caribou
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Sep, 2009 08:41 am
I'm not a parent. That's my disclaimer.
It always seems to me that when stuff happens, parents always talk about what they (the parents) should say or what they have said.
I'm always more interested in what the kid has to say.
I'd probably tell her that I found the item, and ask her what she was planning to do, what she was thinking about. I'd listen. Depending on what she said, I'd be directing the conversation, trying to get her to see all sides and consequences. Until, ideally, she would come to a responsible decision.

Of course, if that didn't happen, or couldn't happen. I'd lay down the law. If she lives under your roof and is being supported by you then this is how she needs to behave. Talk her through the expectations, which would include how you expect her to responsibly handle the stolen item situation. If any of the expectations are not met, then the consequences will be that she can no longer live there or receive any support.
By tip-toeing around her feelings, worrying about driving her to suicide, accepting the fact that she disappears when something happens that she doesn't like, her not going to counseling, you are ENABLING her to continue her behavior.

It's long past the time for her to act like an adult.

I might not be a parent but I've seen first hand what accommodating your child can do to everyone in the family.

And, yeah, like everyone else here, it's just an opinion. You need to do what you think is best. I wish you well. Parenting is not for the faint of heart.
Eorl
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Sep, 2009 08:46 am
@caribou,
All the responses here seem like the response I'd give if the girl was 10. At 18, we are talking about an adult who no doubt expects to be treated as one at this point, and just disappears when that isn't happening. I think it's a bit late for a morality lesson. No idea what I would do. No-one will agree with me, but I think I'd put it back and at the right time, go through the options with her about what would happen if you did find it, talk about what you hope she might do herself and how you could help. So you might make it obvious you know, but giving her the chance to deal with it. Or, if she chooses, not. Then you're back to square one. There's a degree of criminality in your own actions on this path obviously. Tough call for sure.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Sep, 2009 08:56 am
@trickysitu,
trickysitu wrote:
A couple of weeks ago I discovered the missing item when I was cleaning out her closet. I really need some advice on how to handle this situation.......I realize the item must be returned!


I think I'd start by removing the item from the closet, so that nothing further can happen to it.

0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Sep, 2009 09:37 pm
So what's the deal, Tricky? Are you still in possession of stolen property with the intent to conceal a crime? (Not good.)
Amigo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Sep, 2009 10:20 pm
@trickysitu,
If you defend your daughter in her theft in any way it will send a deep messege that will turn her into a lifelong dishonest person. It happened in my family. You will pay later if you do not show her some serious consequences now.
0 Replies
 
Lightwizard
 
  2  
Reply Fri 18 Sep, 2009 11:30 pm
@OCCOM BILL,
Truer words were never wrought. Stolen property is stolen property whatever the motive or method. Concealing a crime is as bad as the crime itself.
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Fri 18 Sep, 2009 11:39 pm
@Lightwizard,
Some people still believe in family, and family obligations. for us what you and bill suggest is abhorrent. Those who would turn to the agents of the collective and thus allow those agents to harm our family, when other options exist and likely would work better, are the dregs of humanity.

You take care of those closest to you first!!!
CalamityJane
 
  3  
Reply Sat 19 Sep, 2009 08:02 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

.... are the dregs of humanity.


Oh my, hawkeye is talking about the dregs of humanity - laughable. It takes
one to know one!

Bottom line: the teenager has stolen a very valuable item and the mother
is trying to shield her "baby". Probably not the first time. A crime is a crime
is a crime.

hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sat 19 Sep, 2009 09:47 am
@CalamityJane,
Quote:
the mother
is trying to shield her "baby


Really?? Kindly identify the words from the mother which brought you to this conclusion.
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Sep, 2009 01:20 pm
@hawkeye10,
The fact that the girl has a habit of running away from her problems indicates that she's been allowed to get away with that in the past.
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sat 19 Sep, 2009 01:34 pm
@DrewDad,
that is possible....there are also many other possibilities. Relationships are complicated, and you know next to nothing about this one. The only one here who is qualified to speak on the relationship is the mother, and she said nothing which indicates that she agrees with the conclusions that have been reached by the all knowing a2k members.
DrewDad
 
  2  
Reply Sat 19 Sep, 2009 01:43 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
the all knowing a2k members.

The "you can't possibly know" line is trite.

The fact that you are incapable of drawing inferences from what has been written does not prevent me from doing so.

Quit your whining.
0 Replies
 
CalamityJane
 
  3  
Reply Sat 19 Sep, 2009 02:01 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
Really?? Kindly identify the words from the mother which brought you to this conclusion.


When panzade told of the story that he had to return stolen candy and apologize
for it which was embarrassing for him and taught him a lesson for life, mommy
dearest replied this

Quote:
That's why we have to treat this with tenderness......could scar her for life!


Scar her for life? That "baby" is 18 years old and committed a crime and
she wants to treat this with tenderness.

Next thing we hear is that the 18 year old adult daughter practically had
to steal these valuable things (we still don't know what it was) as her
allowance wasn't high enough. Yeah, poor baby!
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sat 19 Sep, 2009 02:13 pm
@CalamityJane,
sounds right. I am for one warning and then lowering the boom, except I would never suggest that it is a good idea to bring the police into it.

close enough: agreed
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Sun 20 Sep, 2009 01:39 am
First thing I would do is run this by a lawyer.

