If Jesus was God ...

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;38377 wrote:

ALLAH says in the Noble Quran:

"And (remember) when your Lord brought forth from the Children of Adam, from their loins, their seed (or from Adam's loin his offspring) and made them testify as to themselves (saying): "Am I not your Lord?" They said: "Yes! We testify," lest you should say on the Day of Resurrection: " Verily, we have been unaware of this."

Or lest you should say: "It was only our fathers aforetime who took others as partners in worship along with Allah, and we were (merely their) descendants after them; will You then destroy us because of the deeds of men who practiced Al-Batil (i.e. polytheism and committing crimes and sins, invoking and worshipping others besides Allah)?"
[Quran 7: 172-173]

Moreover, Allah said :

"Verily, We have created man in toil." [Quran 20: 4]
.
.
"And shown him (man) the two ways (good and evil)" [Quran 20: 10]

Also, Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said:

[SIZE="2"]Narrated Abu Huraira : Allah's Apostle (peace be upon him) said, "Every child is born with a true faith of Islam (i.e. to worship none but Allah Alone) but his parents convert him to Judaism, Christianity or Magainism, as an animal delivers a perfect baby animal. Do you find it mutilated?" [/SIZE]

Thanks for the quotes but is the answer yes or no?
Your reply is not quite clear.

Regards
DL

0 Replies

@mlurp,

"Say: O People of the Scripture (Jews & Christians)! Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for Lords besides Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto him)." (Qur'an)

[SIZE="2"]To Every Christian, Please Ask Yourself...[/SIZE]

[SIZE="2"]SALVATION: [/SIZE]

Christians say that "GOD LOST His only son to save us". To whom did God lose Jesus if he owns the whole universe?

15. If it was agreeable with God's Majesty to have sons, He could have created a million sons the like of Jesus. So what is the big clear deal about this only son?

16. Why does the Bible say that Jesus wanted to die on the cross, when the one on the cross was shouting "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" according to Matthew 27:45 and Mark 15:33?

17. If God had wanted to save us, couldn't He have done that without sacrificing Jesus?

18. God is Just, and justice requires that nobody should be punished for the sins of others, nor should some people be saved by punishing other people. Doesn't the claim that God sacrificed Jesus to save us because He was Just, contradict the definition of justice?

19. People sacrifice things they have to get something they don't have when they can't have both. Christians say that "God SACRIFICED His only son to save us". We know that God is Almighty; to whom did He sacrifice Jesus?

20. A real sacrifice is when you can't get back what you have offered , so what would be the big deal about such a sacrifice if God could recover the same offering? (according to the Christians' terminology)?

21. If all the Christians are saved through Jesus and are going to Heaven no matter what they do, then the teachings of Jesus are irrelevant and the definition of good and bad are also rendered irrelevant. If this is not so, then do Christians who believe in Jesus yet do not follow his teachings nor repent go to Hell?

22. How can Christians take deeds as irrelevant after becoming one when Jesus says in Matthew 12:36; "But I say unto you that every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the Day of Judgment. For by the words thou shalt be justified, by the words thou shalt be condemned"?

23. Christians say that people go to Heaven ONLY THROUGH JESUS, yet Paul says in 1 CORINTHIANS 7:8-16 that the unbelieving husband is acceptable to God because he is united with his wife and vice versa, and their pagan children are also acceptable to God. So people can go to heaven without believing in Jesus according to this.

24. How come the Bible says that ALL Israel is saved although they don't believe in Jesus? Doesn't that contradict the claim in the Bible that the only way to heaven is through Jesus?

25. According to Christians, those who have not been baptized will go to Hell. So even the infants and babies go to Hell if not baptized, since they are born with an inherited original sin. Doesn't this contradict the definition of justice? Why would God punish people for sins they never committed?

