Church of England to Apologise to Darwin

John Keel is one of the mosted influential ufologists since the 1970s. Keel states that after a lifetime of investigation he discovered an astonishing overlap between psychic phenomena and ufos. Keel believes like others in his field who have done the footwork, that ufos are a non human or spiritual intelligence source that has staged whole events over a long time period to propagate and reinforce certain erroneous belief systems. Keel believes that ultimately all of these anomalies are a cover for the real phenomenon.

It is my belief that the Bible predictions of the Anti Christ to come will be deeply involved with UFOs. I myself saw a vision of this person when I was about 4 years old, and I believe in the future such a man will be coming to earth in a desperate hour. He will not be here to help mankind, far from it, yet that is what people will believe.

AHAHAHAHA!!

Nice try, you make the claim, you put it to bed. I have seen and read many many reasons why these objects are not either dino's or they are fakes. This is one part of your argument, which is very weak to say the least. Keep the evidence coming, if you can.

BWHAHAHA!!! :rollinglaugh:


This is the funniest part right here:

"that ufos are a non human or spiritual intelligence source that has staged whole events over a long time period to propagate and reinforce certain erroneous belief systems."


You actually believe this crap? :rollinglaugh:

This is probably the most ridiculous thing i've heard in over a decade, and i've heard some pretty ridiculous things in the past, but this takes the cake for sure.

I'd ask for evidence but i'd only be kidding myself if i expected to actually get any. This guy you mention is a magician and journalist for chrissakes! Ufology is a pseudoscience, there are absolutely no qualifications to consider yourself a ufologist, anybody with a camera can call themselves a ufologist. This guy has no scientific education beyond high school nor any other education in related fields, his only qualification is in writing stories, in which he writes some stupendous tales indeed. he is a wack-job out to make money and you are gullible if you can't see that.

Well if you can just negate everyone based on your personal opinion then what can one say. Even if it is obvious that others in this field of research consider Keel one of the most influential ufo writers in the world today, such as Jerome Clark and others, who cares. You don't have to believe the evidence, just use your personal opinion. That should trump expert testimony anytime. John Keel was the author of the MothMan Prophecies, which was a story based on events that occured at Point Pleasent West Virginia back in 1966 and 1967. His books have been read by millions, and his beliefs have been formulated by the thousands of testimonies that have come from everyday people from around the world. Now, if all these testimonies can be refuted by you based on you own personal opinion, which I'm sure is limited in nature and scope. What can one say. Anytime you have numerous people telling you the same basic story of something that is beyond normal, you really should slow down and consider what is being said. Yet if your mind has been slammed shut, I guess you can call them all fools, and then lean back falling asleep in your rocking chair. I for one have my own stories to tell, and I must say, there is a lot more going on out there than science is going to be able to reveal to you.

It is my opinion against his. And he has nothing that qualifies him as an expert, and considering the preposterous nature of his claims he has an enormous burden of proof. Overall i'd just say anything he has so far presented is simply confirmation bias. People who believe in these things are more willing to accept any sign that there belief is true. These "stories/testimonies" are of people who believed before the fact.

It would be a mistaken assumption to believe that all testimonies were of people who believed before the fact. I have read some of Keels books in the past, and often people who were involved were people who had no idea of the events that were about to over take them. Keel himself stated that as he got involved into the ufo research he found himself being catapulted into the age old world of demonology. He also stated that friends of his were having some of the same experiences. He stated this in a book he wrote back in the
70s titled, "Why UFOs". I myself had an experience with two spirits back in 1973 that lasted six months. At no time did I actually believe something like that could happen in the modern age we live in. Yet it did. I still have the tapes from a delieverence I had to go through to rid myself from events that were beyond my control. What qualifies Keel is a desire to seek the truth of the matter. His belief is formulated on the testimonies of others, and I would point out that his belief and his opinion is shared by others in the field. What I experienced was totally unexpected, and up to the time of that experience, I would not of believed such a thing could be possible.

