If Jesus was God ...

@SWORD of GOD,

Sword you are the shallow superficial, black and white thinker. Your hatred is so evident in your posts. Are you a good example of what a Muslim is and is supposed to be?

You sound like a 13 year old boy that is parroting the words of his simpleton father. Do you have any independant thoughts? Do you understand anything of the world? Where is your wisdom?

You sound like a blind hater.

Do you go to bed at night fantasizing about when you will be able to use your Sword against us?

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@z0z0,

z0z0;14599 wrote:

Well..That sounds like a bad comedy film produced in Holywood. Please be sensible and not just throw any answer because this is a serious matter.

But for the sake of argument. Now, according to your believe, Juses died for the forgivness of the original sin. Which means any chrsitain is saved by the sacrifice of Jesus and accordingly God forgave him. Okay!

In your bible, it says as a punishment for the original sin:

To the woman he said, "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children". (Genisis 3:16)

If Jesus had sacrificed & forgiven our sin, then "WHY CHRISTIAN WOMEN ARE STILL GETTING LABOR PAIN!?"

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

Sword - you seem to know more than I do.

i never said that the Bible is perfect.

I know that the message of Jesus is and that is to be a good person and to do good things for others. That is enough.

If you want to be a religious lawyer then go for it.

It seems to me that you are throwing quotes that you have been trained to throw in your Muslims HATE CAMPS.

There is no point in discussing this with you.
Obvious that you are here just from HATE

Why don't you go to Iraq or Afghanistan and do the right thing.

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@z0z0,

z0z0;14777 wrote:

Sword - you seem to know more than I do.
Why don't you go to Iraq or Afghanistan and do the right thing.

I feel the need to comment seems there is a remark about our military men and women(just a remark, not good, not bad) I am not in the miltary. But i do know they pledge in public to DIE for our country and do! First i do not consider myself a Christian, you might based on these beliefs:

I believe that Jesus the Christ, a man and a Son of God was born 2,000 years ago in the cityof Nazareth. I believe, by reading what HE said, He was wise. I loved He used parables to explain His message. I believe He died a horrendous, three hour death by cruxification. I believe He commited no crime, therefore an innocent man died for a crime He did not commit. I believe this is a crime against humanity commited by men(i could explain more, but not the point)

Perhaps, you would not consider me a Christian based on these facts:
I do not attend a weekly mass at any christian building. I do not go to confession (okay, yeah I know Catholics). I do not believe Christianity is the only true path to the Divine. I do not use the Bible as my primary reference book.

Anyway, blah, blah. I believe I may know more about Christianity than some people because...well, read my introduction.

For the sake of this argument, lets agree I am:

"In your bible, it says as a punishment for the original sin:
To the woman he said, "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children". (Genisis 3:16)
If Jesus had sacrificed & forgiven our sin, then "WHY CHRISTIAN WOMEN ARE STILL GETTING LABOR PAIN!?"

My interpretation supposedly as Christian, We need to understand our world. We believe that God created all things. So, when we attempt to define our world we use God as a primary reference. Rather than use the scientific fact that a woman will have pain releasing a 4-10lb child through her vagina, we use God's divine plan. Now as a supposed Chrsitian, I believe it is pride to suppose you know God's plan. Truly KNOW it. Quite impossible.

However, for further clarity, you may need to ask someone who labels themselves as Christian. (really I do not care, not important to me for the sake of debating)

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@z0z0,

z0z0;14777 wrote:

Sword - you seem to know more than I do.

There is no point in discussing this with you.
Obvious that you are here just from HATE

Why don't you go to Iraq or Afghanistan and do the right thing.

If you consider a decent peaceful sensible dialouge in a Religious Discussion & Debate Forum a Hate then that's your problem not mine. I can not do anything to change that. Also, I didn't force you to participate in my posted topics and if you find them not suitable for you or threatening your religious believes then you can simply skip.
Very simple.

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@SWORD of GOD,

Sword - I see your comments as coming from HATE of the West and Christianity. Period. No more need to debate with you.

I have hope that Islam truly is a religion of peace but you prove otherwise. Maybe I should not trust Islam if Muslims like you truly do hate me.

