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Does life truly exist?

 
 
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 May, 2011 01:39 pm
@Fido,
so your saying that if they think your useless, that they just cast you off and get you out of the way?
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 May, 2011 04:09 pm
@hamilton,
hamilton wrote:

so your saying that if they think your useless, that they just cast you off and get you out of the way?
I might have something to say in the matter... Lincoln once volunteered to kill some skunks that were living under a hen house... After one shot he came back and was asked if he got them... He said: I shot one, but he put up such a stink about it I decided to let the rest go...
People wish their lives away to stand their jobs and their lives, but at the end they find they must try to live without the energy and health they need to support themselves, and they have as their reward for a life time of service so many bitter memories of the deal they made: Their souls for their lives; only to find their lives in the end not worth the trade...

People should have the good sense I had and begin their lives retired, and go out of retirement to work until they can get a pension so they don't have to bop till they drop... Leisure, that being: time is the only life worth having or wasting a worry about... There is no reason for so many to work while others watch, or for so many to work so much for nothing... In the time we have had the eight hour workday we have many times multiplied our ability to produce, but it has resulted in everyone who is working working harder for less... If we cannot better control our circumstance we will be free in name only... That is the one advantage primitive peoples all shared in contrast to us... They controlled their society and resources because their technology was ineffective... Our technology is effective, but we work harder than any primitive in the service of it, rather than the reverse...
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Tue 10 May, 2011 06:03 am
@Fido,
i agree. but back to my point, every thing we do is because circumstances alow it. we are nothing but atoms that are in certain shapes and formations. we all are based off of these particles, and really, its not us with personalities, its atoms with personalities.
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Tue 10 May, 2011 06:14 am
@hamilton,
hamilton wrote:

i agree. but back to my point, every thing we do is because circumstances alow it. we are nothing but atoms that are in certain shapes and formations. we all are based off of these particles, and really, its not us with personalities, its atoms with personalities.
To say we are nothing but, which is the exclusion of all things in preference of a single thing is a mistake of reasoning since we are herdly ever in a position to know with certainty the truth of what we say... It is a common expression and nearly always a lie..
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Tue 10 May, 2011 08:12 am
@Fido,
well, you understand what im saying...
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Tue 10 May, 2011 09:03 am
@hamilton,
hamilton wrote:

well, you understand what im saying...
That would be an unreliable presumption on your part; but rest asured I will always try to understand what you are saying, figures of speech aside.. We have to be careful of Cant... What many people say and do not mean, others actually mean, and so, think...
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Tue 10 May, 2011 05:49 pm
@Fido,
besides my figures of speech, and all of that, what do you think of the rest of my statement...?
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Tue 10 May, 2011 07:23 pm
@hamilton,
hamilton wrote:

besides my figures of speech, and all of that, what do you think of the rest of my statement...?
Life is impossible to define (except in gross), and impossible to prove (since we have no objective vantage point from which to view it), so all statements made in regard to it except the most general are meaningless...

I realize the temptation is there to make bold statements about reality, and I tend to do so myself, but the confidence that comes of talking about finite reality is justly missing from talk of infinite reality... If ignorance kept us all as quiet as we are uncertain this would be a silent journey into the unknown... We chatter to hear the noise because it keeps us from the council of our fears....
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 May, 2011 06:07 am
@Fido,
i think that by viewing a human being as nothing but atoms, we are giving ourselves an objective view point.
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 May, 2011 08:44 am
@hamilton,
hamilton wrote:

i think that by viewing a human being as nothing but atoms, we are giving ourselves an objective view point.
If we are in no position to say what life is, exactly, then we are in to position to say what life is not... What you say excludes all answers save your own, and all without a course of detailed study...
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 May, 2011 04:20 pm
@Fido,
but that means im right.
...right?
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 May, 2011 07:05 am
@hamilton,
hamilton wrote:

but that means im right.
...right?
You are a blind man with a hand on an elephant trying to say what the elephant is, and yet, with this elephant: LIFE, we are all the elephant, and all the blind, and everything that lives and breathes and moves...