What is the point of "Folk Tales," or "Tall-Tales?" - Entertainment, and the fun people gets out of fooling the naive. What's that saying? A Sucker born every minute? Have you not heard of snake-oil salsemen? What is their point? The onus is on you to prove they are authentic. Not on me to show the folly in these claims. You haven't. And just waving your arm making these absurd proclamation isn't swying anyone's opinion on this. YOu already have made it clear to everyone reading this that you are not a good judge on what is reality and what is not. Yeah, I read the stories on the figurines years ago. You have got to quit promoting this nonsense, it is not helping your case.

LMAO;

Spreading your word around the world eh Campbell?

Another Question For Creationists (reject, evolution, attend, genesis) - Religion and Philosophy - Page 26 - City-Data Forum

Ready to read,..or just dismiss?

The Acambaro Figures - Famous Fakes and Frauds

Quote from PanTerra (another person from another site)



Just because you say it over and over again don't make it any more real.

It would be a mistaken assumption to believe that all testimonies were of people who believed before the fact. I have read some of Keels books in the past, and often people who were involved were people who had no idea of the events that were about to over take them. Keel himself stated that as he got involved into the ufo research he found himself being catapulted into the age old world of demonology. He also stated that friends of his were having some of the same experiences. He stated this in a book he wrote back in the
70s titled, "Why UFOs". I myself had an experience with two spirits back in 1973 that lasted six months. At no time did I actually believe something like that could happen in the modern age we live in. Yet it did. I still have the tapes from a delieverence I had to go through to rid myself from events that were beyond my control. What qualifies Keel is a desire to seek the truth of the matter. His belief is formulated on the testimonies of others, and I would point out that his belief and his opinion is shared by others in the field. What I experienced was totally unexpected, and up to the time of that experience, I would not of believed such a thing could be possible.

Personal rhetoric has been shown over and over again to be the least reliable form of evidence, especially when the witness doesn't understand what they are seeing they will often have to interpret what they are seeing into a preconceived notion. There has been many times where someone has been convicted by multiple eye-witnesses yet DNA evidence overturns the ruling.

and it doesn't matter if other people in the same field agree with him if the "field" is a pseudo-scientific field for which he has no qualifications. Sorry a "desire for truth" isn't gonna cut it.

The fact of the matter is the burden of proof has not even close to being met. The problem is that UFOs are just that "unidentified", they aren't aliens, they aren't demons, of spirits, or ghosts, they are UNIDENTIFIED while keel must assume there is some intelligence behind them to base his idea on, an idea that must make other assumptions (such as the existence of demons or spirits). And to be honest I find Scientology to be more believable than this.

As Keel points out, it is not the ufo's themselves or the sightings that are that important. It is the contact stories that follow after the sightings.

That is where you can get the details. Now there are thousands of such stories and from all over the world. It's is hard for me to understand how so many people keep repeating the same story, especially when we are speaking of other cultures and languages.
Keel believes there is intelligence to such stories because it is obvious there is a common story line found in each one. Radom thoughts could not keep repeating themselves with this kind of order and detail. Also, what happens to many of the people involved is often the same, they describe strange procedures that are preformed on them. Many of those procedures are the same that are experienced by others in more remote locations. What is happing here lies beyond the bounds of science, and because of this science is blinded by what they cannot see or understand.

unreliable! people claim to encounter all sorts of strange things, doesn't mean they actually happen.




One word: Society.

'tis where these stories start from.

So are government official reports also to be considered all unreliable?

Recent goverment files released by the British, state that in 1957 American fighter pilots were scrambled and told to shoot on site a ufo that was over British air space. This ufo was the size of an aircraft carrier and was traveling at speeds of over 7,000 miles an hour. It was observed by radar. So was this Society?

On November 7, 1975 a ufo was spotted at an American Nuclear Launch Control Facility. Sabotage Alert Teams were sent to invistigate, when they arrived at the base they saw a bright object so big that they refused to approach it. And they refused, even after they were ordered to do so. The object then took off and was tracked up to 200,000 feet where it disapeared.
Right after this, computer specialists were sent in to check the site, they discovered that all the missile launch codes had mysteriously been changed.
So was this society?

