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Obama Nixes Traditional Long School Summer Vacations

 
 
FreeDuck
 
  2  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2009 10:43 am
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:

Personally, I think school days are already too long, and are really designed to only meet the needs of working parents.

I'm sure it depends on the local school system, but I can say that the school day here is absolutely NOT designed to meet the needs of working parents. If it was, it would be from 8:30 to 5:00.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2009 10:46 am
@Brandon9000,
What issue is there to address? Your imagined outrage at Mr. Obama? Do you have any good reason to assume that the tens of thousands of local school districts in the United States are going to move as a body to shorten or end summer vacations?

I don't give a rat's ass what your motives are. In a debate, it is perfectly acceptable to point out that the premise is flawed, or that a logical fallacy is being deployed. And that is what i have done. So long as you attempt to claim that something else is going on here, i will continue to point it out.

The fallacy you have used is unfair entrapment, in that anyone discussing this topic as though there were a real probability of students' summer vacations being shortened or eliminated has accept your flawed premise--that this is imminent generally, and specifically that Mr. Obama is responsible.
Merry Andrew
 
  2  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2009 10:50 am
@DrewDad,
Quote:
Personally, I think school days are already too long, and are really designed to only meet the needs of working parents.


Personally, I think that's one of the silliest statements you've ever made, Drew.
0 Replies
 
boomerang
 
  2  
Reply Mon 28 Sep, 2009 10:53 am
Quote:
I don't think that every child in the country should be forced to forego summer vacation because some children have bad home situations. The bad home situations, e.g. being too poor to buy food, should be addressed separately. Children should have a considerable amount of time off to just be kids and not be treated as though they were adult workers only smaller.


If you think those hungry, unsupervised kids effect the quality of education that your kids are getting, think again.

There are a thousand studies on hunger and school performance. Hungry kids don't do as well in school and those kids can slow down the rest of the class. Three months of poor nutrition are not easily remidied.

I live in a very upscale urban neighborhood and 14% of the students at my son's school are eligable for the free/reduced price food program. (Find out how your kid's school stacks up at www.greatschools.com -- click "school environment", then "students".)
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Sep, 2009 11:38 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

What issue is there to address? Your imagined outrage at Mr. Obama? Do you have any good reason to assume that the tens of thousands of local school districts in the United States are going to move as a body to shorten or end summer vacations?

I don't give a rat's ass what your motives are. In a debate, it is perfectly acceptable to point out that the premise is flawed, or that a logical fallacy is being deployed. And that is what i have done. So long as you attempt to claim that something else is going on here, i will continue to point it out.

The fallacy you have used is unfair entrapment, in that anyone discussing this topic as though there were a real probability of students' summer vacations being shortened or eliminated has accept your flawed premise--that this is imminent generally, and specifically that Mr. Obama is responsible.

Obama expressed an opinion. If the article is to be believed, he would like to see the school year extended. The topic which you haven't spent much time addressing is whether this is a good idea or a bad idea. With your ridiculously excessive anger, and swearing, and comments about the poster, you might want to devote a sentence or two to the topic raised.
mismi
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 08:36 am
http://newsone.com/nation/president-obama-wants-longer-school-days/

I do not mind the year around school option. I would rather not have it...but I am okay if it went to that. What I do not like the idea of is kids being required to be in school until 5:00pm and on Saturdays. If I read the above article correctly - this is already being implemented at some schools.

I can't even imagine being away from my kids that long. I understand the need for safe daycare for those who work...but would this require my children to remain in school until 5:00pm Monday through Friday and some Saturdays - even though I do not require after care of any kind?

I am a little unfocused right now - so things are not sinking in as I would like them to...but I must say that makes me feel a little twinge thinking it might happen.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 01:07 pm
@Brandon9000,
Quote:
Obama expressed an opinion.


So what? Is he your messiah?

Quote:
If the article is to be believed, he would like to see the school year extended.


So what? Is he your messiah?

Quote:
The topic which you haven't spent much time addressing is whether this is a good idea or a bad idea.


That would be the topic, if there were any substantive reason to believe that his opinion matters with regard to the length and dates of the school year. There isn't, so that is no reason to discuss this foolishness.

Quote:
With your ridiculously excessive anger, and swearing, and comments about the poster, you might want to devote a sentence or two to the topic raised.


