21
   

The end of men

 
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Tue 17 Aug, 2010 10:08 pm
@Eva,
Eva wrote:

We're already working on it, Thomas.

But never fear. We won't get rid of men. We'll always need someone to kill the bugs.


I kill my own bugs.
Eva
 
  1  
Reply Tue 17 Aug, 2010 11:09 pm
Wow. You're one tough bunny.
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Tue 17 Aug, 2010 11:20 pm
@FreeDuck,
FreeDuck wrote:
Thanky, ci. Welcome back yourself.


Hey, FD.

You playing FFB this year? Draft is Saturday:

LINK
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Aug, 2010 03:10 am
@Eva,
Eva wrote:

Wow. You're one tough bunny.



Well, I never break their bones first.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Aug, 2010 03:56 am
@dlowan,
Eva wrote:
We're already working on it, Thomas.

But never fear. We won't get rid of men. We'll always need someone to kill the bugs.
dlowan wrote:
I kill my own bugs.
Thay say that NYC is infested with bed bugs (I 've only seen them on TV),
so maybe u 'll give us a hand.





David
engineer
 
  2  
Reply Wed 18 Aug, 2010 06:27 am
@FreeDuck,
On the overall topic, this post from the other thread still represents my opinion of the article

engineer wrote:
Once upon a time a capable man had every chance to succeed, a capable woman less so. Slowly we are reaching the point where a capable person has every chance regardless of whether that person is a man or a woman. That may mean more competition for men, but that doesn't mean "woe is Man". The pendulum is not swinging so that men are discriminated and capable men are denied jobs in place of less capable women. I think this article is really just an observation that men no longer have as much of a gender advantage as they historically did and that we can envision a day where there is no advantage.


I've seen articles like this before that use a poorly explained statistic as a basis for a doomsday scenario: Men are more impacted by this recession than women. True, but this is exactly what you would expect because the older end of the workforce is overwhelmingly male, so early retirements and the continued erosion of manufacturing jobs will hit men much harder. I seriously doubt that men in their twenties are disadvantaged to women in their twenties with similar education. What we should expect is that instead of a workplace predominately occupied by men, we should expect more balance in the future.

I think that 40 years ago, people who were less inclined either through choice or ability to pursue higher education had outlets. For men, it was blue collar jobs and for women, it was the home. (In fact, often for women the home was the only choice.) Several things have come along to shift that equation. First, blue collar jobs are becoming more scarce. Second, manufacturing jobs that used to be designed for a strong, 200 lb man (with the idea that when you wore him out, there were plenty more behind him) are now being designed to be done comfortably by a 100 lb woman. This opens up a lot of jobs for women that they might have not considered in the 70's. Finally, just as men are losing their outlet, women are losing theirs as well. Many women are being forced into the workplace as more households require two incomes, as divorce rates rise and as men's job stability becomes more tenuous. Those blue collar jobs that were once pretty much only for men are now supporting both sexes. That doesn't mean that men are doomed, only that they have competition where once they had a free ride. Still, it is worth noting that a good number of women remove themselves from the workplace when they start families. Of the dozen or so dual career couples that started work here about the same time I did, over half are now single career couples. Part of this is having the financial wherewithal to do it, but this is still a place where men have a systemic advantage in the workplace, one that carries over throughout a career.

On education, I think young boys as a group might be slightly disadvantaged in elementary school where the ability to sit still and function in groups is key, but I think any advantage girls have here is completely gone by high school where the focus is on individual achievement over group dynamics and where boys have significantly more outlets for their energy. I'd appreciate some educators' views on that if we have any secondary teachers out there.

Finally, I think demographics are in our favor as a society. The issue twenty years from now is not going to be mass unemployment, it will be a surfeit of jobs. As baby boomers retire and leave the market, we are not replacing them fast enough. I think we will be thankful that we have a hard working, educated female workforce available in the future and that those who work hard will be able to find suitable work regardless of their sex.
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Aug, 2010 06:49 am
@engineer,
Well said, engineer. This line:
Quote:
That doesn't mean that men are doomed, only that they have competition where once they had a free ride.

is what I said to myself when I first read the article. I don't think we're anywhere near "the end of men".

