If Jesus was God ...

Campbell34;43390 wrote:

Answer me this one question. If the Bible cannot be taken literally, why then were all the prophecies of Christ first coming fullfilled literally?[/QUOTE

As I stated before...the Bible contains truly inspired passages, which I believe give insight into God and our purpose on Earth....but I don't take everything it the Bible as gospel...and I'm not alone.
The prophets were "the prophets"....does the Levitical Code work in todays' world? Of course not...adjustments have to be made, and updated, and made applicable to the now.
The Bible is filled with allegory and mythology, but also valuable lessons...it's up to us to use common sense, and discernment to see the application in our lives today. The New Testament is more relevant than the Old...and Paul's writings are just addendum to the gospels, which are far more important.[/QUOTE]

So when you say you don't take everything as Gospel, are you saying you don't believe everything in the Bible is true? Because I know the Bible tells us that all Scripture is given by the inspiration of God. Also there is no mythology in Scripture that I'm aware of.

aaronssongs;43392 wrote:

So when you say you don't take everything as Gospel, are you saying you don't believe everything in the Bible is true? Because I know the Bible tells us that all Scripture is given by the inspiration of God. Also there is no mythology in Scripture that I'm aware of.

Of course I don't take every comma and period in the Bible as gospel...without analysis, contemplation, and discernment...only a fool or sheep would do otherwise.
I also don't believe God is at all hateful or vengeful, as those are human qualities...and God is so much more than us lowly human beings...or don't you believe that?
Methuselah was 969 years old, when he died?????
When Cain slew Abel, he went to another town to "take a wife"....where did she come from? Where did the town come from????
I can't wait for your response? I say it's mythology.

Yes I picked the forst site after I typed 'Contradictions in the Qur'an' in my search Engine.

But are all those passages in your holy book or are they not?

If not, then I appologise and will gadly delete the post. If they are then whetther they were copy and pasted or written from my own personal knowledge is irrelevent as the information contained within it is pertinent to our debate.

You clearly showed contradictions in the Bible as I did for the Qur'an, Neither book is perfect. Why try to make out one is more superior to the other?

I hope you try to read the complete passages from a Quran website and you do the homework and research yourself because those anti-Islam websites take verses out of their context and twist the meaning to suite their hate agenda. When I quote Biblical passages I use christian websites (known Bible's search websites) and I read the whole passages (not picking them out of their context).

Again, I want to present you my offer again:

I will be glad to refute those false allegations with supported proofs and logical sensible answers (as they have been refuted/answered many years ago) but would you then accept the TRUTH!!!? or you just like to throw old false allegations copied blindly from anti-Islam websites, and never care to know the truth!?

Campbell34;43393 wrote:

Of course I don't take every comma and period in the Bible as gospel...without analysis, contemplation, and discernment...only a fool or sheep would do otherwise.
I also don't believe God is at all hateful or vengeful, as those are human qualities...and God is so much more than us lowly human beings...or don't you believe that?
Methuselah was 969 years old, when he died?????
When Cain slew Abel, he went to another town to "take a wife"....where did she come from? Where did the town come from????
I can't wait for your response? I say it's mythology.

"I also don't believe God is at all hateful or vengeful, as those are human qualities...and God is so much more than us lowly human beings...or don't you believe that?"
Well I believe the Bible, and the Bible tells us that God would punish evil people. Jesus spent a good part of His ministery warning people of Hell. He would not of done that unless such a place existed.
Methuselah died before the flood, and if you recall Noah was 500 years old when he had Shem, Ham, and Japheth.
Cain married a descendant of Adam and Eve. Remember the early generations lived hundreds of years. There was plenty of time for towns and people to multiply. The Bible is not a Book of lies, and that is what the world wants us to believe. If you can get people to believe that the Bible even has one lie in it, then there is no reason to believe any part of the Bible. Because then who is to say where the next lie ends, and the truth begins?

aaronssongs;43401 wrote:

"I also don't believe God is at all hateful or vengeful, as those are human qualities...and God is so much more than us lowly human beings...or don't you believe that?"
Well I believe the Bible, and the Bible tells us that God would punish evil people. Jesus spent a good part of His ministery warning people of Hell. He would not of done that unless such a place existed.
Methuselah died before the flood, and if you recall Noah was 500 years old when he had Shem, Ham, and Japheth.
Cain married a descendant of Adam and Eve. Remember the early generations lived hundreds of years. There was plenty of time for towns and people to multiply. The Bible is not a Book of lies, and that is what the world wants us to believe. If you can get people to believe that the Bible even has one lie in it, then there is no reason to believe any part of the Bible. Because then who is to say where the next lie ends, and the truth begins?

