THe PC Police Again Shut Down Truth Seaking

@Ionus,

A vivid imagination Ionus. Perfect for the kid's table. You're nothing but a toy soldier, with a...

Toy gun
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@Diest TKO,

Quote:

I know good soldiers, and they are good men and women. They are selfless and honorable beyond words. You deserve none of their good will for your cowardice and bigotry. You're nothing special. You offer nothing here.

You know nothing of soldiering. You speak to soldiers ? WOW ! What a learning experience that must be for you...that would be exactly like being in combat..could you smell the fear, taste the blood ? No wonder you are a self proclaimed expert. You dont know enough to know how stupid you are.

Quote:

Your ability to speak so ill of our female and gay soldiers, illustrates your disrespect for the institution and everything they fight for.

Perhaps a clever soldier critic like your self would be able to quote from me ? No ? Pity. Just keep making **** up then, thats the boy.

1 Reply

@Ionus,

Ionus wrote:

Quote:
I'm sure a few have, I'm sure their percentage is comparable to that of the straight soldiers
You are guessing cloth cock....

If you can speculate, then why can't I? I mean, I already posted statistics in this thread, which you've been very hands off about. If my factual argument is left waiting while you speculate left and right, then certainly I can make speculations too while I wait for you to ante up.

If you're going to claim that one group is abusing the system to get out, then you need to provide the context for how many people use means to get out of the military. Unless you believe that straight men don't use loop-holes to get out of the military, and you can demonstrate how others are significantly higher, then you haven't said anything worthwhile.

You're just popping caps with your

Toy gun
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@Diest TKO,

Quote:

A vivid imagination Ionus. Perfect for the kid's table. You're nothing but a toy soldier, with a...

Toy gun
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Isnt that clever the way you put the last bit at the bottom there...Thats very good..did your momma show you that ? What sort of soldier are you, by the way ? Oh thats right, you didnt serve did you ? Too scary, all those homosexual men with big weapons ? But you just KNOW, you really KNOW, what military life is like because you have spoken to military personnel...next time you have the chance to stand in line to get a brain dont wander off bored .

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@Diest TKO,

Quote:

If my factual argument

Factual argument ????? You guessed none then you guessed some, what is your latest guess ?

Quote:

You're just popping caps with your

Toy gun
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He did it again ! It wasnt a fluke ! Well done ! Mommas proud of her little boy !

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@Ionus,

Ionus wrote:

Quote:
I know good soldiers, and they are good men and women. They are selfless and honorable beyond words. You deserve none of their good will for your cowardice and bigotry. You're nothing special. You offer nothing here.
You know nothing of soldiering. You speak to soldiers ? WOW ! What a learning experience that must be for you...that would be exactly like being in combat..could you smell the fear, taste the blood ? No wonder you are a self proclaimed expert. You dont know enough to know how stupid you are.

Quote:
Your ability to speak so ill of our female and gay soldiers, illustrates your disrespect for the institution and everything they fight for.
Perhaps a clever soldier critic like your self would be able to quote from me ? No ? Pity. Just keep making **** up then, thats the boy.

Say what you like Toy Gun. It matters not. I work with real experts daily, and these people who I respect have no issue with homosexuals. I've asked. I have coworkers who are gay veterans. They fought like hell too, and would probably kick your ass for even thinking about giving them a dirty look, let alone disrespect their service.

You see, that's the tell here. This is where your poker face gives you up for the coward you are. For all your talk about your "experience" you are just hiding behind a fig leaf. If you actually felt honor and brotherhood with your fellow soldiers, you would not be disrespecting their service.

The fact that you can, shows what you know: Jack ****.
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1 Reply

@Diest TKO,

Quote:

Unless you believe that straight men don't use loop-holes to get out of the military

that is the point, straight guys do not have the same benefit of being able to leave when they want to that the gays and women have....it is not a level playing field and this institution favoritism causes problems in the force.

Straight guys can get out, but the price is a dishonorable discharge, which follows you for the rest of your life and makes it difficult to get many jobs. Women tend to play gay to get out if they dont want a baby and have the army pay for the birth, but men generally dont want to go that way if they are straight.

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@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
Unless you believe that straight men don't use loop-holes to get out of the military
that is the point, straight guys do not have the same benefit of being able to leave when they want to that the gays and women have....it is not a level playing field and this institution favoritism causes problems in the force.

Straight guys can get out, but the price is a dishonorable discharge, which follows you for the rest of you life and makes it difficult to get many jobs.

They do, and they have. You think that gays and women have an advantage in the military? Oh I see! You're stupid. Why didn't you say that to begin with?

The notion that gays and women have an advantage in the military is notably stupid. You poor thing.

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1 Reply

@Diest TKO,

Quote:

I work with real experts daily, and these people who I respect have no issue with homosexuals. I've asked.

