Does art take away from life?

@Ionus,

But, anything you show is already subject to YOUR interpretation and you want to know what SHE FINDS ARTISTIC. Showing her anything would defeat your purpose. Hint.

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@msolga,

S0 we agree.

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@The Pentacle Queen,

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Well I wouldn't criticise anyone for going to town with sex or drugs actually.

I would.

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if people don't have any reactions to this kind of art, as you're claiming,

I believe I said the majority of people esp those who have real emotions in their lives such as where the next meal is coming from.

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but why can't you recognise that some other people do?

I do recognise that...my whole argument is saying they have got it twisted...they have moved too far away from reality, as someone who has whips involved in sex or has a fat problem and cant stop eating cake. Modern art is more based on boredom than reality.

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As for my opinions just being 'trendy'- well they aren't, a lot of people have criticised this thread and rightly so.

It seems you are confusing trendy with popular. Half of the success of trendy is that it is not popular, it identifies a modern tribe from the plebs.

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@msolga,

I mostly don't get it, that art could possibly take away from anyone's life. I've paid attention to art from the beginning of the sixties, having had a couple of classes that were sort of packets of information. I was otherwise busy with, say, biochem. But I got interested.

I am sort of amused that someone at the high end of privilege re the arts, now thinks it sucks up life.

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@msolga,

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I present you with Monet.

May I keep him ?

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Now you have no argument with this, surely?

No, I dont. It takes skill and ability plus that extra sight a true artist has to produce art, not a drunk splashing paint and then wondering the next morning who did it .

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my subjective response was to to be impressed by the sheer size & scale of it. Aesthetically, I loved the way the poles broke up the composition. The overlays of almost "accidental" splashes of different colours, dribbled textured colours, appealed to me, both aesthetically & also in a tactile sense: I wanted to touch the surface of the painting. I liked the way that light played on the surface of the painting. I responded to it in an emotional sense, too. I found it exciting. Somehow this whole complex mish-mash of different responses at the one time meant that Blue Poles worked for me.

I understand from that you like it for a lot of the reasons people like art. But I dont see it as art.

There is a lot of mathematics in good art, including chaos theory, whereas finger paintings and train smashes tend to only have chaos theory if anything. Some of this chaos comes from the mentally ill, others have no structure in their minds anyway. I cant imagine anything worse than trying to live with one of these ratbags as their lack of strength takes them through hell every morning whilst they try to figure out whether to have tea or coffee. I think the right mixture of liberal application of chaos and formal structure was reached with van Gogh...Picasso was trying to get on the bandwagon with only a fraction of the ability. A lot of this stuff took off in the 60's which is a decade I associate with confused frightened people with a lot of time and money on their hands.

When you have seen too much art, had too much sex, too much food, you tend towards the extreme. What is required is physical hardship, mental relaxation, sex and food when required to live a balamced life. For what we were designed to do, human life in the west is way too easy. This reflects in wierdness and excess in art, food and sex.

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I think Ionus has a sex thing.

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@ossobuco,

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I think Ionus has a sex thing.

You could have said an art thing or a food thing...are you projecting ?

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@Ionus,

No.

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@Ionus,

Well, I'm delighted you chose to keep the Monet, Ionus.

It will bring you much pleasure, I promise.

As for the rest, we will just have to agree to disagree. (But then, I wasn't trying to persuade you, so ...)

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@Ionus,

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Picasso was trying to get on the bandwagon with only a fraction of the ability. A lot of this stuff took off in the 60's which is a decade I associate with confused frightened people with a lot of time and money on their hands.

Might I intercede with a bit more actual information? Picasso was already regarded as a prodigy before he was a teenager. He was celebrated as probably one of, if not THE most important artist of the 20th century well before the 1930's.
His drawings that he presented to be admitted to the BArcelona SChool of Fine Arts in 1895 are some of the most masterful drawings of the human shape and technique of draftsmanship for a kid of 15 and 16. His early works in the last years of the 19th century were compared to those of Goya . Wherever one gets the statement that his "stuff didnt take off until the 1960's" shows a lack of knowledge about this artist.