Well, excuse me if I believe our purpose here on Earth, is something more transcendent than being born and believing that the Bible is the end all and be all, and nothing else matters. Excuse me.
And I, for one, do not believe that any human lived 500 or 969 years...I don't care what is written...and it doesn't have anything to do with my personal relationship with God, and I don't need you to comment.

aaronssongs;43392 wrote:

So when you say you don't take everything as Gospel, are you saying you don't believe everything in the Bible is true? Because I know the Bible tells us that all Scripture is given by the inspiration of God. Also there is no mythology in Scripture that I'm aware of.

Try talking snakes and fish that spit out men after three days.
No mythology in scripture look again.

You must believe in the supernatural if you are to read the Bible literally.
The Bible if read literally does not make sense.
It asks you to wait till end time for God to return and repair systems that, if God's works are Perfect, do not need fixing.

Regards
DL

aaronssongs;43401 wrote:

"I also don't believe God is at all hateful or vengeful, as those are human qualities...and God is so much more than us lowly human beings...or don't you believe that?"
Well I believe the Bible, and the Bible tells us that God would punish evil people. Jesus spent a good part of His ministery warning people of Hell. He would not of done that unless such a place existed.
Methuselah died before the flood, and if you recall Noah was 500 years old when he had Shem, Ham, and Japheth.
Cain married a descendant of Adam and Eve. Remember the early generations lived hundreds of years. There was plenty of time for towns and people to multiply. The Bible is not a Book of lies, and that is what the world wants us to believe. If you can get people to believe that the Bible even has one lie in it, then there is no reason to believe any part of the Bible. Because then who is to say where the next lie ends, and the truth begins?

You need to offer proof when you say the earlier generations lived hundred of years. That is scientifically inaccurate and has to be cast aside as nonsense.

Campbell34;43443 wrote:

You need to offer proof when you say the earlier generations lived hundred of years. That is scientifically inaccurate and has to be cast aside as nonsense.

Like I said in earlier posts, which Campbell repeatedly discounts, you cannot believe everything that is written, nor everything that is said. Belief without evidence is the substance of faith....I have no justified faith that certain men in the Bible lived for hundreds of years, and others did not....as you implied, it makes no sense. And you know what? We can believe what we choose to believe...why Campbell insists on convincing others to his way of thinking, is beyond me.

Adam Bing;43454 wrote:

Like I said in earlier posts, which Campbell repeatedly discounts, you cannot believe everything that is written, nor everything that is said. Belief without evidence is the substance of faith....I have no justified faith that certain men in the Bible lived for hundreds of years, and others did not....as you implied, it makes no sense. And you know what? We can believe what we choose to believe...why Campbell insists on convincing others to his way of thinking, is beyond me.

He is commited. Alone he is harmless. But the legion of these evnagelists are a danger no less than their Islamic counterparts. The only difference is that our society keeps them at bay whereas the Islamic societies have failed to do the same. Which means people like us need to be similarly committed and not allow any fallacy to be aired without challenge.

Adam Bing;43454 wrote:

Like I said in earlier posts, which Campbell repeatedly discounts, you cannot believe everything that is written, nor everything that is said. Belief without evidence is the substance of faith....I have no justified faith that certain men in the Bible lived for hundreds of years, and others did not....as you implied, it makes no sense. And you know what? We can believe what we choose to believe...why Campbell insists on convincing others to his way of thinking, is beyond me.

He is commited. Nevertheless alone he is harmless. But the legion of such evangelists we currently face are a danger no less than their Islamic counterparts. The only difference is that our western society keeps them at bay whereas the Islamic societies have failed to do the same to their fanatics. Which means people like us need to be similarly committed and not allow any fallacy to be aired without challenge.

Adam Bing;43454 wrote:

Like I said in earlier posts, which Campbell repeatedly discounts, you cannot believe everything that is written, nor everything that is said. Belief without evidence is the substance of faith....I have no justified faith that certain men in the Bible lived for hundreds of years, and others did not....as you implied, it makes no sense. And you know what? We can believe what we choose to believe...why Campbell insists on convincing others to his way of thinking, is beyond me.

