If Jesus was God ...

@SWORD of GOD,

The christian Myth of Original Sin is in complete contradiction with the OT believes!!

DEU 24:16 The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.

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@SWORD of GOD,

Most Christians believe Jesus to be the son of God. Not God himself.

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@SWORD of GOD,

the "son of" but at the same time the Holy trinity concept makes him as much of as "The Father" is.

That actually sparked a war in North Africa between Christian Germanic tribes (the Franks) who thought that Jesus wasn't as powerful as God and the Catholic Church which maintained the now modern belief of the holy trinity.

The funny thing is both statements can be backed by the Gospels

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@SWORD of GOD,

Regardless of how the religions started - only ONE religious beliefs system was benevolent enough to create free democratic pluralistic societies which even allow an attack on their very foundations.

Christianity has created freedom. Jesus did not rule by sword.
Islam has not created freedom. Mohammed did rule by the sword.

Sword of God - I take it you are a Muslim. Interesting that you have your handle "Sword".
Why are you so passionate at showing the flaws in Christianity?

Reality - all Religious books have internal contradictions. Maybe Christianity more than others but that is because it is men that wrote and transcribed them. The transcriptions are men's faulty understanding of who God is. Eventually we will figure it out.

Is not Islam also based on the same myths of the Old Testament?

Personally - I will never fight over the concept of whether Jesus is God or if he is a Son of God (less than God).

If I was God - I would have gone to earth (or sent a clone replica - because since I am God of the universe there are a lot of other planets I have to visit as well) to earth literally on a grand ship of some sort which everyone would see and know it was something heavenly. I would have been a magical superman that would amaze the people with my wonders. I would have given them my writings directly - hand out indestructible books in many languages so there would be no confusion. Then just like the Rolling Stones - I would go on a world wide tour and hand out T-Shirts so that everyone on earth would get the same message.

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@SWORD of GOD,

Thanks Zozo, i think. I think he uses "sword" because he would like to smit us. Peace loving those XMus are?

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@SWORD of GOD,

The Old Testament is the Jewish foundation to the Bible.
I personally do not subscribe to the Old Testament much.
It is more like a history book for the Jewish people.

It is the NEW TESTAMENT that I live by.

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@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;12910 wrote:

If Jesus was GOD ...

1- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Mark 12:29 Jesus said "Here, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord." The words "our God" indicate that Jesus had a higher God over him, a stronger God than him. Jesus didn't say "Your God". He said "our God" which includes Jesus as the creation of GOD.

2- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 20:17 Jesus said I ascend to my God and your God? This tells us that we and Jesus have a common GOD.

3- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 8:28 Jesus said "I do nothing of myself"? Can't GOD do anything he wills?

4- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 14:28 Jesus said "My Father (GOD) is greater than I"?

5- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Luke 23:46 Jesus said "Father (GOD), into thy hands I commend my spirit"?

6- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 19:16 Jesus said "Why call me good, there is none good but One, that is GOD"?

7- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 26:39 Jesus begged his GOD to have mercy on him and to pass the cup to death (kill Jesus in another words) before Jesus goes through the pain of crucifixion?

8- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 18:38 he didn't reply when he was asked about the truth?

9- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 24:36 Jesus told his followers that no one (including Jesus) knows when the judgment day will come, only GOD knows?

10- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Isiah 11:2-3 GOD had put the spirit of fearing GOD in Jesus?

11- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:31 Jesus told his followers that if he (Jesus) bears witness of himself, then his record is not true?

12- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:30 Jesus told his followers that he can't do a single thing of his own initiative?

13- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:36-38 Jesus said that GOD had assigned him (Jesus) work and GOD is a witness on Jesus?

14- If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:32 Jesus told his followers that they have never seen GOD at anytime nor ever heard his voice?

15- If Jesus was GOD, then why did he pray to his GOD in Luke 5:16?

16- If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 26:39 Jesus fell on his face and prayed to his GOD?

The New Testament clearly points out that God exist as three persons. Gods existance as more than one person can be seen in GEN. 1:26 when God states let us make man in OUR image according to OUR likness. Also the New Testament points out that Jesus made all things, yet the Old testament tells us the Father made all things. The New Testament states that there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word,(Jesus) and the Holy Ghost, and these three are one. Like the Atom, you have a Protron, nutron, and an electron, yet these three elements equal one atom. God is the same way. All three persons have different funtions, yet equal one God.

