@Numpty,
Numpty;48284 wrote:I am NAZI am I, do you really understand what you are saying? You know I can take insults with the best of them but I draw the line at small minded ignorant idiots who have absolutely no concept of what the Nazi's achieved in their short but violent time in charge. Bare in mind i spent 6 years living in Germany during the Cold War and visited Belson a concentration camp in the north of Germany, where Anne Frank died, the site of that place haunts me to this day, Mass graves with little to show but a raised mound with a Plaque on it stating the number of people buried in there,.....3800,.....2700,.....3000,.....1300, and the mounds went on, filled with the bodies of Jews as the Nazi's went about the 'Final Solution'. If your intention was to insult, then you have achieved your aim, I hope as a christian you are happy with the outcome.
We may differ on our views greatly, but please to be so naive to think that I am anything like the Nazi's. I had a fair ammount of respect for up till that point.
But please, I have read the story of Lot, And I have posted on it in detail with Mr Campbell (he was however somewhat more respectful). Bottom line is the infallable God spared a man and his daughters whom he Knew would offer them to rapped instead of Gods Angels and he would then ultimately get drunk and impregnate the pair of them. If this is what was described as 'virtuous' back then, then more power to you bro!! Who spared these people? Who allowed them to carry out these deeds? Who new this would happen but did not let them burn with the rest in Soddom? Aye, Ole' Mr Infallable himself.
Oh yeah and his wife was turned to a pillar of salt because she 'looked back' truely a most disturbing sin based on the actions that were to follow.
Regards.
First off, there was no PERSONAL insult given, nor intended. The reference was given because of the comparison of the format used in the retort being exclusive to any but one POINT OF VIEW, regardless of the truth involved in the message, and you have taken it as some sort of "left handed insult". I also have spent time overseas, not only in Germany but in Asia, as a veteran of the armed forces. I see no difference in the ideology of Mr. Hitler than I do with any totalitarian structure, be it theological or secular communist in nature.
There is no doubt that Sin and the evil that accompanies it exists in the world, both in its present state as well as any in historical reference. When atrocious examples, such as referenced by you, are given people wonder why God allows obvious evil to happen, or as you said, perhaps even reward it (Which it was not). Atheists will "always" use the very obvious existence of evil to argue against God. Just as YOU, "If God were so good and infallible....." Since God allows evil to exist, God therefore must not exist.
What if you reversed this logic? If evil is so prevalent, why is there righteousness in this world, or why did this Accused man go on to do so many good works afterwards? Obviously the existence of sin being committed by man does not preclude the infallibility of God nor his omni-presence, nor his justice. If any man that ever committed a Sin was to be considered unworthy then the Christ, which Sined Not, made his sacrifice in vein. He was the only man that walked without sin, and that has taken God in the flesh to accomplish such a feet.
Sin is the breaking of the Law (1 John 3:4). There can be no evil, if there is no breach of the law. The solution offered by the seculars to address evil, is to simply remove the law, and there will be no sin/evil. This has been touted as the solution to the "drug" problem, to infidelity, etc. It used to be against the law to have sex outside marriage, these laws were dropped and deemed unenforceable. Has this worked, has infidelity decreased or stopped, or has the legal practice thereof resulted in so many children being born out of wedlock and accepted by the "village" to take care of. So, evil does exist whether We deem it evil or not. Some of our laws even reward evil, such as that of abortion. When, a person is legally allowed to take the life of the unborn. The legal system justifies this as not being able to define life. Yet, it seems funny that it is deemed illegal to destroy the eggs of the Bald Eagle, because the LAW states that they are endangered and the eggs are indeed part of that LIFE. Enough of this tangent.
So, we must address what is Sin and is God responsible for man's sins?
James 1:12-18 explains that sin comes from people making the wrong choice. Sin comes from man not God. We all have natural desires that are necessary for us to live and continue the lineage. Satan uses these natural tendencies to put us in situations where the satisfaction of our desire (especially when drinking) would cause any of us to break a command of God. It is a trap, but it is a snare that we "willingly" walk into because we want what is offered, we are tempted by what is natural and abuse the use thereof at times.
The law given by God is unfortunately exploited by Satan sometimes. By defining sin, it lets us know about options we might not have considered before. Every parent, even God, faces this dilemma. We want to warn our children against the dangers present in this world, but we do not want our children to lose their innocence toward life. Paul address such in Romans 7. He, by nature would not be one to covet what belongs to another man. But when he learned about coveting through the law, he faced the temptation to covet from the simple fact that he was now aware of the possibility. After all, we are agents of "free will".
In Genesis 5:34 we read that Adam lived over 800 years and he had sons and daughters. It is therefore obvious that these siblings married each other to procreate. This answer might upset some because they immediately assume that it advocates incest. The reality is this was not forbidden until latter in the history of man because the further along man populated the more prevalent genetic diseases became, when the relationship was to close. Adam was able to marry Eve even though she shared DNA, there was not a concern of diseases as the lineage had not been diluted by years of generational mutations, or what some now call "evolution" which was inherent in man upon creation, this ability to adapt to his environment. If man did not inherently have this design built into his DNA he would never be able to overcome even the simplest of common virus, etc., that he is often exposed to. This ability to adapt when other sources of life are introduced into man's system is a must for survival, be it pathogenic or not. But even the species of man has never been proven to breach the barrier of biogenesis. Because certain specimens of Man have been found, evolutionists conclude that this is "stage of evolution", when it merely could be a group of humans that have breed themselves into a mutated status, due to isolation. All fossils remains of humans that have been found are deemed to be intelligent (the ability to draw and make tools), and many have been found with the remains of voice boxes still intact, proving the ability of speech. There is no answer absolute, there are any number of possibilities, besides those "shoehorned" hypothesis of marcoevolution.
One can "observe" this change in the acceptable mores' of man in concern to what was deemed "incest". By Abraham's day people assume that a brother and sister wouldnot marry, but Abraham was married to his half-sister and this was considered to be fine (Genesis 20:1-12). Jumping further ahead in time, by Moses day marriages to people closer than a cousin was forbidden (Leviticus 18:6-18). Whereas today, it is not recommended for cousins to marry at all.
Perhaps now we can address why God allows evil to exist in this world. Sin exists because people want it (Jer.5:30-31). God tolerates its existence because it creates a distinction between the righteous and the wicked (Rom.7:13). When we sin, and we see the affect of evil on our lives, then we learn, however reluctantly, that God is always right. We are forced to see that God's laws are actually the best path to protect us, because we can directly see the devastation caused by people who sin. The existence of such just shows how bad off mankind is when he is lawless (Ecclesiastes 3:15-18).
God did not cause this sin to happen as you mentioned, a drunk man that listened to his natural side as tempted by evil, instead of listening to his spiritual side. We all continue to this day to engage in this battle. SOME HAVE JUST DESERTED ENTIRELY AND CHOSE THE WRONG SIDE, and choose to let sin reign in their life and justify it because it in some cases is not AGAINST THE LAWS OF MAN.
We must always remember, "Righteousness exalts a nation, but sin is a reproach to any people " (Prov. 14:34). RD
