Why republicans oppose Public Option.

Actually do you know what the biggest entitlement program in history is?

You might have heard of it, I think it's called.......the Bill of Rights.


Americans are ENTITLED to a fair trial.
Americans are ENTITLED to free speech.
Americans are ENTITLED to education.

....and they are ENTITLED to life saving care.

No, not because I said so, because that's what all recent studies have determined.

This is incorrect. The public Option only applies to legal citizens.

Actually a national system will save us money by eliminating the need for duplicate paperwork and eliminating the FOR PROFIT business model.

Are you sure about that?

Insurance denies amputees limbs - Roanoke.com

No....but?

but?

If the answer is NO then your whole point is irrelevant. There is no "but" about it.

Ad hominem:

An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin: "argument to the person" or "argument against the person") is an argument which links the validity of a premise to a characteristic or belief of a person advocating the premise

What does this have to do with anything?

what the DNC does is of ZERO RELEVANCE to whether a public option is a good idea or not.


Again.... relevancy?

And so you're opposed to a way that they can afford it?

Please I implore you to provide a solid argument, right now I am left wanting.

The multi trillion dollar war? Is that what you speak of? No bid government contracts on Cold War era weaponry? Talk about a black hole!

Or perhaps you refer to the billions thrown at BlackXEwater and Halliburton?

Remember, this deficit was on your watch. When your cowboy rode into town, he had a surplus. And can you guess what he did with it?

That's right! He gave it away in 400 dollar sums. Twice! Oh, but the second time was much more... if you had a lot of kids like a good God-fearing family.

The health insurance industry. Again, why are you questioning the invisible hand? You complain about their prices, well their prices are due to the free market! Wouldn't telling them what to to be government interference?

Can't afford it? Get a better job, take responsibility, pull yourself up by your belt and get to work! Stop whining and pay! The FREE MARKET decides the price you are to pay, you insolent peasant! Now cough up your tithing!

How many states do you live in?

Yes, and yours works only on paper. Wall Street prior to the turn of the year is your definition in motion.

Fifty billion dollars swindled... right under your nose. That's gotta be painful (or cause for celebration depending on what side you are on). You wanted a free market? You wanted deregulation. This is your result.

And that spending will come to an end.....unlike Democrat Black Hole Social Programs.

MEDICARE ALONE IS 39 TRILLION IN THE HOLE.......all the military spending throughout the history of the world does not come close to that figure my friend.

He began spending like a liberal.......it was disgusting.........

........so the Democrat answer.........SPEND 10X MORE.............

SO DID YOU ACCEPT IT?.......how about that......

Government is already REGULATING THE HELL OUT OF THE HEALTH INSURANCE INDUSTRY!

ITS WHY ITS SO EXPENSIVE!

50 Billion?......did you mean Trillion my confused friend?

Free markets havent existed in America for 75 years.......

And please take not....MARKETS THAT ARENT OVER-REGULATED....NEVER SUFFER FROM DE-REGULATION!

Where exactly is the Right To Education and the Right to Free Health Care in the Bill of Rights?

Good Gawd...........the 20 million illegal chili-peppers are going to become legal citizens overnight........as soon as Democrats and Obama pass AMNESTY!

More Government = Less Paperwork?

The point is very relevant....the brother of Multi-Millionaire Barack Obama lives in a hut and poops in a bucket.............and you want to talk about morality.

The Priorities of Life from the DNC
1. Taxes
2. Taxes
3. Food
4. Shelter
5. Health Insurance

....perhaps the UNINSURED COULD AFFORD TO BUY INSURANCE......IF GOVERNMENT WOULD QUIT STEALING THEIR MONEY!

It isn't a matter of it's effectiveness, or it's ability to provide health care to the most people at lower costs. The main reason republicans oppose a public option is because it conflicts with their political ideology. their concern is with "socialism" rather than the well-being of lower class Americans.

A study has found that 62% of bankruptcies are caused by medical bills. There are 46 million Americans with no health insurance at all. And what is the republican's solution for this problem? Well, they don't actually have a solution, at all. There really has been no concrete alternative to national healthcare, none. They rant and rave about the evils of national health-care and yet they have posited no solutions themselves. All I hear from talk show radio is McCarthyian scare tactics and paranoia over the "socialism".

This is entirely absurd. The fact that there is even a controversy over whether we should help our fellow Americans is sickening. Make no mistake this is a MORAL ISSUE and to say otherwise is disingenuous. I under stand Obama is trying to make everybody happy (however impossible that is) he needs to make a stand.

I agree with everything you said, Kynaston. As I stated before we are fast becomming a backward nation. What is so strange about this is that their religion and their polities do not agree. Jesus was a socialist and would be a democrate if he was living today. www,freewebs.com/thomascrosthwaite/

I wonder why that could be. It couldn't be the nonstop budget slashing and tax cuts, effectively draining the lifeblood from these options, could it?