And thats as close as you are going to get to serving your country...cheer up..maybe the airconditioning will break down and they will give you a medal for remembering how to exacuate the building.

Quote:

you would not be disrespecting their service.

And again, I find myself asking you to show me where I have done that...but you cant can you ? Just make **** up like homosexuals and women arent affecting the service.. Just keep making **** up and pray no-one checks you.

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@Diest TKO,

Quote:

They do, and they have. You think that gays and women have an advantage in the military? Oh I see! You're stupid. Why didn't you say that to begin with? The notion that gays and women have an advantage in the military is notably stupid. You poor thing.

You havent addressed a single issue raised. Just your opinion and that is worth less than ice to a penguin. What a cloth cock.

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@hawkeye10,

Quote:

that is the point, straight guys do not have the same benefit of being able to leave when they want to that the gays and women have....it is not a level playing field and this institution favoritism causes problems in the force.

First you wish to maintain that loop hole and the gay men and women of the military wish to close it so your complain make no sense.

Second anyone can get out of the military by claiming they had been in the closet and that they are in fact gay even marriage persons could do so.

1 Reply

@Ionus,

Ionus wrote:

I missed your post somehow the first time around. Just exactly how did this report by two biased individuals measure the strength of a unit when it is being heavily attacked and incurring casualties ?

I don't know, never having read the report itself. I imagine they actually talked to members of the IDF, gay and straight, and asked them questions about their experiences in the service. Which, I'll hasten to add, is a good deal more research on the subject than you've ever conducted.

Ionus wrote:

Because I have never said that women and homosexuals are incapable of filing, or maintaining technical equipment. They break down unit cohesion. The best units do not fight for politics. They are men fighting for each other.

And how did you measure "unit cohesion" among troops with gay and straight soldiers fighting in the same unit?

Ionus wrote:

Why wont women serve in their own units ?

Why are you talking about women in combat positions? This is a thread about gays serving in the military. Those are two different issues.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

Quote:

First you wish to maintain that loop hole and the gay men and women of the military wish to close it so your complain make no sense

You dont pay attention do you.....I am pro allowing gays to serve openly.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Quote:

You dont pay attention do you.....I am pro allowing gays to serve openly.

This thread is going on forever and it can be hard to keep track of who is where, when any one of your posting is not clear on the subject.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

jsyk, by position is that gays serving should be fine, but that on the subject of gays and all others we need to be able to talk honestly, openly, and intelligently and we have the right to determine ourselves where we go. What I object to is this liberal idea that starts from the position that gays are just like everyone else and works backwards to make all conversation conform to this script. Anyone who dares to say or point to anything that does not support the desired outcome is branded bigot or worse, which to my mind is more obscene than the worst of sexual pornography.

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@hawkeye10,

History does not show us starting from "gays are just like us." Instead, they have been treated as mental patients with sociopathic disorders, and obscured to a level of social leprosy. So, after decades and centuries of them being treated as inequals, we have learned this is wrong.

If your concern is with society being able to decide, then they most certainly have, and we are lagging behind other nations in this regard.

The idea that gays harm the military is a myth. We see no such harm. So even if I could not convince you that gays are equal to you and me, there is no compelling reason to ban them from serving their country. Certainly there are gay men and women who are more fit to serve than some straight men in the service.

The wholesale banning of gays in the military is playing politics with the military, not the reverse. It's not some liberal line item.

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@Diest TKO,

you are totally outside my point and my concern.....you are pushing your conclusions on this one small matter, where as I am defending the need and right to hold an honest debate or discussion on this subject as well as all others.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Quote:

What I object to is this liberal idea that starts from the position that gays are just like everyone else

Who happen to be claiming that gays and straights are the same in all elements?

I see no requirement that one would need to assume that to be for gays openly serving in the arm forces

I for one do not support gay marriages as I see no state interest in promoting or licensing gay relationships.

Still I see no reason not to allow them to serve openly in the military.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

Quote:

Who happen to be claiming that gays and straights are the same in all elements

good point: it is encouraged that we talk about ways that gays are better than straights, for instance they are more colorful and better at interior design, it is any whiff that they might not be as good as straights at anything that cant be talked about.

Re marriage.....we came to about the same conclusion, though I am not apposed to granting gay marriage if doing so will not hurt the institution of marriage and also will not hurt the society (thinking primarily of encouraging homosexuality having a destabilizing effect on sexual identity across the society). I think the idea needs more study, and that our rush into it is stupidity in action.

And we seem to agree on the question of gays in the military...

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@hawkeye10,

off topic....is there any way to reverse the disabling of most of the site navigation tools today? HA HA, what a funny joke!

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THe PC Police Again Shut Down Truth Seaking

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