How can we be sure?

@JLNobody,

Well I'm SURE that we all need air , water and energy ( food ) to continue to exit

1 Reply

@north,

How? Just because it has always been a certain way doesn't mean it will always be that way. We could evolve.

1 Reply

@MWal,

MWal wrote:

How? Just because it has always been a certain way doesn't mean it will always be that way. We could evolve.

Good point, but we can only evolve if we can change the relentless trend that made the world the way it is.

1 Reply

@StumbleUpon,

StumbleUpon wrote:

I think we can never be sure without clear restrictions.

Wrong, the only we can be sure about anything is to experience it ourselves with a clear unbiased mind.

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@Rickoshay75,

I hear you

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@Raishu-tensho,

The very fact that humans exist to describe what sound is, it exists. If no living thing has the sense of sound, it doesn't matter.

Sound can be measured; it exists.

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@Lustig Andrei,

The obsessive, maybe neurotic, insistence on absolute certainty regarding questions of existence, morality, beauty, etc is not useful, and represents more of a neurotic psychological need than an actually important philosophical question.

Hume showed we cannot have absolute certainty about most things, but can infer things through experience, habit, etc. Although we cannot have complete certainty about reality, we can say we have "reliable knowledge" that enable us to function in the world.

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@tsarstepan,

tsarstepan wrote:

Setanta wrote:

How can we be sure? We can't. Most of us don't bother about that, though.

Tape recorder or digital sound recorder wired to a motion sensor. Tree falls. The movement trips the motion sensor. Sound recorded. Proof that when a tree falls in the woods, it does make a sound. This question is finally retired to the Hall of Really Stupid Questions.

I agree. Sound is independent of an entity which has a sensor to hear. I think people trip over this because we are ego-centric and assume that the ear is necessary for sound to exist. It comes down to definition. If you want to assume that an entity is necessary then you will come to the conclusion (wrongly) that no sound is produced. Because the definition being used is flawed.

Where ever there is a vibration there will be sound. Even if this vibration occurs within a vacuum there is sound. The only difference is there is no particles within the vacuum to absorb the vibration. But sound is still produced. If you attach an object such as a wire to the vibrating object the sound will travel down the wire and if you have a listening device at the other end it will pick up the sound.

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@Raishu-tensho,

"If a tree falls in the middle of a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?
According to philosophy, it makes no sound because there is no one to hear it, but according to science, it makes a sound because of the vibrations of the tree hitting the earth (probably a lot more complex, but that is off topic).
My question is, is anything certain? Can we be sure of an outcome merely because it has been done? Or because logic dictates such? Is there any real truth to it, or can that not be decided?"

I go with science because the other would infer or at a minimum suggest human hubris.

Here's a few questions that I think is more important. How do you live your life in direct correlation to the things and people around you? Do you live your life with a well being attitude and if so why? How do you make judgements? How do you choose what you eat, drink and who and why you love and hate? What makes you laugh and what brings you sorrow?

1 Reply

It all depends on how you choose to define your terms. "Sound" can be defined in such a way as to make "yes" the answer, and redefined to make "no" the answer. This question appears to be "deep", but it is not. The source of the confusion is simply an imprecise use of language.

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@argome321,

argome321 - I like your challenging questions. How should be live? How can we flourish and make our lives valuable to ourselves and others?

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@Raishu-tensho,

No , we certainly can't be sure of anything. When applying Einstein's relativity theory to the philosophy field, we see every entity or property is defined by relatively comparisons to every other entity or property excluding itself, in other words, we are trying to find the relationship between objects to give a primitive meaning of the object. So nothing is really certain. As I recall a proverb from the ancient time, "the only certainty in the universe is uncertainty", and we are also not ignoring the fact that the state of each entity or property can be evolved over the time.

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@Jack Yen,

Quote:

"the only certainty in the universe is uncertainty", and we are also not ignoring the fact that the state of each entity or property can be evolved over the time.

Can we be certain about that?

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@Jack Yen,

Jack Yen wrote:

No , we certainly can't be sure of anything. When applying Einstein's relativity theory to the philosophy field, we see every entity or property is defined by relatively comparisons to every other entity or property excluding itself, in other words, we are trying to find the relationship between objects to give a primitive meaning of the object. So nothing is really certain. As I recall a proverb from the ancient time, "the only certainty in the universe is uncertainty", and we are also not ignoring the fact that the state of each entity or property can be evolved over the time.

I only believe theories I can prove to myself, not words, charts, or documentations, demonstrations for all to see, not just the elite few.

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@Raishu-tensho,

Animals can convert vibrations on their ears into sound. Maybe they heard it? Your question is based on a technicality. Vibrations in the ear and the hair cells act together to make what we call sound. I'm sure there are other ways to interpret sound that we have not thought of. This is just how humans define sound because this is all we know.

To answer your question, no, I don't believe we'll ever be sure of anything because life can be viewed in so many different ways that it is impossible to know it all about anything. Even the biggest scientific advancements will still never be known for sure because everything is always changing. Theories will always change because we will advance even further and add to them and sometimes change them entirely. External things will change as well and re-write our theories for us.

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@Raishu-tensho,

Raishu-tensho wrote:

If a tree falls in the middle of a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?
According to philosophy, it makes no sound because there is no one to hear it, but according to science, it makes a sound because of the vibrations of the tree hitting the earth (probably a lot more complex, but that is off topic).
My question is, is anything certain? Can we be sure of an outcome merely because it has been done? Or because logic dictates such? Is there any real truth to it, or can that not be decided?

What is certain is existence; our existence based on a question given and based on responses given.

How do you wrap your head around this " sure " question if your question was responded to?

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@Raishu-tensho,

False about both philosophy and science.
The question revolves around the fact of multiple exclusive meanings.

William James told the story of a group of hunters in the forest. One of the men sees a squirrel on a tree, and the squirrel sees him. The squirrel scrambles to the opposite side of the tree from the man. The man circles the tree, and the squirrel cautiously stays on the opposite side of the tree from him, and around and around they go, The other hunters disagree. One says the man goes around the tree and the squirrel, and another objects that the man goes around the tree, but not the squirrel. They turn to James to get the opinion of a philosopher. "It's all a matter of defining your terms," James answers. "If by 'going around' you mean 'going east, south, west, north, east, etc.,' then the man certainly goes around the squirrel. But if by 'going around' you mean 'going from side to back to side to belly to side, etc.' then the man does not go around the squirrel."

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@Lustig Andrei,

There is no such medieval discussion.

Nor is your analysis sound. You write poorly and that probably reflects an original sloppiness of thought.

"William James told the story of a group of hunters in the forest. One of the men sees a squirrel on a tree, and the squirrel sees him. The squirrel scrambles to the opposite side of the tree from the man. The man circles the tree, and the squirrel cautiously stays on the opposite side of the tree from him, and around and around they go, The other hunters disagree. One says the man goes around the tree and the squirrel, and another objects that the man goes around the tree, but not the squirrel. They turn to James to get the opinion of a philosopher. "It's all a matter of defining your terms," James answers. "If by 'going around' you mean 'going east, south, west, north, east, etc.,' then the man certainly goes around the squirrel. But if by 'going around' you mean 'going from side to back to side to belly to side, etc.' then the man does not go around the squirrel."

"

1 Reply

@AugustineBrother,

You're talking to a man who has passed some years ago.
But, let me also add that Andy was one of the most intelligent of posters on a2k for many years. I was lucky to have met him, and call him friend.

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@Raishu-tensho,

The most certain things do not and cannot rest on something else, They are self-evident truths You will never know sureness until you understand that.

0 Replies

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