Atheist Discussion

I think that more Christians believe out of shame or fear than do out of true belief. That's sad

I think they do it out of habit. Unthinkingly. Even sadder.

Well, my wife was initially led to christianity because she didn't want to be wrong. She said (and I think I mentioned this in another thread) that she could handle hell for herself, but she didn't want the kids to be dammed because she didn't take them to church. She's since gotten over that.

She's very much the type to want to see something, to touch something, to believe in it. No imagination (her words) and one must admit that believing in any form of religion does take some imagination.

Marat's Liturgy
from Marat/Sade

Remember how it used to be
The kings were our dear fathers
under whose care we lived in peace
and their deeds were glorified
by official poets
Piously the simpleminded breadwinners
passed on the lesson to their children
Chorus:
The kings are our dear fathers
under whose care we live in peace
The kings are our dear fathers
under whose care we live in peace

And the children repeated the lesson They believed it
as anyone believes
what they hear over and over again
And over and over again the priests said
Our love embraces all mankind
of every color race and creed
Our love is international and universal
we are all brothers every one
And the priests looked down inro the pit of injustice
and they turned their faces away and said
Our kingdom is not as the kingdom of this world
Our life on Earth is but a pilgrimage
the soul lives on humility and patience
at the same time screwing from the poor their last centime
They settled down among their treasures
and ate and drank with princes
and to the starving they said
Suffer
suffer as he suffered on the cross
for it is the will of God
And anyone believes what they hear over and over again
so the poor instead of bread made do with a picture
of the bleeding scourged and nailed up Christ
and prayed to that image of their helplessness
And the priests said
Raise your hands to heaven bend your knees
and bear your suffering without complaint
Pray for those who torture you
for prayer and blessing are the only stairways
which you can climb to paradise
And so they chained down the poor in their ignorance
so that they couldn't stand up and fight their bosses
who ruled in the name of the lie of divine right

I saw some interesting results from a poll on the Globe and Mail news site the other day:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/GIS.Servlets.Page/document/polls/pollResults?id=25031&pollid=25031

Where are these people? I want to go there. It would be nice to not be in the minority.

Those results made my face go

Inasmuch as the Globe and Mail is a Toronto newspaper, i would suggest the answer to your first question is Canada. As for the second statement, they'll boot ya out after six months, unless you get a residency permit, which you cannot do while in Canada. Toronto is a nice place, although it is not that consideration which makes me say as much. It is also a very, very diverse city, in terms of ethno-demography.

Is there that much of a difference in religious (or non-religious) beliefs just across the border? What is going on in this country (US)?

I have also seen some statistics and reports from Europe that do support a trend, if not towards atheism, then at least away from Christianity.

Why is this (in my opinion) enlightenment not happening in the US? Or, is it happening here, but we are being told that it isn't - to protect what?

Somebody please make some sense of this for me. I'd like to believe that people are using their heads, questioning religious authority. I'd like to believe that people aren't buying 'snake-oil' just because some unqualified schmoe tells them it's good for them.

Whoa - calm down Sparky!

I just get the feeling that someone is manipulating numbers somewhere. I'd like to know where. (Conspiracy theorists - insert opinions here)

I don't believe you can judge on the strength of voting on a single website. I would wager the Canadians believe at about the same ratio most Americans do.

Okay, I can buy that. I tend to forget sometimes that these polls are not scientific - they are based strictly on the type of people that would frequent the particular site. I guess I'm the type of person that would frequent this particular site.

I'm not sure if that makes me feel better or not...... Nope - indifferent at best.

Our kind will take over stewardship of the Earth deep in the future, sparky; that is, if there is going to be any.

truth
Deep in the future, Edgar? This seems to be Roddenbury's (sp?)notion. Have you noticed that all the T.V. and movie Startrek series make no room for chaplains and chapels on their spacecraft?

I hadn't thought about it, but, you are right. Of course I haven't watched Startrek in about 15 years, so that could help explain it.

Ahhnck! Sorry, all Star Trek references must be taken to the TV room.

Actually, Roddenberry covered a lot of religious themes, he just 'secularized' the Earth's military/exploration branches.

Oh no, I'm going geek. Please... stop... me......

It just wouldn't fit together with the transporters (beam me up Scotty) things, and the omnipotent Q, etc!

If Startrek had incorporated the idea of the "Big Giant Head" I might have kept watching.

I am new to this forum. I am just watching some of the debeate before I really get stuck in.

Just a thought, Isn't atheism just as much of a belief system or 'religion' as any of the others?

Did anyone celebrate World Atheists day? it was held on April 1st

I heard this one qoute the other day and it made me laugh, it goes like this....ooooh I feel some controversy coming along......no but seriously.....it goes something like this....

"The only person to judge more than a protestant is an Atheist" or something like that....I found it kinda funny.....

BINGO!

horsesh*t . . . there certainly are those who claim to be atheist, but who in fact have a belief system little distinguishable from atheism . . . but that doesn't mean they are correct to describe themselves as atheists . . .