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Is Evolution a Dangerous Idea? If so, why?

 
 
Ionus
 
  0  
Reply Sat 24 Apr, 2010 11:43 pm
@Jason Proudmoore,
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So before the Bible people thought the earth was a globe, right ?
How many times do I have to tell you that there were people who knew the Earth was a sphere? Yes, some people knew this...and the church didn't want to acknowledge the idea.
The Church was against the idea because the Bible that was written after this was known, was against it ?
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There werent many scientists in fishing and trading boats since the dawn of humanity but they were religious.
What is your point here?
Humble religious men in boats knew the earth was round and scientists took up the idea.
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No, you made the claim the Bible states the earth is flat, you prove it....
I did prove it...don't you remember?
So you are avoiding the heart of your own argument because you can not prove it.

Ionus
 
  0  
Reply Sat 24 Apr, 2010 11:50 pm
@Jason Proudmoore,
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Wasn't I leading?
No, you werent.
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Why would I lie ?
You've done it many times...
Then you can prove one or admit you can not and will apologise.
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But you like to defend Christians
Yes, from psuedo-scientists who's ego is writing cheques their intelligence can not cash.
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but you like to diminish science
I love science with a strong passion and I dont think you know enough about the psycholgy of religion to criticise.
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why wouldn't I think you're a Christian?
Because I have said I wasnt.
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Is it only Christians you pathologically attack ?
No attacks...just trying to make them see reason...same with Muslims, Jews, and even UFO abductees...they all irrationals...
Your lack of knowledge of psychology and your lack of human warmth is brutally confronting.
Ionus
 
  0  
Reply Sat 24 Apr, 2010 11:56 pm
@Jason Proudmoore,
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gave the example of the scientists who are also religious and interpret the Bible differently...
Show me.
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I gave reasons why it was called the Dark Ages and who named it. You said civilisation was dark and you couldnt say who named it...remember now ?
Who named what?
The Dark Ages.
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Bullshitting is not a profession, Ionus...
More the pity for you, because you try to be good at it.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 06:22 am
@Ionus,
you guys done yet? Its getting weird to read all this e-flirting.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 07:58 am
A simple "**** off" or "Kiss my ass creep" would have been sufficient. Razz
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 08:39 am
@edgarblythe,
wht, you dont like my way of asking them to quit the exchange of bumper stickers?
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 08:43 am
@farmerman,
I meant that they could have ended it that way pages ago.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 08:49 am
Sneaked from Wandeljw's post on Latest Challenges to Evolution thread:

It's pretty easy to imagine ways that we could prove the theory of evolution isn't true. Just find one fossil " yes, just one, that is clearly out of sequence with evolution.

By dating the rocks in which the fossils are found, scientists have built up a clear picture of the tree of life evolving.

If you can dig up a fossil of some human remains that predate the evolution of primates, you've proven humans couldn't have evolved.

Dig up a primate that predates the evolution of mammals and you've shown that primates could not have evolved.

Find, as J B S Haldane put it, a rabbit in the Precambrian period. Just one will do.

Yet millions of fossils are dug up every year and they all sit perfectly within the tree of evolution.

Nothing excites a scientist more than proving an established theory wrong, and finding that one fossil would likely win the scientist a Nobel Prize.

Yet in the 150 years since Darwin published his theory of evolution, nobody has found one.
farmerman
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 08:57 am
@edgarblythe,
I read Wandels post and was gonna drag the one line that "A scientist just loves to be able to prove evolution wrong , it would probably win him a Nobel Prize".

On a different tack, some of what used to be colleagues are now somewhat famous Creationists in the US. Im gonna post some **** from sources (Wike and Geoline and NCSE) about some of these clowns. Im gonna start with
KURT WISE

Quote:
In 1989,Wise earned a Ph.D. in Geology from Harvard University where he studied under the supervision of Stephen Jay Gould.[1] In addition, he has an M.A. in Geology from Harvard University and a B.A. Geology from the University of Chicago. In 1998, Robert Schadewald described Wise as influential on "modern creationism as it is practiced at its higher levels."[2]

[edit] Career
Starting in fall 2009 he has been the director of Truett-McConnell College's newly created Creation Research Center in Cleveland, Georgia.[3] Between August 2006 and May 2009 he taught at Southern Baptist Theological Seminary as director of the school's Center for Theology and Science, a job in which he was preceded by intelligent design creationist William Dembski.[4][5] He had previously taught at Bryan College in Tennessee where he served as Director of the Center for Origins Research and as an Associate Professor of Science[4] for seventeen years.[3]

He served as consultant to the Answers in Genesis Creation Museum which opened in 2007.[6] Timothy H. Heaton, another scientist who studied under Gould, knows Wise as "a less propaganda-oriented creationist" than Ken Ham, the leader of Answers in Genesis, and said that Wise's influence on the displays was apparent.[6]

Wise has said he believes, according to a literal reading of the Bible, "that the earth is young, and the universe is young, I would suggest that it’s less than ten thousand years in age." He believes that science can be used to support and demonstrate these claims.[7] Despite believing that science supports his position, Wise has written that "if all the evidence in the universe turns against creationism, I would be the first to admit it, but I would still be a creationist because that is what the Word of God seems to indicate."[8] When asked if scientific conclusions should be constrained by the Bible, Wise answered that "science has never been closed to people who had ideas they wouldn't change. Every scientist has a set of presuppositions and assumptions that he never questions."[9]





When asked about Wise, Gould would just shake his head in diswbelief. "He did have strong convictions but I always thought he felt that his God was a transcendent one". Too bad Steven Gould dies in 2003, I would have enjoyed some dust ups because Wise is also a smart ass who takes glee in dismissing science by cutting and pasting only the "Out of context" bits. Hes never engaged in a real argument against anyone other than some beleagured small college geology prof who makes up an entire department of one.