Well the Bible tells us that God's Word is true. And I would find it hard to believe that God could speak the universe into existance, but He can't get His Book right. And I would find it equally hard to believe that God allowed false information to be placed in His Book just to confuse the human race even more. Also, recent discoveries have shown that what some people first had believe about the Bible being false, now actually shows the Biblical account being true. The longer time goes on, new discoveries only prove the truth of the Bible. And yes you can believe what you want, yet if you can see how much of the Bible is being validated today, I would not be so quick in denying it's claims. The Bible tells us the natural person will not understand the things of the Spirit, and maybe that is why some of the stories don't make any sense to you.

aaronssongs;43458 wrote:

Well the Bible tells us that God's Word is true. And I would find it hard to believe that God could speak the universe into existance, but He can't get His Book right. And I would find it equally hard to believe that God allowed false information to be placed in His Book just to confuse the human race even more. Also, recent discoveries have shown that what some people first had believe about the Bible being false, now actually shows the Biblical account being true. The longer time goes on, new discoveries only prove the truth of the Bible. And yes you can believe what you want, yet if you can see how much of the Bible is being validated today, I would not be so quick in denying it's claims. The Bible tells us the natural person will not understand the things of the Spirit, and maybe that is why some of the stories don't make any sense to you.

What kind of substances are you using?
God didn't sit down at his little (or big) God-Typewriter, and jot down everything that 's in the Bible. It was documented by "fallible men", often inspired, often with an "ax to grind"....God may have gotten his book right, but you can rest assured that man got it all wrong.
Man conceived of compiling an inspired book...not God...God has no need of books...you , indeed, talk like a delusional and mentally impaired person.
But, hey, free world...believe what you choose...just don't come in contact with any pointed objects or any firearms, you'll hurt yourself or someone.

aaronssongs;43458 wrote:

He is commited. Nevertheless alone he is harmless. But the legion of such evangelists we currently face are a danger no less than their Islamic counterparts. The only difference is that our western society keeps them at bay whereas the Islamic societies have failed to do the same to their fanatics. Which means people like us need to be similarly committed and not allow any fallacy to be aired without challenge.

And quite "scary"....they absolutely are every bit as demented and deranged as the Islamic terrorists....what about the survivalist who assassinated a doctor performing legal abortions in the Carolinas (I think), and they eventually found him scrounging in garbage, and arrested him.
I, personally, had a then "girlfriend' who would go off on tangents...picking up a variety of girls, from a local bars...having protracted trysts, and then getting "the guilties", and then trying to compensate by reading and quoting scripture, furiously, and condemning everyone else around her, while invoking the name of Jesus...and this behavior would repeat like clockwork, month after month.....these folks need serious therapy, and a 12-step program addressing "Bible Abuse".

aaronssongs;43458 wrote:

Well the Bible tells us that God's Word is true. And I would find it hard to believe that God could speak the universe into existance, but He can't get His Book right. And I would find it equally hard to believe that God allowed false information to be placed in His Book just to confuse the human race even more. Also, recent discoveries have shown that what some people first had believe about the Bible being false, now actually shows the Biblical account being true. The longer time goes on, new discoveries only prove the truth of the Bible. And yes you can believe what you want, yet if you can see how much of the Bible is being validated today, I would not be so quick in denying it's claims. The Bible tells us the natural person will not understand the things of the Spirit, and maybe that is why some of the stories don't make any sense to you.

Please specificy what discoveries you are alluding to. There have been archeological discoveries that prtain to the time the bibile was written in and they may match. So what? The same holds true for similar discoveries about the times alluded to in the Koran, The Bhagwad Gita and the Buddhist scriptures for example, from the Gandharva period. So these new discoveries validate each of these documents as they may the Bible. So?

Now if you have some scientific verification for the life span of the prophets, or of Jesus' recurrection or of peole turning to pillars of salt, that is what we need.

Campbell34;43465 wrote:

Please specificy what discoveries you are alluding to. There have been archeological discoveries that prtain to the time the bibile was written in and they may match. So what? The same holds true for similar discoveries about the times alluded to in the Koran, The Bhagwad Gita and the Buddhist scriptures for example, from the Gandharva period. So these new discoveries validate each of these documents as they may the Bible. So?

Now if you have some scientific verification for the life span of the prophets, or of Jesus' recurrection or of peole turning to pillars of salt, that is what we need.

So what?

Well many from your mind set have said the Bible is filled with historical errors.
And the discoveries that would set one on a true course are many, if one was really intrested in such a course. The Koran does not have the dramatic history as the Bible does, nor does it have the fantastic stories of Gods involvement with a race of people as we see with the God of the Bible.

So when there is evidence outside of the Bible, one who is intrested in truth might have a better reaction than, "so what".

Some historians and critics have questioned the existence of King David and have relegated Old Testament accounts about him to the status of mythology.

Not that long ago Avraham Biran and his team of archaeologist found a remarkable inscription from the ninth century B.C.E. that refers both to the 'House of David' and to the 'King of Israel.' That is the first time that the name David has been found in any ancient inscription ouside the Bible" This discovery was made in northern Galilee, at the foot of Mount Hermon beside one of the headwaters of the Jordan River. More and more extrabiblical evidence involving Bible names and places is being discovered as the years go by. The skeptics are gradually having to retreat.