Your free market at work. This is what the free market says you should pay for healthcare, who are you to question the invisible hand? I thought this was what you guys wanted. Don't mess with the market and such. Anything else would be... "socialist"?

Coming to you live from in between a rock and a hard place.

Badmutha -If you are bankrupt, it is because you keep spending vast sums on trying to colonise Islamic countries,

..... because you spend twice as much on your inefficient health arrangements as anyone else pays for adequate ones.....

....because you admire a con-merchant capitalism and because the Insurance companies are holding down your wages ...

Stop talking partisan nonsense and look at the facts, mug.

The U.S. isn't bankrup. Here is the reason why. The goverment has complete control of the money. There are almost no end to the ways they can raise money, including just printing it. We all hope it will never come to that. If they wish to they can put traffs on imports or increase taxes. Why not a dime tax on soft dranks. This would hurt no one and would bring in millions of dollars. I concide that this is not a good time for another round of government spending. But some people are spending as much as 25% of their incomes for health insurance. If all of this money were going to the government I am sure that we could in sure everyone. Learning,Speech,&Attention Defects | Man with learning disabilities, communication disorders, ADHD, becomes author

Actually do you know what the biggest entitlement program in history is?

You might have heard of it, I think it's called.......the Bill of Rights.

Americans are ENTITLED to a fair trial.
Americans are ENTITLED to free speech.
Americans are ENTITLED to education.

....and they are ENTITLED to life saving care.

What a pile of Librul bile dude! What does the Bill of Rights have to do with Government provided healthcare?

You are not entitled to fair trials and free speech, they are RIGHTS.

Education isn't even in the bill; maybe you need to read the document

Follow the thread and you might know.



What the *** do you think a right is? It's an entitlement.


Legal Dictionary

Main Entry: en?ti?tle?ment
Function: noun
1 : the state or condition of being entitled : CLAIM entitlement to money seized ?National Law Journal>
2 : a right to benefits that is granted esp. by law or contract





No, it's an implied right, just like the right to privacy. These are implied rights.

...hold on, i'll give you a moment to look it up, because i'm certain that you don't know what implied rights are....

I see that you have difficulty distinguishing a right to a benefit GRANTED and what "rights" are.

I is not the "Bill of Entitlements", it is the Bill of RIGHTS."

Carry on; it is obvious have no comprehension what you are talking about. The irony of your clueless condescension is probably also lost on you.

:stupid:

Care to point out how americans having healthcare who wouldn't otherwise have it, is a bad thing?
Because it depends on crime to attain the end, old sport. Using the government as an instrument of plunder to rob people of their property for the benefit of strangers is, in addition to being immoral, a crime of moral terpitude



If we have a public option, then everybody will have healthcare.
If we have what you and the Obamanation want, everybody will have equal misery.

Because it depends on crime to attain the end, old sport. Using the government as an instrument of plunder to rob people of their property for the benefit of strangers is, in addition to being immoral, a crime of moral terpitude[/COLOR]

So am I to assume you oppose all taxes, then?

Quote:

If we have what you and the Obamanation want, everybody will have equal misery.

I am weary of the Obama Public option, there is great potential for this bill to be taken advantage of, but there is no question that we need reform.

Josef;68994 wrote:

Because it depends on crime to attain the end, old sport. Using the government as an instrument of plunder to rob people of their property for the benefit of strangers is, in addition to being immoral, a crime of moral terpitude[/COLOR]

So am I to assume you oppose all taxes, then?
No, only those that are used for purposes that do not benefit me.





I am weary of the Obama Public option, there is great potential for this bill to be taken advantage of, but there is no question that we need reform.
Not 2,000 pages of reform.

It isn't a matter of it's effectiveness, or it's ability to provide health care to the most people at lower costs. The main reason republicans oppose a public option is because it conflicts with their political ideology. their concern is with "socialism" rather than the well-being of lower class Americans.
Lower costs to whom? Certainly not the people who now are paying for their own health insurance. Explain why we should be concerned with the needs of people who squander what money they have on other than health insurance, and why you aren't also concerned with the drift toward socialism

A study has found that 62% of bankruptcies are caused by medical bills.
Not if one sees to it that he has insurance.


There are 46 million Americans with no health insurance at all.
A thoroughly discredited number when the number of illegal aliens, students who don't care to have insurance, and other factors are considered. Responsible Americans attend to their health insurance needs before spending their disposable income on items such as gold chains, drugs, spinner wheel covers, hair weaves, custom fingernails, etc., which seem to be more necessary to some people than self-reliance.


And what is the republican's solution for this problem? Well, they don't actually have a solution, at all.
It isn't their concern, nor is it the concern of the government at all, it is the individual's concern to take care of his own needs.


There really has been no concrete alternative to national healthcare, none. They rant and rave about the evils of national health-care and yet they have posited no solutions themselves. All I hear from talk show radio is McCarthyian scare tactics and paranoia over the "socialism".
Socialism may be your cup of tea, old sport, but the vast majority of Americans despise the concept of having to turn over to complete strangers a large portion of the fruits of their labors simply because we all live in the same country. You socialist/communists will be the death of this country yet.