2 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

"Say: O People of the Scripture (Jews & Christians)! Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for Lords besides Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto him)." (Qur'an)

[SIZE="2"]To Every Christian, Please Ask Yourself...[/SIZE]

[SIZE="2"]HOLY SPIRIT: [/SIZE]

The only place in the Bible where the Paraclete was called the Holy Spirit is in John 4:26 "But the Paraclete, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you". What has the Holy Spirit brought or taught for the last 2000 years?

26. Christians say that the Paraclete means the Holy Spirit (John 14;26). Jesus said in John 16:7-8 "If I do not go away the Paraclete will not come to you". This could not mean the Holy spirit, since the Holy spirit was said to have been there before Jesus was even born as in Luke 1:41 "Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit".
Here, the Holy spirit was also present during Jesus life time. So how could this fit with the condition that Jesus must go away so that the Holy spirit will come?

27. In John 16:7-8, it says: "But if go, I will send him to you. And when he comes, he will convict the world of sins and of righteousness and of Judgment". What do "he" and "him" refer here? Do Not they refer to a man?

28. Does the Holy Spirit talk to good Christians and bad Christians as well? Is the Holy spirit with them all the time or just at certain times? When does it start visiting a person who wants to become a Christian?

29. How can you as a Christian tell if the Holy Spirit is inside another Christian? How come many Christians fooled people by claiming that the Holy spirit was inside them only to be converted to another religion later on ?

30.Does the Holy Spirit dictate what Christians should do without choice or freedom at all or does it only guide them and they have the freedom to follow or not ?

31. If the Holy Spirit dictates what Christian should do, why do Christians commit sins and make mistakes ? How can you explain the conversion to other religions and atheism of many Christians? Are they told to do that by the Holy Spirit?

32. If the Holy Spirit guides Christians only, and they are free to do what they want, then how do we know that the writers of the Gospels didn't make mistakes in writing them?

33. If Christians believe that the Holy Spirit comes and talks to them everyday, why don't they ask the Holy Spirit about which version of the Bible to follow since there are too many versions floating around?

0 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;38580 wrote:

"Say: O People of the Scripture (Jews & Christians)! Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for Lords besides Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto him)." (Qur'an)

[SIZE="2"]To Every Christian, Please Ask Yourself...[/SIZE]

[SIZE="2"]SALVATION: [/SIZE]

Christians say that "GOD LOST His only son to save us". To whom did God lose Jesus if he owns the whole universe?

15. If it was agreeable with God's Majesty to have sons, He could have created a million sons the like of Jesus. So what is the big clear deal about this only son?

16. Why does the Bible say that Jesus wanted to die on the cross, when the one on the cross was shouting "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" according to Matthew 27:45 and Mark 15:33?

17. If God had wanted to save us, couldn't He have done that without sacrificing Jesus?

18. God is Just, and justice requires that nobody should be punished for the sins of others, nor should some people be saved by punishing other people. Doesn't the claim that God sacrificed Jesus to save us because He was Just, contradict the definition of justice?

19. People sacrifice things they have to get something they don't have when they can't have both. Christians say that "God SACRIFICED His only son to save us". We know that God is Almighty; to whom did He sacrifice Jesus?

20. A real sacrifice is when you can't get back what you have offered , so what would be the big deal about such a sacrifice if God could recover the same offering? (according to the Christians' terminology)?

21. If all the Christians are saved through Jesus and are going to Heaven no matter what they do, then the teachings of Jesus are irrelevant and the definition of good and bad are also rendered irrelevant. If this is not so, then do Christians who believe in Jesus yet do not follow his teachings nor repent go to Hell?

22. How can Christians take deeds as irrelevant after becoming one when Jesus says in Matthew 12:36; "But I say unto you that every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the Day of Judgment. For by the words thou shalt be justified, by the words thou shalt be condemned"?

23. Christians say that people go to Heaven ONLY THROUGH JESUS, yet Paul says in 1 CORINTHIANS 7:8-16 that the unbelieving husband is acceptable to God because he is united with his wife and vice versa, and their pagan children are also acceptable to God. So people can go to heaven without believing in Jesus according to this.