Your society answer is to simplistic and does not reflect the reality of what is really happening out there.

Again, you can only believe what you do by ignoring the facts on the ground and embracing your belief that is not supported by facts.

....um, yeah actually.




It's unfortunate we don't have any photographs huh?




It needn't be complicated. False perceptions are perpetuated by society.



You have presented no facts, merely hearsay.

Well there's a time in ones life after seeing thousands of reports on UFOs from nations, goverments, and people from all walks of life you have to ask yourself. Are they all making these things up? We do have photographs of ufos, and we also have vedio of them as well. Yet why put them here, you will just say thats not proof. We have endless reports of people who state they have seen them. Yet you will say, thats just hearsay. We have releases of information now from governmets from all over the world, Yet you will say thats just hearsay. We have reports of radar controllers telling us what they have spotted, and those sightings are confirmed by others on the ground. You can say hearsay, or wheres the proof. The fact is, the documentation is there. And the fact is, all you have to do is just deny it. It appears denial is your best evidence for your belief. You have the ability to hear thousands of personal experiences which involves goverments and people worldwide. Yet just deny all of it. I have enought faith that of the tens of thousands of reports from both the common man, and the professional alike that there is truth in their statements, and when their statements are backed up with both pictures, videos, and radar that only lends support to that truth. Perhaps you believe world war II never happened. After all, what proof do you have? Personal accounts. Thats just hearsay. Film. That could be doctored. Can you offer me any real proof that World War II really happened?
Maybe World War II was just another one of those fales preception perpetuated by society.

Well there's a time in ones life after seeing thousands of reports on UFOs from nations, goverments, and people from all walks of life you have to ask yourself. Are they all making these things up? We do have photographs of ufos, and we also have vedio of them as well. Yet why put them here, you will just say thats not proof. We have endless reports of people who state they have seen them. Yet you will say, thats just hearsay. We have releases of information now from governmets from all over the world, Yet you will say thats just hearsay. We have reports of radar controllers telling us what they have spotted, and those sightings are confirmed by others on the ground. You can say hearsay, or wheres the proof. The fact is, the documentation is there. And the fact is, all you have to do is just deny it. It appears denial is your best evidence for your belief. You have the ability to hear thousands of personal experiences which involves goverments and people worldwide. Yet just deny all of it. I have enought faith that of the tens of thousands of reports from both the common man, and the professional alike that there is truth in their statements, and when their statements are backed up with both pictures, videos, and radar that only lends support to that truth. Perhaps you believe world war II never happened. After all, what proof do you have? Personal accounts. Thats just hearsay. Film. That could be doctored. Can you offer me any real proof that World War II really happened?
Maybe World War II was just another one of those fales preception perpetuated by society.

Well my Grandad fought in it, was a Desert Rat and I have actual physical evidence he was there, Jewllery, Medals, Helmet, Webing, photos of him next to Tanks. All pieces of a puzzel that 'lend' thereselves to the truth. Plus I am guessing the Tens of Thousands of war graves in Normandy, would 'lend' it's self to the truth. Go dig up a few, I am sure there will be plenty of skeletons in there with bullet wound trauma and limbs missing due to explossions. Man!! I am sorry but that is just a dumb analogy on your behalf.

On the other side, could you show me some physical evidence of Ufo's please? piece of a ship, part of a space suit, maybe an Extra Terestrial? Maybe producing some of these items would help 'lend' itself to the truth.

I am open minded about the whole UFO phenomena. Until there is concrete proof either way, they are what they are UNIDENTIFIED FLYING OBJECTS. Nothing more nothing less.

My grandfather was UXB in Britain.

UXB?

Mine was in North Africa fighting Rommel, . 7th Armoured Division. Nickname 'The Desert Rats'

Well there's a time in ones life after seeing thousands of reports on UFOs from nations, goverments, and people from all walks of life you have to ask yourself.

Are they all making these things up?

We do have photographs of ufos, and we also have video of them as well.

Perhaps you believe world war II never happened. After all, what proof do you have? Personal accounts. Thats just hearsay. Film. That could be doctored.