I'm still concerned about the education styles but, ironically, it's my daughter that I'm concerned about as she's the one who can't sit still. (We have a bit of a gender reversal in our house with respect to learning styles.) If what you say is true, and it all balances out in high school, that's a relief. Guess I'll wait and see.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  2  
Reply Wed 18 Aug, 2010 06:50 am
@Thomas,
Thomas wrote:

I'm concerned where this is all headed. Will they let women program computers next?

They're working on the Y chromosome deletion program as we speak...
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Aug, 2010 06:52 am
@Ticomaya,
Ticomaya wrote:

FreeDuck wrote:
Thanky, ci. Welcome back yourself.


Hey, FD.

You playing FFB this year? Draft is Saturday:

LINK

Well now there's a temptation...
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Aug, 2010 08:39 am
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

Eva wrote:
We're already working on it, Thomas.

But never fear. We won't get rid of men. We'll always need someone to kill the bugs.
dlowan wrote:
I kill my own bugs.
Thay say that NYC is infested with bed bugs (I 've only seen them on TV),
so maybe u 'll give us a hand.





David



If a bedbug comes anywhere near me, NYC will more likely get my finger!
talk72000
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Aug, 2010 05:18 pm
@FreeDuck,
Quote:
They're working on the Y chromosome deletion program as we speak...


Without the Y Chromosome then the situation could resemble that of the crocodiles where temperature may dictate if the offspring becomes a male or female but will the female sex organ become a cloaca?
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Aug, 2010 12:55 am
@talk72000,
talk72000 wrote:

Quote:
They're working on the Y chromosome deletion program as we speak...


Without the Y Chromosome then the situation could resemble that of the crocodiles where temperature may dictate if the offspring becomes a male or female but will the female sex organ become a cloaca?



No.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Aug, 2010 01:06 am
@dlowan,
Eva wrote:
We're already working on it, Thomas.

But never fear. We won't get rid of men. We'll always need someone to kill the bugs.
dlowan wrote:
I kill my own bugs.
OmSigDAVID wrote:
Thay say that NYC is infested with bed bugs (I 've only seen them on TV),
so maybe u 'll give us a hand.





David
dlowan wrote:



If a bedbug comes anywhere near me, NYC will more likely get my finger!
Ah ha! I am sure that finger woud be lethally employed to the demise of that insect.





David
0 Replies
 
HexHammer
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Aug, 2010 06:30 pm
@FreeDuck,
I belive some of the reason why woman are "in" these days lies partially in marketing and idolizing. Woman has many more choises to be promoted, specially as sexsymbols, where men can't be promoted to the same audience, when sexy men would be considerd gay and are a big nono to the general public.
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Aug, 2010 07:25 pm
@HexHammer,
HexHammer wrote:

I belive some of the reason why woman are "in" these days ....


yeah, we're just a fad.
HexHammer
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Aug, 2010 07:53 pm
@chai2,
chai2 wrote:

HexHammer wrote:

I belive some of the reason why woman are "in" these days ....


yeah, we're just a fad.
I hope you have not taken offence by my views on the matter.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Aug, 2010 08:03 pm
@HexHammer,
Women don't need "marketing and idolizing." Men were attracted to women from before the very beginning of homo sapiens - when they were not marketed.

HexHammer
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Aug, 2010 08:04 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

Women don't need "marketing and idolizing." Men were attracted to women from before the very beginning of homo sapiens - when they were not marketed.
You have misunderstood my post, I'm not talking about sexual attraction for interaction.
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 07:22 am
@HexHammer,
HexHammer wrote:

I belive some of the reason why woman are "in" these days lies partially in marketing and idolizing. Woman has many more choises to be promoted, specially as sexsymbols, where men can't be promoted to the same audience, when sexy men would be considerd gay and are a big nono to the general public.


Hmm, but there's no real gender-wide power in being a sex symbol. If anything, being promoted as a sex symbol could be considered detrimental to the gender at large as most women fall short of such ideals. Certainly it wouldn't translate into a hiring preference or a selection preference for children. I doubt anyone is thinking "I'd like to have a daughter so she can grow up to be a sex symbol".
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 07:30 am
<waves to FD!>

I think we've been deluded by a few thousand years of patriarchal religion into thinking that men were the superior beings. As chai alluded to earlier, there were successful matriarchal societies in the past, and perhaps there will be again. In the meantime I'm just happy that the playing field seems to be evening out a bit.
 

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