24. How come the Bible says that ALL Israel is saved although they don't believe in Jesus? Doesn't that contradict the claim in the Bible that the only way to heaven is through Jesus?

25. According to Christians, those who have not been baptized will go to Hell. So even the infants and babies go to Hell if not baptized, since they are born with an inherited original sin. Doesn't this contradict the definition of justice? Why would God punish people for sins they never committed?

You are so ignorant of the Bible. If you are not then you should not be asking these silly questions. You are one of those whom Daniel prohesied in Daniel 12.10.....

1 Reply

@chico,

Let us remember that Sword is probably a Christian posing as an Islamic fundamentalist to purposely hurt Islam.

Check His work and it may lead you to this same conclusion.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@Greatest I am cv,

lol, do I need his postings to know the evil is Islam. Nope the diaper heads show that themselves.

1 Reply

@mlurp,

mlurp;39173 wrote:

lol, do I need his postings to know the evil is Islam. Nope the diaper heads show that themselves.

I hope you don't get banned for saying that, I was name calling and flat out saying it like it is myself before. Then the personal attacks and no religion promoting rules were enforced and I vowed to not return were there are Islamics preaching hard to Americans to convert or underhanded tactics to imply conversion. I just read here usually but I had to respond to your post. Evil diapers are definatly their own worst enemy in my opinion. They show us their true intentions with their laws and beliefs. Barbaric!

1 Reply

@tvsej,

"Say: O People of the Scripture (Jews & Christians)! Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for Lords besides Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto him)." (Qur'an)

[SIZE="2"]To Every Christian, Please Ask Yourself...[/SIZE]

[SIZE="2"]MISSION OF JESUS:[/SIZE]

Without borrowing from other religions and systems, can Christianity provide people with a complete way of life? Since Christianity is limited to spiritual life and does not provide law, how can a society decide which laws are right or wrong?

34. Why do the Christians say that Jesus came with a universal mission when he said that he was sent to the Jews only? He said to the Canaanite woman who asked him to heal her daughter from demon-possession: "I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel" and also said: "It is not right to take the children's bread and toss it to their dogs", Matthew 15:21-28.

2 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

It is said that there is no diference inbetween the interior and the exterior, but you must first come to your senses about what happens inside before you can turn that into something concrete outside. Didn't Jesus say he would come personally to establish the law upon the Earth? Free yourself from yourself, I can't say what happens next because honestly I have not yet done so myself.

2 Replies

@markx15,

According to the English translation of the Bible, we see the one on the cross crying out a very blasphemous statement,

"Eli! Eli! Lama sabachthani?" (Which being translated means, "My God! My God! Why have you forsaken me?")

This statement on the cross clearly indicates the one on the cross is not pleased with the situation nor does he consider it right or just. Therefore, one would have to conclude this was not something Jesus approved of nor did he accept, or else someone else was on the cross in his place. Either way you look at it, the one on the cross did not accept this as a plan of salvation.

The Quran is absolutely in agreement with these teachings and Muslims do worship the same God and Lord of Jesus, Moses, Abraham and Adam, peace be upon them all. The Quran states in many places, no one will be taken to task for the sins of another, nor can anyone carry the burden of another. We will all be on our own on that Day.

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;39503 wrote:

According to the English translation of the Bible, we see the one on the cross crying out a very blasphemous statement,

"Eli! Eli! Lama sabachthani?" (Which being translated means, "My God! My God! Why have you forsaken me?")

This statement on the cross clearly indicates the one on the cross is not pleased with the situation nor does he consider it right or just. Therefore, one would have to conclude this was not something Jesus approved of nor did he accept, or else someone else was on the cross in his place. Either way you look at it, the one on the cross did not accept this as a plan of salvation.

The Quran is absolutely in agreement with these teachings and Muslims do worship the same God and Lord of Jesus, Moses, Abraham and Adam, peace be upon them all. The Quran states in many places, no one will be taken to task for the sins of another, nor can anyone carry the burden of another. We will all be on our own on that Day.

How do you get blasphemy out of that question?