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@SWORD of GOD,

Sword here is a question: Do you believe non-muslims can go to heaven? There are passages in the Q'uran concerning this if I am not mistaken, saying that if a righteous man even if he doesn't know the "word" of God he can still be saved, as long as he is righteous. So that being said what is your take on what is happening today in the middle-east, more specifically in these terrorist camps Zozo referd to? How do these men use the Q'uran to justify their actions?

1 Reply

@markx15,

markx15;14803 wrote:

Sword here is a question: Do you believe non-muslims can go to heaven? There are passages in the Q'uran concerning this if I am not mistaken, saying that if a righteous man even if he doesn't know the "word" of God he can still be saved, as long as he is righteous. So that being said what is your take on what is happening today in the middle-east, more specifically in these terrorist camps Zozo referd to? How do these men use the Q'uran to justify their actions?

Allah in the Quran says:

"And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers." (Quran 3:85).

" Say (O Muhammad) : If you love Allah, follow me: Allah will love you, and grant you protection from your sins. And Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. Say: Obey Allah and the Messenger (Muhammad), but if they turn back, Allah surely loves not the disbelievers." (Quran 3:30-31).

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@SWORD of GOD,

Ok thank you, now can you answer as to what you believe is causing this violence wordwide? How is Islam affecting the situation?

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@SWORD of GOD,

So many Muslims just memorize the Quran without thinking.
They then become robots doing what their power-hungry psychotic Mullas tell them to do.

I have no doubt that they feel justified in that the West screwed them over because we did - but today they do not want solutions for peace - they want peace by the sword.

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@SWORD of GOD,

Armageddon????

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@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;14733 wrote:

Being shallow and Making fun of yourself like this indicates for sure that you have No Trust in the Divine nature of your bible and you are just a Blind Faith Follower.

Quote:

No Trust in the Divine nature

Devine nature? It's a manmade book. Who wrote the Quran? If it was a human, you too are a Blind Faith Follower? Welcome to our club, you do know now you owe membership dues?

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@SWORD of GOD,

To take and read Gods word without the guidance and direction of the holy spirit will only lead you into confusion . The bible plainly states that Gods ways confound the wise . You have to belive that Jesus was the true son of God and that he can saev you and after you become saved then God can help you to understand the Bible . Until then though you will never understand and will only see the physical part of it which is nothing really compared to the spiritual part of it that God has to show you .

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@SWORD of GOD,

Welcome GC, nice to have you in the discussion.

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@SWORD of GOD,

I too agree that the Bible is man made and has some flaws, especially letters by the Apostles.

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@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;14771 wrote:

Well..That sounds like a bad comedy film produced in Holywood. Please be sensible and not just throw any answer because this is a serious matter.

But for the sake of argument. Now, according to your believe, Juses died for the forgivness of the original sin. Which means any chrsitain is saved by the sacrifice of Jesus and accordingly God forgave him. Okay!

In your bible, it says as a punishment for the original sin:

To the woman he said, "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children". (Genisis 3:16)

If Jesus had sacrificed & forgiven our sin, then "WHY CHRISTIAN WOMEN ARE STILL GETTING LABOR PAIN!?"

Their forgiveness is not of this world, they will be forgiven when they stand before Christ. By no means are Christians immune from the evils and problems of this world. They must push through battles just like everyone else (no pun intended).

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@SWORD of GOD,

Jesus was the best and last prophet.

He was the son of God in the same way you and I are children of God.
I do not believe in the resurrection of the body.
Resurrection of the spirit yes, not the body.
Heaven and God are non corporeal.
Further He was wrong on His end time timing.

I am not surprised by that last because any prophet I think who has touched the mind of God is overwhelmed by the Heavenly desire to rush the end time and can be picked up as a feeling that it is very close.
Heaven will do that.

Even with His small miscalculation though, I follow His philosophy.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;12910 wrote:

If Jesus was GOD ...

1- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Mark 12:29 Jesus said "Here, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord." The words "our God" indicate that Jesus had a higher God over him, a stronger God than him. Jesus didn't say "Your God". He said "our God" which includes Jesus as the creation of GOD.

2- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 20:17 Jesus said I ascend to my God and your God? This tells us that we and Jesus have a common GOD.

3- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 8:28 Jesus said "I do nothing of myself"? Can't GOD do anything he wills?

4- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 14:28 Jesus said "My Father (GOD) is greater than I"?

5- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Luke 23:46 Jesus said "Father (GOD), into thy hands I commend my spirit"?

6- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 19:16 Jesus said "Why call me good, there is none good but One, that is GOD"?

7- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 26:39 Jesus begged his GOD to have mercy on him and to pass the cup to death (kill Jesus in another words) before Jesus goes through the pain of crucifixion?

8- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 18:38 he didn't reply when he was asked about the truth?

9- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 24:36 Jesus told his followers that no one (including Jesus) knows when the judgment day will come, only GOD knows?

10- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Isiah 11:2-3 GOD had put the spirit of fearing GOD in Jesus?

11- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:31 Jesus told his followers that if he (Jesus) bears witness of himself, then his record is not true?

12- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:30 Jesus told his followers that he can't do a single thing of his own initiative?

13- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:36-38 Jesus said that GOD had assigned him (Jesus) work and GOD is a witness on Jesus?

14- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:32 Jesus told his followers that they have never seen GOD at anytime nor ever heard his voice?

15- If Jesus was GOD, then why did he pray to his GOD in Luke 5:16?

16- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 26:39 Jesus fell on his face and prayed to his GOD?

1 John 5:7 For there are three that bare witness in heaven, the Father, the Word, (Jesus) and the Holy Ghost, and these three are One. God is a Spirit and Jesus did not appear in Spirit but in human form. God is like the atom. It has three different parts, the eletron, the nutron, and the proton. All the parts are different and have different funtions, yet together they equal one atom. If you read the New Testament you will find it states that Jesus Christ
made all things, and if you read the Old Testament you will find the Father made all things. The only way this can be possible is if they are one God which the Bible proclaims they are. In the first book of the Bible you will not find God saying let Me make man in my image, you will find God saying let US make man in OUR image, and after OUR likeness.

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@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;19468 wrote:

Jesus was the best and last prophet.

He was the son of God in the same way you and I are children of God.
I do not believe in the resurrection of the body.
Resurrection of the spirit yes, not the body.
Heaven and God are non corporeal.
Further He was wrong on His end time timing.

I am not surprised by that last because any prophet I think who has touched the mind of God is overwhelmed by the Heavenly desire to rush the end time and can be picked up as a feeling that it is very close.
Heaven will do that.

Even with His small miscalculation though, I follow His philosophy.

Regards
DL

Jesus was not wrong at all in His timing of His return. I have heard this kind of talk before. The problem is you donot understand the Scripture. I believe the Scripture in question was where Jesus said some would not taste of death before they saw the Son of man returning. This happened on the Mount of Transfiguration. It was a glimpse into the future, not a literal event. They did see the return, but it was in a vision and that is why that vision was spoken of in the very next verse. Jesus told His followers before His return the temple would be destroyed, and that happened 37 years after the cross, the Bible clearly tells us that before Christ could return again a third temple would have to be rebuilt. The Bible makes this very plain. The Bible also makes plain that before Christ could return the Jews would have to return to the land of Israel and they would have to retake Jerusalem. And this would have to happen after the Jewish people returned from a world wide scattering. And this is where we find ourselves today.

1 Reply

@Campbell34,

Campbell34;20679 wrote:

Jesus was not wrong at all in His timing of His return. I have heard this kind of talk before. The problem is you do not understand the Scripture. I believe the Scripture in question was where Jesus said some would not taste of death before they saw the Son of man returning. This happened on the Mount of Transfiguration. It was a glimpse into the future, not a literal event. They did see the return, but it was in a vision and that is why that vision was spoken of in the very next verse. Jesus told His followers before His return the temple would be destroyed, and that happened 37 years after the cross, the Bible clearly tells us that before Christ could return again a third temple would have to be rebuilt. The Bible makes this very plain. The Bible also makes plain that before Christ could return the Jews would have to return to the land of Israel and they would have to retake Jerusalem. And this would have to happen after the Jewish people returned from a world wide scattering. And this is where we find ourselves today.

Actually my comment had nothing to do with your rejoinder.
It had more to do with His end time prediction, "it is at hand".
He was also wrong about physical resurrection.
There is no physical reality in Heaven only spiritual reality.
His end time goof is understandable only with the fact that anyone who touches the spiritual realm will notice a sense of them wanting us to hurry in our learning of God and good and evil.
This is what makes the prophet hated because he then has no restriction in His desire to show those around Him the right choice or interpretation of law.
This usually gets Him hated by the followers of the status quo.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

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