This is entirely absurd. The fact that there is even a controversy over whether we should help our fellow Americans is sickening.
There is no controversy over it, the controversy is about how and by whom they should be "helped." People who are in dire need of medical, or any other type of assistance, should go to their friends, family, neighbors, church and any other source that they can find who will willingly and freely give them the aid they need, instead of whining to the government and getting it to steal from hard-working, productive people. Charity is always voluntary, never forced; when it is forced, it is theft.



Make no mistake this is a MORAL ISSUE and to say otherwise is disingenuous.
Indeed it is a moral issue. It is extremely immoral to force strangers to pay your bills.


I under stand Obama is trying to make everybody happy (however impossible that is) he needs to make a stand.
First, "understand" is one word, next, it isn't Obama's or any other person's duty to "make everybody happy." That is the purview of a communist, utopian government.

And the United States isn't already? Give me a break.

If you want to look at the best healthcare systems in the world they are all national programs....big surprise. :eek:
Then why are Canadians coming here to get procedures that they can't get at home in a timely way? Sure, prescriptions may be cheaper in their socialist country, because the productive people are punished to benefit the indolent.


But monetary concerns are more important than the well-being of millions of Americans. This is nothing short of treason.
No, but freedom is more important than seeing to the medical needs of those who don't want to buy their own insurance, and the millions of illegal aliens who benefit from our taxes.






And the United States spends millions of times more on healthcare than any country in the world and yet we still have much less actual care being received, you can contemplate on why that is but I think it might have something to do with the fact that these insurance companies are FOR-PROFIT businesses.
Do you expect them to stay in business without making profit? What are you on?



Their goal is not to help people but to make MONEY! The fact of the matter is that the more people that are denied, the more profit these businesses make.
Who is denied the opportunity to buy health insurance?




Correct. And what is the republican solution?

"Let them die, it's more profitable!"
No, those are the words of a silly, stupid, grandstanding liberal Congressman who is also a socialist like you.




Are you suggesting that this moral issue should rest on the shoulder's of one man?

AD HOMINEM....

Suppose abe Lincoln owned a slave, should then we abandon this notion of "freedom and equality" because one man didn't live up to his values?
You are going off the deep end.



You have nothing to offer but more grandstanding and noise-making. We need a solution and the republicans are going to deny us that solution because it conflicts with their political ideology with scare-tactics.
We need a solution to what? The best health care system in the world? We need to degrade our system to a socialist/communist system that is only promoted by local socialists and is despised by those who live under it?

Then why are Canadians coming here to get procedures that they can't get at home in a timely way? Sure, prescriptions may be cheaper in their socialist country, because the productive people are punished to benefit the indolent.

No, but freedom is more important than seeing to the medical needs of those who don't want to buy their own insurance, and the millions of illegal aliens who benefit from our taxes.

Do you expect them to stay in business without making profit? What are you on?

Who is denied the opportunity to buy health insurance?

We need a solution to what? The best health care system in the world?

We need to degrade our system to a socialist/communist system that is only promoted by local socialists and is despised by those who live under it?

Of countries with a national healthcare system, Canada is the worst....not a good comparison. Even so, many more Americans are going to canada to receive care. I personally know of people who have.
Can you document any Americans going to Canada to receive medical attention? If not, admit you are a liar. Americans may go there to buy cheaper prescriptions, but that is because Canada punishes success just as you socialist/communists want America to do to her citizens.



you mean to say your purist ideology is more important than the well-being of millions of Americans. Your freedom is in now way imposed upon by these people being able to receive care.
It is not my concern to see to the health care of strangers, that is their job. You bleeding-hearts are good at spending other peoples' money. When I am forced to pay for a stranger's medical bills, I am not a free man, nor is anyone else. Maybe that concept is a little too difficult for a liberal to understand.




It really just comes down to maintaining the status quo that you so benefit from. That's what it's really about.
The "status quo" as you call it, has served America well for over two centuries, and made us the envy of the civilized world. That is why people are literally dying to come here, old sport, notwithstanding your befuddled ideas.




Is it fair that those who don't have as much money don't live as long?
Documentation, please. That is a remarkably ignorant statement.





A national healthcare does not require profit.
No, it requires the enslavement of the productive segment of the population by the indolent segment via the power of the government for the purpose of votes. You liberal socialists just don't get it. Haven't you ever heard of killing the goose that lays the golden eggs?





Many Americans that have insurance are denied coverage for necessary operations because it's not covered in their insurance contract.Then they made bad decisions in their selection of insurance policies. Duh!





You mean 37th best in the world just behind Costa Rica.
I have no idea where you came up with that skewed and twisted data, but statistics can be made to prove anything you want them to. Personally, I will take my chances with my physician, who was educated and trained in the country that draws people seeking medical educations from around the world, America, instead of some sawbones in San Jose or Mexico City.