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Is There A Life After Death

 
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 04:14 am
LOL!!!!

We do not actually say "shrimp" z!

Just trying to save you from inadvertantly adding to the already great earthly burden of mumbo jumbo with your definitional thoughts, z!
0 Replies
 
zgreatarteest
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 04:48 am
dlowan wrote:
LOL!!!!

We do not actually say "shrimp" z!

Just trying to save you from inadvertantly adding to the already great earthly burden of mumbo jumbo with your definitional thoughts, z!


You are so thoughtful and I appreciate it. If you do not actually
say "shrimp" what do you actually call them? All we hear in the
US of A is mumbo jumbo. If Crocodile Dundee called them
shrimp, how else will I know unless you tell me. What do I know
anyway? Remember?
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 04:57 am
We call them prawns - some things we don't know with more certainty than we don't know other things!
0 Replies
 
zgreatarteest
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 05:41 am
dlowan wrote:
We call them prawns - some things we don't know with more certainty than we don't know other things!


OK, as long as you know what you said. Your over my head with that
line even if you are located down under. I'll read it again after I get
some sleep.

Prawn huh? I have heard of them being called that somewhere. Well,
I make a really great "Shrimp Gumbo" (nothing to do with Mumbo Jumbo).
Crawfish or Crayfish the yankees call them, also known as mud bugs"
make a delicious gumbo. I'll order prawn gumbo the next time I'm in
a resturant and wait for the look on the poor waitress face.

Going to be gone for a couple of weeks. Give us all a rest.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 09:30 am
asherman
This is the first time I have encountered you the Buddhist. I had no idea. I have greatly enjoyed your postings on here.
0 Replies
 
Asherman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 09:55 am
I've led an adventurous life. Traveled widely, read far more. Pondered without end. I've worked at everything from picking cotton to directing government organizations. I've designed and built a bridge from scratch with the help of brawny loggers, and advised NASA about metal processes to be used in the space shuttle. I have been at home on college campuses, and policing gang invested streets. I was a Beat, then a Hippy, and finally a the owner of Corazon. I was a Christian, a Mormon Priest, and finally a Buddhist for over forty years.

As many of you know, I'm a ten foot tall American patriot who supports the Constitution, the elected government, and the U.S. military. I try to write readable and interesting things for people to read, and all of my life I have made pictures. I left the monastic life for living in the mundane world, and seldom regret it. My sons are human beings, and have demonstrated the sort of discipline necessary for success in their various fields. My grandchildren are exceptional, and that isn't just a proud grandfarther talking.
0 Replies
 
Asherman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 10:32 am
In re. Free Will:

If the end is absolutely predictable, then Free Will can not exist. If "Man" is meant to "sin" and "suffer", then no amount of thinking or trying to avoid that end can be effective.

The "Ten Suggestions"? The Bible is filled with direct, unambiguous commands that, if not followed, will result in divine wrath and retribution. However, that is a different thing than Free Will. If an outside force knows and guides the course of events, then the participants (human, or otherwise) have no choice in what they do. The planets have as much free will to leave their orbits arbitrarily as the human has the ability to escape a god dominated future.

You follow the Bible? Which bible, there are many different renderings and there are vast differences in the translations. Some of the most common bibles are translations of translations. The various books were written by different people to suit their own needs and the perceived needs of their tribe and time. The description of God and God's "plan" is inconsistent from one book to another. The New testament is built upon the foundations of the Old ... "I have not come to destroy, but to fulfill". The notions about their being an eternal struggle between God and Satan, Good and Evil, is an innovative notion to Judaism, but can be found in many of the other religions of the ancient world. Almost any thing you can point to in your Bible, can be found in the so-called pagan religions that were wiped out by Christian zeal. Take what you can use, and destroy the rest ... a very Christian notion.

The Bible is like the pronouncements of a Gypsy fortuneteller. There is a text to justify any position you want to take. Each denomination interprets the texts to support their particular doctrine and dogma. You don't belong to one of the larger denominations, but you are a part of a tiny denomination who, together, decide on what your group believes the Bible to mean. My guess is that your study group has a leader, and it's a pretty good bet that the group is strongly influenced by the leader's take on things. If you abandoned all groups, would that make your understanding of the Bible any better? Would your interpretation be right, while all the worlds understanding be wrong?

If you don't believe that other religions are "mumbo-jumbo", then you are admitting that they are as valid as your own religion. If your religion is exclusive, then how can the Buddhists, Hindus, Taoist, Shaman-based religions be anything but wrong?

For the Bunny ....

You are right, I do tend to be rather fixed in my view about the nature of both mundane and Ultimate Reality. I have experienced both. I distain and detest the Abrahamic religions for their heavy handed insistence that the whole world must agree with them. On the other hand, I'm pretty tolerant of all the other religions that I've read about, or come into contact with. They may have the same "mystical" experience as any Buddhists. There are records of even some followers of Abrahm who appear to have experienced Ultimate reality ... most of those were made into martyrs by the intolerance of their own branch of the religion.

In Buddhism, you can directly experience Ultimate Reality without dying, or waiting for some future moment. "Part time" Buddhists are a bit less likely to have this experience than those whose practice is 24/7, but it is known to have happened ... many times over the past couple of thousand years.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 11:22 am
The god of the Bible is a maggot -- and anyone worshipping that barbaric cartoon god should not be mouthing off about other gods.
0 Replies
 
husker
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 11:31 am
zgreatarteest wrote:
husker wrote:
welcome zgreatarteest!
Thank You for sharing.