0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 08:58 am
@farmerman,
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you guys done yet? Its getting weird to read all this e-flirting.


Surely you are not reading it fm?

But it is fascinating that it is happening you must admit. Everything that a scientist sees happening has its interest. Whether is it more interesting than Galapagos finches is a function of temperment.

One might easily imagine that a fascination with feathered creatures is a displacement mechanism expressing a fear of a fascination with Shropshire County Ladies, and their ilk, who are familiar with the works of Jane Austen or Henry Fielding. Laurence Stern's productions having been hidden from their sight.

I would hazard a guess that they are nowhere near being done yet.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 09:01 am
They can have at it. I don't mind.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 09:17 am
@edgarblythe,

THE FALLACY OF EVOLUTION -by Fred Williams



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Introduction
One of the most effective pitches evolutionists use to sell their theory is their claim that the fossil record supports evolution. This could not be farther from the truth; in fact the fossil record provides powerful and overwhelming evidence that evolution did not occur on earth. So how is the evolutionist able to effectively sell to their audience the precise opposite of what the data shows? They achieve this by employing a clever sleight-of-hand with the fossil data that can easily be missed by any reasonable person. The purpose of this article is to expose this sleight-of-hand, which will then dissolve the false illusion it creates. Once the curtain is pulled and the illusion exposed, the truth can clearly be seen " the fossil record is an overwhelming and devastating contradiction to evolution.

The Sleight-of-Hand
Here’s the catch, the magic behind the illusion. Whenever an evolutionist presents his line of evidence for evolution in the fossil record, he will without fail, virtually every time, present a vertebrate transitional fossil. Why is this important? The evolutionist is failing to mention to his audience that vertebrates constitute less than .01% of the entire fossil record, and of these fossils, most species are represented by a bone or less!1 What about the other 99.99% of the fossil record? That’s the other key piece of information the evolutionist is withholding from you. Complex invertebrates make up the vast majority of this portion of the record, roughly 95%. We have cataloged literally millions of different species of these very complex creatures, and we have entire fossils, not just pieces here and there. In this rich and virtually complete portion of the fossil record, there is not a single sign of evolution, whatsoever!!!2
edgarblythe
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 10:20 am
@farmerman,
I would be laughing if it were not so sickening.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 11:10 am
@edgarblythe,
That's not an argument Ed.

I would speculate that there are more invertebrates alive today than all the vertebrates that ever existed. What say you fm?
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 11:13 am
@spendius,
I was not arguing with fm. I was agreeing with him.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 11:16 am
@edgarblythe,
In the post you responded to fm didn't say anything.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 11:19 am
@spendius,
By implecation.
Jason Proudmoore
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 12:11 pm
@Ionus,
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You have to read it within its original context to understand it. THAT is the point.

You wrote:
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Your religious bigotry for science prevents you from understanding
people.

I wrote:
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Isn't this a oxymoron?

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you responded:

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No.

Science doesn't believe in the supernatural...God or gods are part of the supernatural, which aren't perceived with no measurable, scientific means...your comment is contradictory, which qualifies as an oxymoron...

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No, it means I did read what you wrote and I am helping you in your desire to maintain your chosen appearance as a greek philosopher.

Help me out here...which Greek philosopher do you think I resemble? And then, take your morning pill...
Jason Proudmoore
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 12:21 pm
@Ionus,
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I agree. So dont use it in the hope someone will give up and go away.

Are you afraid that someone might leave the thread? Are you doing all this for attention or for education purposes?

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For the people that have God in their lives THEY are the ones supported and you wish to take that away so they can all be like you.

Are you telling me that it is better to live a lie than to find the real truth... to be gullible...to do irrational things not because it is the right thing to do, but because God wants you to do it? Believing in God, anything is possible... and even the most heinous things are justified...

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And once it passes peer review it can not be proven wrong. Correct ?

Can't you understand English, Ionus? I've told you many, many times that you have to prove it wrong in order to disqualify a theory as being factual...or a failure...how should I explain this in a way that you may understand? It has to pass a scientific peer review team in order for the theory or scientific explanation to be correct...
Jason Proudmoore
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 12:55 pm
@Ionus,
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The Church was against the idea because the Bible that was written after this was known, was against it ?

You mean the Torah was written after this? And the Bible, which the Torah (the five books of Moses) is part of was against the idea that the world was round or flat?

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Humble religious men in boats knew the earth was round and scientists took up the idea.

And those men took the idea from the Bible or they observed that the Earth didn't resemble flatness?

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So you are avoiding the heart of your own argument because you can not prove it.

But I already did prove it...and you just helped me.
 

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