Id suggest the works by Norman Mailer of "The Young Picasso" or MOMA's retrospective work of his lifes work(called "Pablo Picasso") would be a good place to start to learn the truth about this artist.

He was already accomplished and was regionally recognized in 1900 when the suicide of his friend Carlos CAsagemas set him on an entirely new pathway to become the foundation of MOdernism. His work in his blue period still looked much like Renoir or an impressionist painter , albeit with overtones of decorative colors rather than studying light as a medium. In 1905 he first began his works that we recognize him for until his death. He had about 60 years of work that was accepted and celebrated well before the 1960's.

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There is a lot of mathematics in good art, including chaos theory,

Maybe in its interpretation on the History Channel or Discovery, but I wouldnt believe anything about what someone says about art when they have to break every so often for a commercial.
The mathematical analysis of the Vitruvian Man or M C EScher, is kind of old hat and not really how art is enjoyed viscerally. Mathematical analyses is the leftover for the soul less. A great plein air landscape artist spends a lot more analyses in color theory than "chaos theory". Just because we can Mandelbrodt a tree line or a mountain scape to death, doesnt mean that it satisfies anything for an educated observer. Its just more **** to sell to the tourists at the museum gift shop where they target people who need such crutches.

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@farmerman,

You really have trouble reading..might I suggest glasses ? I wrote :

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A lot of this stuff took off in the 60's

but you read :

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his "stuff didnt take off until the 1960's"

I know it is only a little t, and we have seen where these things confuse you to the point where you think you win debates by unknowingly changing what the other side says, but you can do better if you try harder.

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Wherever one gets the statement that his "stuff didnt take off until the 1960's" shows a lack of knowledge about this artist.

But it was you who said it. Does this (see the little t ??) mean you are showing a lack of knowledge ?

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Maybe in its interpretation on the History Channel or Discovery, but I wouldnt believe anything about what someone says about art when they have to break every so often for a commercial.

Dont assume we all have pretend qualifications like you.

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The mathematical analysis of the Vitruvian Man or M C EScher, is kind of old hat and not really how art is enjoyed viscerally.

Really ? You get visceral pleasure from finger paintings ? Dont look at Vincent then, it has been know to triggure auto-sexuals.

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Mathematical analyses is the leftover for the soul less.

Do you have any idea where you got that from ?

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A great plein air landscape artist spends a lot more analyses in color theory than "chaos theory".

(slaps forehead) They spend no time in analyses of chaos theory or colour theory, it is the chaos of colour that catches the eye...it is instinctive...anyone who stops to analyse a picture is missing the point...it has to be from the soul.

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Just because we can Mandelbrodt a tree line or a mountain scape to death, doesnt mean that it satisfies anything for an educated observer.

So you are an educated observer...sure...it is very clear you understand nothing of what I said. Go away and do some research.

This is the equivalent of 100% fat, no nutrients competing with a healthy salad.....a cheap prostitute trying to compete with a lingerie model wife....this is a waste of paint and canvas :

http://www.sgallery.net/artnews/data/upimages/2007/08/picasso.jpg

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@Ionus,

I'm letting Farmer argue for me since he is better at it.

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@Ionus,

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it is the chaos of colour that catches the eye...it is instinctive...

. Thank you CArter Brown. You should be on the lecture circuit with that Bullshit . Look up "color theory" and show me "Chaos". I challenge that "A lot of his stuff took off in the 60's" I think youre just trying to talk authoritatively of a subject about whichyou really have nothing to offer except fairy tales. The only thing unusual that happened to(or about) Picasso in the 60's, was the death of ALice B Toklas who held the collection of Stein and the collection was disbursed after a retrocpective show.
Picasso's shows had been important for 30 years previously.