Life is our universe in a sense that we can no more touch the universe than we can touch upon life... If we reach down and pick up a rock we have a metphore for the universe, and yet to be exact it is the universe, our universe, our life holding the universe... All we have is metphores and words and forms... To say we have captured the thing in itself with our concepts which are not true concepts anyway, is daft...
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 May, 2011 07:57 am
@Fido,
in a materialistic view, i am correct, though.
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 May, 2011 12:24 pm
@hamilton,
If you were in any sense, correct; how would you go about proving it???
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 May, 2011 01:33 pm
@Fido,
just outa curiosity, are you po'd at me? cause i think your awesome, and really dont want to be in that position (no, i am not a pathetic suck up. im just stating my curiosity, and opinion.
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 May, 2011 10:15 am
@hamilton,
hamilton wrote:

just outa curiosity, are you po'd at me? cause i think your awesome, and really dont want to be in that position (no, i am not a pathetic suck up. im just stating my curiosity, and opinion.
Not PO'd at anyone... Actually I would need a running start downhill to get PO'd at anyone... For an old retired Ironworker, I have spent a lot of time reading and writing about philosophy, but I would describe myself as a moralist... I do not think I am particularly logical... A lot of conclusions others may take for granted I am in the habit of questioning... Questionable statements have a way of floating like fat to the top of my soup, so to speak... I was alway given to making general statements when younger, and still often do; but I found myself asking of sweeping conclusions: Is this true... Is this true, usually true, some times true, or true at all... Forget always true, or never because they are both infinite periods and we are finite beings... In the search for reliable truth, everything is in doubt... Is one and one two??? We might say so were it not for the facts of the matter, that while the moral form of numbers finds one in a certain ratio to two, that in fact, no one is like any other... In order to reason we must identify, and these identities are definition and moral forms... How does one identify something as unique to all as life???That is the moral aspect of the forms, because to have these infinites difined, we must do so by agreement, and then what is their true value???How many people every day are killed for justice or injustice enraged??? We very often agree to a definition of infinites to avoid death dealing violence... If we will live it will have to be in the real world rather than in the ideal world... If acceptence of some predicate means we survive another day, then our victory is nearly as complete as imaginable...But there is no such survival hanging on our agreement, and the whole world might agree with your point without it in the least being more true.... To write clearly and make good choices in life one must first be able to discern the truth as well as possible.. As I say, I have read a lot, and I have thought a lot about what I have read... I do not see how what you say could be proved, nor do I see that is obvious... We cannot define life, because it is an infinite... Nor can we see life objectively because we are in it... And life is ultimately what gives meaning to all the stuff of life, so that to ask the meaning of life when life is all, and all we know with- is dafte... Does that over board explanation help???
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 May, 2011 02:55 pm
@Fido,
Fido wrote:

hamilton wrote:

just outa curiosity, are you po'd at me? cause i think your awesome, and really dont want to be in that position (no, i am not a pathetic suck up. im just stating my curiosity, and opinion.
We cannot define life, because it is an infinite...

when the living thing dies and leaves, death goes with it...
hows that for a wise and life changing thought???
thought of it myself.
btw, when you use 3"?"s, it makes me feel that your upset, or something. dont stop, though. dont let me influence your typing skills. im just making an observation.
0 Replies
 
manored
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 May, 2011 01:14 pm
Life is just a word. Since its a word that describes something very vague, different people have quite different opinions of what it means, and discuss it. But in the end they are just discussing meanings of words.
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 May, 2011 05:21 pm
@manored,
manored wrote:

Life is just a word. Since its a word that describes something very vague, different people have quite different opinions of what it means, and discuss it. But in the end they are just discussing meanings of words.
Hamilton says: Life is nothing but, and you say life is just... I trust both of you actually know enough to say there is something more to life than what seems obvious to either of you... What if we say that life is the expression of will??? It may be that, but how much of life do we see and know in this great cosmos??? We see little and know less, and it does not stop any grand pronouncements from being made... Rather, our ignorance of infinites really make our bold statements seem bold and brave, and that is perhaps, their purpose...
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 May, 2011 06:07 am
@Fido,
please stop preying on my word choice...
 

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