Jesus is not cursing God, He is may have been expecting a different outcome and was asking for clarification. Many are not ready for death when it comes and ask why.

Blasphemy should include more of a personal insult than a simple question.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;39404 wrote:

"Say: O People of the Scripture (Jews & Christians)! Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for Lords besides Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto him)." (Qur'an)

[SIZE="2"]To Every Christian, Please Ask Yourself...[/SIZE]

[SIZE="2"]MISSION OF JESUS:[/SIZE]

Without borrowing from other religions and systems, can Christianity provide people with a complete way of life? Since Christianity is limited to spiritual life and does not provide law, how can a society decide which laws are right or wrong?

34. Why do the Christians say that Jesus came with a universal mission when he said that he was sent to the Jews only? He said to the Canaanite woman who asked him to heal her daughter from demon-possession: "I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel" and also said: "It is not right to take the children's bread and toss it to their dogs", Matthew 15:21-28.

According to Paul in Galatians 6.2 reads 'BEAR ONE ANOTHER'S BURDENS, AND SO FULFIL THE LAW OF CHRIST...' There are laws which Jesus taught to us and I do not know why you Muslims do not KNOW. You said you believe in Jesus but do not follow OR KNOW the law of Jesus. IT IS CLEAR THERE ARE LAWS OF JESUS...

Here is one of the law of Jesus which Muslims do not follow. In Titus 1.5-6 reads 'THIS IS WHY I LEFT YOU IN CRETE, THAT YOU MIGHT AMEND WHAT WAS DEFECTIVE AND APPOINT ELDERS IN EVERY TOWN AS I DIRECTED YOU, IF ANY MAN IS BLAMELESS, THE HUSBAND OF ONE WIFE, AND HIS CHILDREN ARE BELIEVERS...'

'THE HUSBAND OF ONE WIFE'... Do Muslim follow this law of Jesus???? How can you say that Muslim is moral and do believe in Jesus when Mohamed permitted Muslim to marry as much as four wives??? The poor who can not afford to sustain is not permitted while the rich which is capable is permitted and can marry four times... This is discrimination beyond the law of Jesus....This is ridiculous....

0 Replies

@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;39523 wrote:

How do you get blasphemy out of that question?

Jesus is not cursing God, He is may have been expecting a different outcome and was asking for clarification. Many are not ready for death when it comes and ask why.

Blasphemy should include more of a personal insult than a simple question.

Regards
DL

Read what is written again:

"Eli! Eli! Lama sabachthani?" (Which being translated means, "My God! My God! Why have you forsaken me?")

This statement on the cross clearly indicates the one on the cross is not pleased with the situation nor does he consider it right or just. Therefore, one would have to conclude this was not something Jesus approved of nor did he accept, or else someone else was on the cross in his place. Either way you look at it, the one on the cross did not accept this as a plan of salvation.

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;39642 wrote:

Read what is written again:

"Eli! Eli! Lama sabachthani?" (Which being translated means, "My God! My God! Why have you forsaken me?")

This statement on the cross clearly indicates the one on the cross is not pleased with the situation nor does he consider it right or just. Therefore, one would have to conclude this was not something Jesus approved of nor did he accept, or else someone else was on the cross in his place. Either way you look at it, the one on the cross did not accept this as a plan of salvation.

I can only ask again, how does this question to God blaspheme in any way?
Jesus is not showing anger. He is asking a question.
Are you saying that asking God a question is to blaspheme God.

I notice that like most fundamentalists, you do not like to use your own words to answer. I understand where it is easier to hide behind scripture.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

Why should he be pleased with being nailed to the cross? That is something that must cause excruciating pain. Did he not recieve his answer from God? Did he not forgive the ones who put him in that situation?

1 Reply

@markx15,

markx15;39677 wrote:

Why should he be pleased with being nailed to the cross? That is something that must cause excruciating pain. Did he not recieve his answer from God? Did he not forgive the ones who put him in that situation?