Once again, tediously, i am not angry, let alone excessively angry. That's a puerile charge which you make to suggest that i am motivated by emotion rather than reason. You are wrong about that. I haven't devoted any sentences to the topic you allege to have raised because there is no reason to discuss it. Local school boards or state boards of education make the decisions about the school year, not Mr. Obama. That means that there will be the possibility of at least dozens of systems, if not actually thousands--the former if states make the decisions, the latter if local school boards make the decisions.

Please remind me of what "comments about the poster" you are referring to.
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 03:25 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

Quote:
Obama expressed an opinion.


So what? Is he your messiah?

Quote:
If the article is to be believed, he would like to see the school year extended.


So what? Is he your messiah?

Quote:
The topic which you haven't spent much time addressing is whether this is a good idea or a bad idea.


That would be the topic, if there were any substantive reason to believe that his opinion matters with regard to the length and dates of the school year. There isn't, so that is no reason to discuss this foolishness.

Quote:
With your ridiculously excessive anger, and swearing, and comments about the poster, you might want to devote a sentence or two to the topic raised.


Once again, tediously, i am not angry, let alone excessively angry. That's a puerile charge which you make to suggest that i am motivated by emotion rather than reason. You are wrong about that. I haven't devoted any sentences to the topic you allege to have raised because there is no reason to discuss it. Local school boards or state boards of education make the decisions about the school year, not Mr. Obama. That means that there will be the possibility of at least dozens of systems, if not actually thousands--the former if states make the decisions, the latter if local school boards make the decisions.

Please remind me of what "comments about the poster" you are referring to.

You say that you're not angry, but this would strike most people as expressing anger:

Setanta wrote:

And as long as you continue to attempt to imply--dishonestly, i might add--that Mr. Obama has any such authority, i'll stay in your pathetic, lying, false hysteria thread.


You ask me what comments about the poster. In the above quotation, you call me dishonest and say that I am lying. Elsewhere you use the phrase, "had you any shame." I actually don't care much, but since you ask, these are examples of comments about the poster. It seems that most of your argument strategy consists of changing the subject. You did point out correctly that the title was poorly chosen, since Obama can only recommend and not legislate. Had I the chance to do it over, I'd change the title to "Obama Comes out in Favor of Shortening School Summer Vacations." The main subject of the thread, the merit of shortening the traditional summer vacation, certainly could be discussed, is interesting to some people, and is being discussed here by several people. You simply prefer ranting and talking about the poster to discussing it.
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 05:50 pm
@Brandon9000,
Quote:
You say that you're not angry, but this would strike most people as expressing anger:


Then most people would be wrong, and to insist upon that is an argumentum ad populum fallacy. You can't see my face, nor my posture, nor hear me speak nor hear the tone of my voice. You have absolutely no clue what my emotional state is at any time that i post anything.

Once again, it is puerile to attempt to suggest your interlocutor is angry in a lame attempt to suggest that yours is the voice of sweet reason while your interlocutor is in the throes of irrational emotion--which is the only reason you wish to insist that i'm angry. Don't kid yourself, Bubba, you're just not that important to me.

Yes, when you attempt to imply that Mr. Obama possesses an authority which he does not in fact possess, that is dishonest. It only becomes a lie, however, if you state it outright, so it is your paranoid fantasy that i've said you are lying.

Really, this is pretty sad. If you are that sensitive, you really have no business engaging in debate. If the kitchen's too hot, don't go in there. I've launched far worse at many people, and happen to have a high opinion of your intelligence. I just don't consider that you employ it when politics enter the picture.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 05:53 pm
By the way, it is not just the title of the thread, in your first post you drag Obama into it. And in a rhetorical venue, it is completely appropriate to discuss the nature of any proposition, including the title of the thread. Get over it.
0 Replies
 
littlek
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 05:57 pm
As a teacher and aunt (well, it's something), I agree that either we should have longer school days to help out working parents and or we should have shorter summers - especially if we get more breaks during the school year.

But, our summer isn't three months! Our summer this year was just under 9 weeks. That's three weeks short of 3 months.

Our district offers a summer program, currently, for students with LDs - helps them retain what they've learned. I work that shift. So, I had two weeks summer vacation.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 07:16 pm
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:
Personally, I think school days are already too long, and are really designed to only meet the needs of working parents.


If that was the case, school hours would be more like 6:00 a.m. to 7:00 p.m.
0 Replies
 
 

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