Thank you husker. One other breath of fresh air. You may
have noticed that I'm a lone ranger. Know any Christians that
to give me some backup?


Me
0 Replies
 
husker
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 11:42 am
Frank Apisa wrote:
The god of the Bible is a maggot -- and anyone worshipping that barbaric cartoon god should not be mouthing off about other gods.


You must be feeling better today frank! :wink:
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 11:55 am
husker wrote:
Frank Apisa wrote:
The god of the Bible is a maggot -- and anyone worshipping that barbaric cartoon god should not be mouthing off about other gods.


You must be feeling better today frank! :wink:


I'm on top of my game, Husker.

Played golf this morning. We are having a gorgeous day here in New Jersey -- and I hit the ball smartly.



Been doing more partying than usual this Christmas season -- and we have another one to go to this evening.


2003 has been a wonderful year for me.

Hope it was for you -- and for everyone else in A2K.

And of course, my best wishes that 2004 will be even better.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 03:21 pm
Asherman
The only bone of contention I ever had with you relates to politics. You consider my stance less than patriotic, I assume. But, we both want the same end result - We just follow a different path.
_______________________________________
To the topic at hand: Life after death is an incomprehensible concept. It just don't play for me at all.
0 Replies
 
Greyfan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 04:53 pm
Zgreatarteest

Sorry to be responding so many pages later to points you made earlier, but this is a quick moving thread. On the other hand, as you will be away for awhile, perhaps your reply will be made many pages later on, if ever.

I've known many people who share your experience of prayer. They are not all Christians. I do believe faith has restorative power, and the benefits for peace of mind -which mirror the benefits of meditation- are fairly well established.

I submit to you, however, that the success of prayer does not establish that anything outside the mind of the prayer is involved. When one is pre-disposed to expect good results, or, to interpret the results as good, God cannot fail.

Example: a busload of pious believers plunges off a cliff. All are killed.

Spin: God called them home; it was their time. (Or, if they belonged to a rival faction, He was showing them the error of their ways.)

Example #2: one manages to survive.

Spin: God was looking out for Him. God answered his prayer.

Do you honestly believe no one else on the bus was praying? I'd bet even a busload of plunging Atheists would have a handful.

The point is, whatever the result, life or death, God passes the test IF you believe in Him, IF you believe everything happens according to His plan.

But it works just as well no matter who or what you think God is, Jehovah, Allah, or a bowl of banana rice pudding. The key, as you say, is faith. Trouble is, it doesn't matter what you have faith in. Try it and see. But, remember, you have to truly believe.

You also said:

Quote:
Mention Jesus Christ and everybody comes unglued. Confirms to me that there is power in that name. You have to be a live God to do that.


I become unglued around Aryans, Klansmen, and Pedophiles too, among others. Does that mean these are true beliefs as well?
0 Replies
 
zgreatarteest
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 08:56 pm
Greyfan wrote:
Zgreatarteest
But it works just as well no matter who or what you think God is, Jehovah, Allah, or a bowl of banana rice pudding. The key, as you say, is faith. Trouble is, it doesn't matter what you have faith in. Try it and see. But, remember, you have to truly believe.

Not gone yet, but I'm packing.
You are right about the above. God is love and Satan is evil. Both
answer prayer. God by grace and Satan by deception. Even Satan
knows God answers prayer and beiieves in the God that created him.
Satan worshipers have been at battle with God a long time. Even they
know He exist and answers prayer. God says, "If you ain't praying to
and believing in Me, then you are praying and believing in the god
of this world (for a while) Satan the Antichrist. Everybody believes in
something. You can set your belief bar and faith as high or low as you
want to a reap what you believe. It's call free will to choose.

There is no death in the God of the Bible, only life. If He takes his hand
off you, Satan will take you out when he is through with you. Good
Christians get killed just like everybody else. There are a lot of reasons
for that. When you finish your bowl of banana rice pudding we might
go there.
0 Replies
 
husker
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 09:03 pm
Our life as always,
will be saved as we are prepared to lose it,
or will be lost as we try to save it.
0 Replies
 
zgreatarteest
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 09:08 pm
husker wrote:
Our life as always,
will be saved as we are prepared to lose it,
or will be lost as we try to save it.


Gee, I hope I'm not the only one that understands and
appreciates that. Thanks, husker.
0 Replies
 
Greyfan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 09:58 pm
zgreat.....

There are none so blind as those who think they see.

You of course are free to apply this thought to me as well.
0 Replies
 
JLNobody
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 10:09 pm
truth
You are wise, Greyfan. Also very patient. How do you persist with Z?
0 Replies
 
zgreatarteest
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 10:09 pm
Greyfan wrote:
zgreat.....

There are none so blind as those who think they see.

You of course are free to apply this thought to me as well.


Thanks. It's up to you about applying that to yourself.
Let's not forget those who really do see and are blind to what
they are looking at.
0 Replies
 
zgreatarteest
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 Dec, 2003 10:16 pm
Re: truth
JLNobody wrote:
You are wise, Greyfan. Also very patient. How do you persist with Z?


Nobody doesn't know?
0 Replies
 
 

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