Whats your problem with tis? Its easy to see the composition and color. Its not unique to his style and its probably more than your net worth.

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This is the equivalent of 100% fat, no nutrients competing with a healthy salad.....a cheap prostitute trying to compete with a lingerie model wife....this is a waste of paint and canvas :

Also, this is ANUS with his head up his own ANUS. Trying to sound cognizenti are we ? I like the way you get all schoolyard bully when someone has the udcity to challenge your obvious expertise in art. Youre not worth continuing with but I just expect that when someone comes out with your level of puffery, that at least youd know what youre talking about.

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@farmerman,

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I challenge that "A lot of his stuff took off in the 60's"

You cant read. I even pointed out to you where you got it wrong. Hopeless.

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it is the chaos of colour that catches the eye...it is instinctive... .
You should be on the lecture circuit with that Bullshit .

There are people out there who know exactly what I am talking about and they know more then an offended country bumpkin who thinks he is being trendy.
How about your bullshit ?

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I think that youre looking for a defined line which doesnt require any work on your behalf to engage in ridicule . Thats an easy trip and is one fraught with problems because you always will be standing around with your thumbs up your ass attempting to look intelligent when you should just let yourself go an enjoy the abstraction, the color, the work, and only after some work on your part, you can sound a little more intelligent.

Really ? You can sound a little more intelligent ? Nahhh ....

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Also, this is ANUS with his head up his own ANUS. Trying to sound cognizenti are we ? I like the way you get all schoolyard bully when someone has the udcity to challenge your obvious expertise in art.

What a two faced hypocritical anal-retentive country bumpkin you are....dont worry about feeling bullied Gomer.....it comes with your feelings of inferiority and overcompensating...no wonder you think you are an art critic, no-one believed your pretense at being a geneticist/geologist. What a blowhard you are.....

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@ossobuco,

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I'm letting Farmer argue for me since he is better at it.

That puts you way down the list...are you sure ?

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@Ionus,

Yeh, he has more legs.

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@ossobuco,

If it's' me and you, I'll just roll my eyes.

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@farmerman,

Heres your entire "Scholarly" statement about Picasso .

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Picasso was trying to get on the bandwagon with only a fraction of the ability. A lot of this stuff took off in the 60's which is a decade I associate with confused frightened people with a lot of time and money on their hands.

I re read it and still you come off with a strong statement about Picasso 's popular worth being a product of the 60's. His popularity and recognition predates the 60's and renders that statement of yoiurs as almost (no completely) idiotic and without context.
SO I assume that you were (as usual) just blowin all that expertise out your ass.
You certainly can not like abstract or "other types of "Modern" art. You could have said"I dont get it", or "Its worth escapes me". NO, you come out with these airhead comments about the universal "Non" worth of the art. Its not a matter of the kings clothing. Its merely a matter of whether you have a " dead eye" or not.

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@Ionus,

I really like this painting .. a lot.

No point in trying to explain why.

Never the twain & all that ...

So it goes. Neutral

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@farmerman,

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I re read it

Oh, really ? Then what do you think "A lot of this stuff took off in the 60's" means ? It doesnt mean Picasso took off in the 60's. it means a lot of the new art forms .....a lot of this stuff.....became mor epopular in the 60's.....what is there about your adled anal obsessed brain that cant get this ? What were you toilet trained with ? A chainsaw ? I can quite easily believe a sicko like you "gets" it but your attempts to justify it show you as wierd and wonder-struck as the rubbish you admire.

If Picasso was as great as you and your Schardonay Sssippers think, why didnt he do real paintings that demonstrate talent and ability ? This rubbish is a demonstration of hit or miss style to earning money....someone may like it, but probably not, but if enough wierdos get off on it then you are made. No talent, no ability, just twist everything enough so it MUST be art, it couldnt be anything else if it was that sicko.

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Does art take away from life?

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