The End of Men

@Cycloptichorn,

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don't really play them anymore, because they are superior to practically every other interaction I have. It is addictive - I found myself turning down my friends' offers to do things in real life, because I had more important things to do within the game.

Later on in life, when the technology has improved more, I likely will spend ever-increasing amounts of time in these alternate realities.

If the games affect most men, or women, like that, proliferating their use even more would increase social distancing, with gamers preferring alternate realities to real life relationships.

That's desirable?

Women would want to do this? I doubt it.

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

the issue with video gaming is not that it is solo, because largly it is not, it is that guys are choosing to spend their time competing against other guys in the virtual rather than competing in the more traditional realms of jobs and intellect. According to those who believe in the "men are slackers" theory men are escaping into the virtual, and some will go so far as to say that men are taking the easy road because un held back women are too much competition for men. I am not completely sold, I think it could be that men are rebelling against the feminization of the social and personal life in general and that video games offer something rare....the ability to freely be men and to compete as men against men. It is one of the few remaining ways to see who has the biggest balls, to do a fair test to find our what you are made of. This does however have very unfortunate side effects, as women continue to amass more power by prevailing in the education system and labor market.

1 Reply

@firefly,

firefly wrote:

Quote:
don't really play them anymore, because they are superior to practically every other interaction I have. It is addictive - I found myself turning down my friends' offers to do things in real life, because I had more important things to do within the game.

Later on in life, when the technology has improved more, I likely will spend ever-increasing amounts of time in these alternate realities.

If the games affect most men, or women, like that, proliferating their use even more would increase social distancing, with gamers preferring alternate realities to real life relationships.

The obvious question here is: why do you assume that the relationships people form within games are any different than 'real life relationships?' What is the difference? Why is it important?

Quote:

That's desirable?

Women would want to do this? I doubt it.

Vast numbers of them do seem to feel this way, independent of your doubts. I would posit that these ladies achieve things within the game that they do not outside of it - think on that for a while and you may begin to see the attraction.

I'll finish off by saying that if you don't have any experience with them, you have no real framework for understanding modern online video games and their impact.

Cycloptichorn

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@hawkeye10,

What a load of bull.

Forget the pseudo-sociological analysis. What you are really saying is that men enjoy engaging in pissing contests with each other and gaming gives them bigger, and better, and more exciting pissing contests than they can find in the everyday world and their mundane reality. So they get sucked into this alternate universe where they can stoke their masculine egos unfettered by the real world.

This has nothing to do with women. This is simply, "Boys being boys". And I mean "boys" and not "men".

This has nothing to do with whether men are keeping up with women in the real world, because there is no evidence that that they are not keeping up with them.

But, if men expect to be able to function in the real world, the way they can in a fantasy universe, they will never find any real life satisfactions because reality will never measure up. That's rather sad.

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@firefly,

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What you are really saying is that men enjoy engaging in pissing contests with each other

No, I think men NEED to test themselves against each other, and that the over feminization of life has taken away almost all avenues for men to get what they need.

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But, if men expect to be able to function in the real world, the way they can in a fantasy universe, they will never find any real life satisfactions because reality will never measure up. That's rather sad

I have already posited that video games are a fair fight, that they do tell men what they need to know about their manhood. Men have already figured each other out, this once it takes place it can never be taken away, women not understanding or even worse putting us down as you do changes nothing but to cause us to lose respect for women.

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@firefly,

I agree with the "boy" part. Boys engage in this sort of thing. I know plenty of men that do not and would think it was just a bit insane or ludicrous. I actually give men a bit more credit than to expect they need to compete in this way.

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@Linkat,

Linkat wrote:

I agree with the "boy" part. Boys engage in this sort of thing. I know plenty of men that do not and would think it was just a bit insane or ludicrous. I actually give men a bit more credit than to expect they need to compete in this way.

I don't know about 'need,' but what's wrong with enjoying it?

Video gaming is at heart an intellectual pursuit, with some games being single-player, some collaborative, some cooperative. It is little different than Chess or a game of Football.

I think that dismissing video games as childish in some way would be a mistake on your part; they are anything but childish.

Cycloptichorn

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@Linkat,

Yeah - whatever happened to playing sports? I mean you know my dad worked in an office - he wasn't out hunting bear to feed the family physically proving his prowess and manhood as a provider.
And in his off time yeah - he played games with other men - they were called poker, and basketball and baseball - he went camping and chopped wood to build REAL fires!

This gaming stuff, if anything, is ADDING to the feminization of men. When I was at that nude beach last month - I took my glasses off to go in the water and I had to ask my sister if some of the men were women or men - some of the men had boobs as big as some of the women.

Sitting on their butts playing games is part and parcel of the epidemic of obesity that today's children and young adults are experiencing in record numbers like never before.

Yeah classroom size and diet - okay - how about adding lack of sleep and exercise into the mix? Starting to see a connection anyone?

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@aidan,

aidan wrote:

Yeah - whatever happened to playing sports? I mean you know my dad worked in an office - he wasn't out hunting bear to feed the family physically proving his prowess and manhood as a provider.
And in his off time yeah - he played games with other men - they were called poker, and basketball and baseball - he went camping and chopped wood to build REAL fires!