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@CancerMan,

CancerMan;13190 wrote:

The Old Testament is the Jewish foundation to the Bible.
I personally do not subscribe to the Old Testament much.
It is more like a history book for the Jewish people.

It is the NEW TESTAMENT that I live by.

You must remember if it were not for the prophecies of the Old Testament we Christians would not know who Jesus Christ is. Jesus Christ fulfilled the 300 or more prophecies of the Old Testament, so it is important to point these prophecies out to non believers. It is these prophecies that really establish the Lordship of Jesus Christ.

1 Reply

@Campbell34,

Campbell34;13421 wrote:

You must remember if it were not for the prophecies of the Old Testament we Christians would not know who Jesus Christ is. Jesus Christ fulfilled the 300 or more prophecies of the Old Testament, so it is important to point these prophecies out to non believers. It is these prophecies that really establish the Lordship of Jesus Christ.

First of all, we Muslims, believe that Jesus (peace be upon him) is a great messenger of Allah (God) and he is a human NOT God or Son of God.

Now, To see if the prophecies of the OT fit Jesus (peace upon him) or Muhammad (peace upon him) I refer you to my other topic in this Forum:
Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) in the Bible.

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;13432 wrote:

First of all, we Muslims, believe that Jesus (peace be upon him) is a great messenger of Allah (God) and he is a human NOT God or Son of God.

Now, To see if the prophecies of the OT fit Jesus (peace upon him) or Muhammad (peace upon him) I refer you to my other topic in this Forum:
Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) in the Bible.

If Jesus is only a great messenger of Allah, then Allah must of allowed Jesus to spread lies about Himself throught out the World, because Jesus clearly points out that know one comes to the Father but by Him. And the Bible clearly tells us that all authority was given to Him, and it also states that Jesus Christ created all things.

1 Reply

@Campbell34,

Campbell34;13607 wrote:

If Jesus is only a great messenger of Allah, then Allah must of allowed Jesus to spread lies about Himself throught out the World, because Jesus clearly points out that know one comes to the Father but by Him. And the Bible clearly tells us that all authority was given to Him, and it also states that Jesus Christ created all things.

It's a fact that the bible has been corrupted by men’s falsification. So, it is no longer the word of God.

There are a lot of clear evidences to support that and here are some:

HOW TO PROVE...BIBLE CONTRADICTS SCIENTIFIC FACTS
: ASP : EXPLORE : DAWAH : BOOKLET ON DAWAH - Islamherald.com

"Now of the things they keep saying about the divinely inspired Gospel according to Mark, some are altogether falsifications, and others, even if they do contain some true elements, nevertheless are not reported truly. For the true things, being mixed with inventions, are falsified, so that, as the saying goes, even the salt loses its savor." (Christian scholars).
Secret Mark letter translated by Morton Smith

St. Paul The Root of Christian Missionary Deception: " But if the truth of God through my lie abounded unto his glory, why am I also still judged as a sinner?"-ROMANS 3:7
St. Paul The Root of Christian Missionary Deception

Was Jesus the first and Only Crucified Savior?
No..there were 16 Crucified saviors before him.

Pagans' saviors :Historical Documents: Kersey Graves: The World's Sixteen Crucified Saviors: Chapter 16: Sixteen Saviors Crucified
Sixteen Saviors Crucified

A List of Biblical Contradictions . - Jim Meritt
Islam Tomorrow .com

Origins of Christianity: Attis, born of virgin Nana 200 BC, hanged on tree, resurrected, called Father God, died as atonement of sins, followers celebrated his resurrection on Eastros by parading in streets carrying small decorated pine trees and exchanging gifts. http://www.holysmoke.org/hs00/xianity.htm

Who Inspired the Authors of the Bible? THE BIBLE - THE BOOK THAT BELITTLES GOD AND GLORIFIES SATAN .- By Dr. Norlain Dindang Mababaya.
Who Inspired the Authors of the Bible?

The Catholic Church no longer swears by truth of the Bible
Catholic Church no longer swears by truth of the Bible-News-World-Europe-TimesOnline

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@SWORD of GOD,

So why would Islam be any better than Christianity?

You guys are in your DARK AGES TODAY!

Where is Islamic Art, Culture, Science, Progress?

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@SWORD of GOD,

Quote:

It's a fact that the bible has been corrupted by men’s falsification.

Who wrote your bible? A man maybe?

Quote:

So, it is no longer the word of God.

How could it be Allahs words if it came from the mouth of a human, interpreted by another human?