I would say there is far more evidence for the truth of the Bible than there is for evolution, which is becoming much more of a blind faith belief.

Adam Bing;43470 wrote:

So what?

Well many from your mind set have said the Bible is filled with historical errors.
And the discoveries that would set one on a true course are many, if one was really intrested in such a course. The Koran does not have the dramatic history as the Bible does, nor does it have the fantastic stories of Gods involvement with a race of people as we see with the God of the Bible.

So when there is evidence outside of the Bible, one who is intrested in truth might have a better reaction than, "so what".

Some historians and critics have questioned the existence of King David and have relegated Old Testament accounts about him to the status of mythology.

Not that long ago Avraham Biran and his team of archaeologist found a remarkable inscription from the ninth century B.C.E. that refers both to the 'House of David' and to the 'King of Israel.' That is the first time that the name David has been found in any ancient inscription ouside the Bible" This discovery was made in northern Galilee, at the foot of Mount Hermon beside one of the headwaters of the Jordan River. More and more extrabiblical evidence involving Bible names and places is being discovered as the years go by. The skeptics are gradually having to retreat.

I would say there is far more evidence for the truth of the Bible than there is for evolution, which is becoming much more of a blind faith belief.

I will focus on providing you proof on 1) The Age of the world. 2) The fact that there were no dianasaurs on Noah's Ark 3) Evolution.

You focus on providing me proof on 1) Jesus' resurrection 2) The claim that biblical prophets lived for hundreds of years. 3) That people can be indeed turned to pillars of salt. AND, it is only fair for me to expect the same kind of demanding proof that I am sure you will ask for from me. So remember Mr.Campbell, simply quoting the good book is not good enough. In fact simply quoting something is not allowed unless the reference pertains to some proof/ emperical data. For example, I am not alllowed just to say that this famous scientist so & so claims evolution is a fact. I am required to show you the basis on which he makes the claim. Okay? And the same rigor applies to any evidence you provide. Lets do it.

By the way to help me out in my research on dinasaurs you could begin by showing me where in the bible is there any mention of dinasaurs. After all, if they lived alongside Noah, they should haven been in the garden on Eden no? The bible mentions all kinds of creatures that were living at the time it was written. So why no mention of any of the dinasaurs? And please don't show me any allegorical references to demon like creatures. Remember, if there were dinasaurs on the Ark, your prophets must have been comfortable enough with them. So as they say in our country's heartland: Show me.

Campbell34;43476 wrote:

I will focus on providing you proof on 1) The Age of the world. 2) The fact that there were no dianasaurs on Noah's Ark 3) Evolution.

You focus on providing me proof on 1) Jesus' resurrection 2) The claim that biblical prophets lived for hundreds of years. 3) That people can be indeed turned to pillars of salt. AND, it is only fair for me to expect the same kind of demanding proof that I am sure you will ask for from me. So remember Mr.Campbell, simply quoting the good book is not good enough. In fact simply quoting something is not allowed unless the reference pertains to some proof/ emperical data. For example, I am not alllowed just to say that this famous scientist so & so claims evolution is a fact. I am required to show you the basis on which he makes the claim. Okay? And the same rigor applies to any evidence you provide. Lets do it.

By the way to help me out in my research on dinasaurs you could begin by showing me where in the bible is there any mention of dinasaurs. After all, if they lived alongside Noah, they should haven been in the garden on Eden no? The bible mentions all kinds of creatures that were living at the time it was written. So why no mention of any of the dinasaurs? And please don't show me any allegorical references to demon like creatures. Remember, if there were dinasaurs on the Ark, your prophets must have been comfortable enough with them. So as they say in our country's heartland: Show me.

Dinosaurs are mentioned in the Book of Job chapter 40:15-24 and Job chapter 41: 1-34
Links below may help.
Are Dinosaurs mentioned in the Bible?
"Behemoth" & "Leviathan"
Dinosaurs in the Bible

Campbell34;43465 wrote:

What kind of substances are you using?
God didn't sit down at his little (or big) God-Typewriter, and jot down everything that 's in the Bible. It was documented by "fallible men", often inspired, often with an "ax to grind"....God may have gotten his book right, but you can rest assured that man got it all wrong.
Man conceived of compiling an inspired book...not God...God has no need of books...you , indeed, talk like a delusional and mentally impaired person.
But, hey, free world...believe what you choose...just don't come in contact with any pointed objects or any firearms, you'll hurt yourself or someone.

The Bible tells us in 2 Timothy 3:16 that (ALL) scripture is given by inspiration of God. Another words, not just the parts you want to believe in, but also all the other Scriptures you want to ignore. So I talk like a delusional or mentaly impaired person just because I believe in the Bible and you don't. WOW!