  0  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2015 07:03 am
@martinies,
Consciousness dosnt have a frame of reference because consciousness is its self a reference frame.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Dec, 2015 12:16 pm
@Briancrc,
That's goes into psycho analysis.
 

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