Quote:

There are a lot of clear evidences to support that and here are some:

"clear evidences" huh?

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@SWORD of GOD,

Jesus: The "God" that never was! , By: Ahmed Deedat

Click here THE GOD THAT NEVER WAS

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@SWORD of GOD,

From your book "Islam is the only religion which teaches the existence of a PERFECT God. A perfect God means that there is no sharer in His Nature and His Attributes:"

Where does the Christian "God" share anything with other Gods?

God - as we perceive him is a Trinity - which means there are three aspects to him. As I said previously, your face is made of two eyes, one nose, one mouth and two cheeks yet it is ONE FACE.

Same with the Christian God.

It must be nice to be a Muslim - where you do not have to think at all - just accept whatever the Mullah fashion of the day statement i.

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@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;13626 wrote:

: ASP : EXPLORE : DAWAH : BOOKLET ON DAWAH - Islamherald.com

"Now of the things they keep saying about the divinely inspired Gospel according to Mark, some are altogether falsifications, and others, even if they do contain some true elements, nevertheless are not reported truly. For the true things, being mixed with inventions, are falsified, so that, as the saying goes, even the salt loses its savor." (Christian scholars).
Secret Mark letter translated by Morton Smith

St. Paul The Root of Christian Missionary Deception: " But if the truth of God through my lie abounded unto his glory, why am I also still judged as a sinner?"-ROMANS 3:7
St. Paul The Root of Christian Missionary Deception

Was Jesus the first and Only Crucified Savior?
No..there were 16 Crucified saviors before him.

Pagans' saviors :Historical Documents: Kersey Graves: The World's Sixteen Crucified Saviors: Chapter 16: Sixteen Saviors Crucified
Sixteen Saviors Crucified

A List of Biblical Contradictions . - Jim Meritt
Islam Tomorrow .com

Origins of Christianity: Attis, born of virgin Nana 200 BC, hanged on tree, resurrected, called Father God, died as atonement of sins, followers celebrated his resurrection on Eastros by parading in streets carrying small decorated pine trees and exchanging gifts. Origins of Christianity

Who Inspired the Authors of the Bible? THE BIBLE - THE BOOK THAT BELITTLES GOD AND GLORIFIES SATAN .- By Dr. Norlain Dindang Mababaya.
Who Inspired the Authors of the Bible?

The Catholic Church no longer swears by truth of the Bible
Catholic Church no longer swears by truth of the Bible-News-World-Europe-TimesOnline

If the Bible was only based on one book you could make an arguement for falsification, but the Bible has thousands of copies written from many places and times around the world, and some of these copies date very early. To believe all these writers were able to get their lies organized and right, is a little far fetched. And there may of been 16 crucified Saviors, but there was only one who fulfilled the three hundred prophecis of the Old Testament.

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@SWORD of GOD,

Unfortunately Jesus did not fulfill all the prophecies of the OT, as educated Jews will tell you, the 70 weeks of Daniel were not fufilled

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@SWORD of GOD,

Re: 16 Crucified Saviors.

Wow - God really is trying hard to get his message to us yet we people keep on crucifying God's Son's / Messengers / Avatars.

I wonder if the similarity has anything to do with Satan (the evil power) fighting the Lord in the same way each and every time. Could this be part of the struggle between the two Gods?

I wonder if there actually ARE two GODS.

The Light God = Light + Order + Gowth/Life + Selflessness
The Dark God = Dark + Chaos + Decay/ Death + Sefishness

Similar to the Vorlons and Shadows in Babylon 5.

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@SWORD of GOD,

In my study of the Bible, I believe there are no clear verses that teaches Jesus was/is God. Most preachers who believe that Jesus was/is God can give verses in the Bible that says Jesus is really God. But when you study all the verses that says so, you will understand that they have different message.

Jesus was not called 'God' in the Bible nor 'only man' nor 'not man'.

Who is Jesus?

Jesus is the Spirit of God in Genesis chap 1 ver 1-2 because he is John chap 1 verse 3......

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@SWORD of GOD,

My, my, here come the quoters. Some people are blind to the reality of the oneness of our planet and our ENTIRE human race. Are we still arguing and killing over the same prophets, same tenets, same laws? Is not the basic message of the majority of religions the same? Well....

However, I will also quote someone.....

"As far as I'm concerned, I prefer silent vice to ostentatious virtue."

3 Replies

If Jesus was God ...

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