First question is it valuable enough to be a possible felony in your state? If not and if she was 17 at the time I would more then likely just go with her and have her return the item but I would still listen to the lawyer.

In fact, the lawyer could be the agent of returning the item and sounding out the family at the same time to see if they would agree not to press charges if the person came forward and apologize.

The lawyer being the firewall to protect your daughter and he/she could then also explain to your daughter how bad of a problem she could had found herself in it she have been found out.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Sun 20 Sep, 2009 05:09 am
@trickysitu,
trickysitu wrote:

To all that have been so kind to offer up a solution to my dilema....
going to spend a few more days pondering the situation.
But I think I really know the right thing to do,
just need the encouragement for all of you.
Thanks again....I'll keep ya posted
Tricky: BE CAREFUL !

This might possibly be DANGEROUS.
We don 't know whether this is felonious,
with possibly severe and permanent consequences.

Its e z for posters to advise u here to call the police or to go around confessing to crimes
or pointing the finger at your child; thay have no liability exposure. Their children r safe.
Thay can just forget about it, after this thread is finished.

We don 't know whether u might and your child might have such exposure, possibly in felony.
We don 't know whether there might also be civil liability, in tort.
We don t know whether she will become disabled from getting licensure for future professional licenses
or suffer other ill effects, maybe exclusion from some jobs, or from educational institutions, or not, etc., etc., fines and/or imprisonment or not.
We don 't know whether YOU might also, as an accessory after the fact, arguably in possession of the stolen property.

To whom do u owe your LOYALTY ?
To society ?
To the law ?
or to yourself and to your child ?

I have never had children, but if (for example) my mother
had been in that situation, for sure I 'd subordinate the law to her well-being.
The law woud have come in a very distant second to my mother 's well-being.

If u rat-out your child to the property owners,
do u think that she will ever trust u again for the rest of your life ?
Do u believe that she will see u as TREACHEROUS:
as an enemy whose loyalty is to the law and to society, rather than to your own blood ?
If she knows, or later finds out, information about u that u 'd rather keep confidential, will she respect your privacy?
or will she return the favor ?
Is it worth it to introduce strife into your family? U must decide that.


If I were in your situation, I 'd consider discussing the return of the stolen property
in a way that cannot be traced back to u nor to your child
and consider having an earnest conversation with her about the merits of avoiding a life of crime,
but remember that your natural loyalty is TO HER;
let society be damned.

If u permit this information to fall into the hands of the owners of the property, or of the police,
we don 't know whether that might have very painful,
deleterious and permanent results for both of u.
You and your daughter have a constitutional right to avoid uttering any self-incriminatory statements.
Anything that u say can and possibly WILL be used against u in a court of law, civilly and/or criminally.

U have control of the situation UNTIL u spill the proverbial beans.
Then, control passes out of your hands and u can only hope and wish and shudder.

Seek the professional advice of an attorney of your state.
He can take the time to do whatever legal research is necessary,
examining the applicable law of whatever state u live in,
and apply it to the facts of your case, as will be revealed
in his interviews of yourself and of your daughter,
which no one on this board has done,
neither as to the law, nor as to the facts.
He will be bound to keep your secrets.





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Sun 20 Sep, 2009 10:57 pm
@panzade,
panzade wrote:

In my post I mentioned that my circumstances were different,
but she was a minor when she did it and I think she should return the object and apologize. Period
and pay for her own criminal defense lawyer

I wonder whether Tricky will be arrested as an accessory after the fact.
Arguably, she was in possession of the stolen property.
I wonder whether that was felony grand larceny.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Sep, 2009 11:11 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
Arguably


YOu are not sure?? Come on now, it is a slam-dunk damn sure possession of stolen goods. We live amongst a collective that feels free to take possession of homes and cars which are used for illegal purposes, on the grounds that even if the owners did not participate in the illegal activity or gain from it, they allowed it and thus should be punished. Taking a house seems to be cruel and unusual punishment, but maybe that it just me.

Our OP should read some stories of what happens when parents haul their kids into the cops to "teach them a lesson" ...it is often heart breaking. All they wanted was a little help from the agents of the collective in dealing with their kids, and instead they tend to get not only their kids but also themselves locked into a financially and emotionally expensive legal fight against the collective. Being naive can be very costly.
ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Sun 20 Sep, 2009 11:20 pm
I frankly don't remember if I mentioned that I just finished reading Lorenzo Carcaterra's book, Sleepers. And since I have read it, I'd say, be careful, to the daughter.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Sun 20 Sep, 2009 11:32 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
Arguably


YOu are not sure?? Come on now, it is a slam-dunk damn sure possession of stolen goods. We live amongst a collective that feels free to take possession of homes and cars which are used for illegal purposes, on the grounds that even if the owners did not participate in the illegal activity or gain from it, they allowed it and thus should be punished. Taking a house seems to be cruel and unusual punishment, but maybe that it just me.

Our OP should read some stories of what happens when parents haul their kids into the cops to "teach them a lesson" ...it is often heart breaking. All they wanted was a little help from the agents of the collective in dealing with their kids, and instead they tend to get not only their kids but also themselves locked into a financially and emotionally expensive legal fight against the collective. Being naive can be very costly.
I did not comment upon my state-of-mind.
I choose not to make definitive legal conclusions.
I have urged caution as to both mother and child.
Read my first post.





David
0 Replies
 
 

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