None of this is incompatible with playing video games, in the slightest - I do all those things you mentioned (with climbing and swimming instead of basketball and baseball).

Something like 25% of online gamers are over the age of 50 - the fact that you can have a satisfying and enriching experience without having to actually trek out to the woods likely presents a great boost to some of these people....

Cycloptichorn

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@Cycloptichorn,

I agree most men do enjoy competition - I have no problem with that - many women also enjoy - but the fake virtual world stuff - most men think it is weird. I also don't have a problem with men, boys or whoever engaging in the virtual world stuff. It is when you become obsessed with it and addicted.

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

To me that is the scary part ( and sad too) - people that do not want to actually experience real life.

Damn I can just smell that campfire and fresh pine trees in my virtual world.

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@Cycloptichorn,

How do you have time to work eight hours a day, play these games - AND exercise?

Or wait - maybe that's why women (like me at least) can't do it. I get up at six - leave the house at 6:50 work all day, get home at 6:30 cook and eat supper, walk my dog, do some laundry - make a few posts here, get my clothes ready for the next day and that's about all I have time for.
I don't have TIME to creat an alternate reality for myself to make me feel like more than what I really am.
And again - I don't need to.

I just hope when you guys have kids - you won't spend their whole childhood playing these games. That'd be really sad.

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@aidan,

aidan wrote:

How do you have time to work eight hours a day, play these games - AND exercise?

Uh, I don't know? I never seem to have a problem fitting everything in - I also cook, garden a lot, spend time with my wife etc., read a novel every week. I guess I don't watch a lot of TV... I also only sleep about 6-7 hours a night, consistently.

Quote:

Or wait - maybe that's why women (like me at least) can't do it. I get up at six - leave the house at 6:50 work all day, get home at 6:30 cook and eat supper, walk my dog, do some laundry - make a few posts here, get my clothes ready for the next day and that's about all I have time for.
I don't have TIME to creat an alternate reality for myself to make me feel like more than what I really am.
And again - I don't need to.

Somehow you seem to have less hours in your day than I do, which is odd. Then again I have several factors which I've planned in my life to increase my amount of fun time - such as a job I can walk to, almost no commute.

And it isn't as if I play all the time - I don't. But I would say I probably play 15 hours a week, sometimes more if it's a good game.

Quote:

I just hope when you guys have kids - you won't spend their whole childhood playing these games. That'd be really sad.

Everything in moderation. I played video games all the time when I was a kid - but also did all the other stuff ya talk about. It isn't harmful in the slightest for kids to do this stuff in moderation.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@aidan,

Quote:

- whatever happened to playing sports

it is now very difficult for men to get together in real life with out women butting in. A lot of women do like to hang out with men, and men no longer feel like they have the right to ask the women to leave, or to otherwise make them feel unwelcome in the attempt to encourage them to leave..

However, since few women want to go online and blow **** up this is one last place for men to congregate, undisturbed by women and their demands to shift to focus towards the feminine.

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@Linkat,

Linkat wrote:

To me that is the scary part ( and sad too) - people that do not want to actually experience real life.

Damn I can just smell that campfire and fresh pine trees in my virtual world.

It's not surprising. The real world, and the restrictions that are placed on one's life by the laws and rules of reality, is quite limited when compared to the options available to one's mind - if you're willing to suspend your disbelief, which is the hard part for a lot of folks. The structure of the games is also designed to give one a real sense of accomplishment, of achievement over time... in a way that many (most) real world endeavors do not.

If you had a virtual world where you COULD smell the campfire and pine trees - would it be wrong to go camping there? We will have to face these questions in the near future, because these things will be a reality soon.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

I'd like to go ahead and point out that my views and Hawkeye's, on this subject, could not be more different - and I don't wish to be associated with his sexism.

Hawk, your dialog is 100% the opposite of the reality of my life. It doesn't describe anyone's life who I know.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

That whole women-ruin-a-good-male-gathering attitude of yours is puzzling. Are you sure you're not homosexual?

I find the He-Man Woman-Hater's Club attitude to be dated, at best.

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

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It doesn't describe anyone's life who I know.

fair enough, but I know quite a few men who video game or take week-end hunting/fishing trips for the very reasons that I allude too. I stand by my position.

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@DrewDad,

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Woman-Hater's

I dont hate women, so your comments dont apply to me...men do need to test their strength though.

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@Cycloptichorn,

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I don't know about 'need,' but what's wrong with enjoying it?

Absolutely nothing is wrong with that. The whole point should be enjoyment.

But Hawkeye is going beyond that by saying these games teach men what they need to know about their masculinity, because he sees the real world as becoming "overfeminized".

Well, what is it that men need to know about their "masculinity" that can only be found in gaming?

Whose standards of "masculinity" are these?

Could it be that the games are feeding an archaic image of "masculinity" that no longer fits in with reality in 2010? Cultures change, gender roles change and expand. Why assume that men have lost something, when, in fact, some degree of "feminization" may have added something to the male persona.

3 Replies

The End of Men

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