It pleased the Father for Christ to be nailed to a cross, because now the price of sin was paid for. Now the world could be saved from the bondage of sin. It was a very high price, yet God allowed His son to go throught this because God loved the world. All who love God need only to call on the name of Jesus Christ, He was the blood sacrifice. Salvation cannot be earned, it was already paid for by Christ. Our works only show God how much we love Him, yet our salvation has been paid for. We need only to go to Christ and tell Him we receive His Sacrifice for the washing away of our sin. John 3:16 For God so loved the world He gave us His only son, that whosoever believes in Him shall not perish, but will have everlasting life. Salvation comes to each one of us when we individually ask Christ for the forgiviness of our sin, and ask Him to be Lord and God of our life. God sees a true heart, and He will honor your request.

0 Replies

@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;39676 wrote:

I can only ask again, how does this question to God blaspheme in any way?
Jesus is not showing anger. He is asking a question.
Are you saying that asking God a question is to blaspheme God.

I notice that like most fundamentalists, you do not like to use your own words to answer. I understand where it is easier to hide behind scripture.

Regards
DL

We -Muslims- don't use our self opinions and desires to shape our faith or fabricate our religion. Religion is based on what God has said and revealed in his authentic holy scripture and on what his messenger said.

3 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;39688 wrote:

We -Muslims- don't use our self opinions and desires to shape our faith or fabricate our religion. Religion is based on what God has said and revealed in his authentic holy scripture and on what his messenger said.

This is good but if it stops you from answering simple questions then you fall into the Christian trap of saying it is so because God say it is so, and do not justify His words with any logic.

God did not write the Bibles, men did. Interpreting these words are all we can do.
You may recognize that fundamentalists are losing ground because of the very habit that you are falling into of not justifying the words of your Bible.

Sad for both you and them. It causes a loss of reputation.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;39688 wrote:

We -Muslims- don't use our self opinions and desires to shape our faith or fabricate our religion. Religion is based on what God has said and revealed in his authentic holy scripture and on what his messenger said.

If you as Muslims do not use self opinion then how do you explain the various factions and cells off shooting from your main tree.
One would think that there would only be one clear voice from Islam.

Regards
DL

0 Replies

@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;39694 wrote:

This is good but if it stops you from answering simple questions then you fall into the Christian trap of saying it is so because God say it is so, and do not justify His words with any logic.

God did not write the Bibles, men did. Interpreting these words are all we can do.
You may recognize that fundamentalists are losing ground because of the very habit that you are falling into of not justifying the words of your Bible.

Sad for both you and them. It causes a loss of reputation.

Regards
DL

Unlike you -Christians- we Muslims do not speak of our own desires regarding the Religion as Religion is an inspiration sent down to Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) from the Creator.

Even The Prophet (pbuh) himself had no role in authoring the Qur'an, he was merely a human messenger, repeating the dictates of the Divine Creator:
"He (Muhammad) does not speak of his own desire. It is no less than an Inspiration sent down to him." [Quran 53:3-4]

Perhaps one of the best description of the Qur'an was given by Ali, the cousin of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) when he expounded upon it as,

"The Book of God. In it is the record of what was before you, the judgment of what is among you, and the prophecies of what will come after you. It is decisive, not a case for levity. Whoever is a tyrant and ignores the Qur'an will be destroyed by God. Whoever seeks guidance from other than it will be misguided. The Qur'an is the unbreakable bond of connection with God; it is the remembrance full of wisdom and the straight path. The Qur'an does not become distorted by tongues. nor can it be deviated by caprices; it never dulls from repeated study; scholars will always want more of it. The wonders of the Qur'an are never ending. Whoever speaks from it will speak the truth, whoever rules with it will be just, and whoever holds fast to it will be guided to the straight path."
[Al-Tirmidhi]

Islam answers all your questions not like corrupted Christianity. The followers of the christianity can not answer even the very simple question about the basics of their corrupted faith (this thread is a good example). They twist words and they use their own desires & self opinions to apologize for the nonsense information and contradictions in the bible.

1 Reply

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