trickysitu
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 04:09 pm
@ossobuco,
I'm thinking blackmail.........but still unsure. Made a counselling appointment today for her, like I said before she might not be inclined to attend the session, but if I use the stolen item as leverage, maybe the professional can help with the situation. Thought? ossobuco thank-you for the welcome, everyone here and made post on this topic have been really helpful.
Izzie
 
  2  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 04:28 pm
@trickysitu,
Try to avoid making a hasty decision here... you been in possession of the item for a couple weeks - just a few days to get a little more information and perspective may be a wise choice.

Someone may come along and can give you "expert" advice...

try and talk to someone close to home, and if a counsellor is required re the remarks you made earlier - then get that in place first.

If this is as big as you think it could be..... you need to make an informed decision based on a lot of different standpoints. Only you know your girl, find out the legalities, you could maybe phone an insurance company just making an anon enquiry as tho what the policy would be and would they press charges. Theres nearly always some nice person who will talk to you if you can ask the right questions, change the questions saying that it was your property and you received a claim payent, what would happen now it is recovered and what would happen to the person who had taken it, especially as they hadn't benefitted it (i.e. sold it for dosh/drugs ets) and wished to return it - and remain anonymous. Call a lawyer if poss.

Please don't make a real hasty decision. I understand this could be eating you up - but look a little further than next week and the impact it could have. Perhaps, the police may be even able to assist you for your daughter to take responsibility, be held accountable, but not with such dire conseuqences - do you know a friendly copper who would talk to you. Dunno where you are or what part of the US if so, cities are different to the country.

Very good luck and keep us posted.

Hope you can find a little peace here.

Take care of you and yours.
0 Replies
 
Merry Andrew
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 04:37 pm
I do agree with Phoenix here. Community service is not a particularly good idea. It sends the message that community service is punishment whereas it should be viewed as a joyful sharing of one's time, something one should do because it's a good thing, not because it's been mandated by a court or a parent.

I also completely agree with Calamity Jane. McGentrix is being his usual self-centered selfish self. Nothing whatever is gained by simply protecting the child instead of using this event as a teaching opportunity. As CJ has said, handled that way, the only message that will come through is, "do what you please. Daddy and mommy will cover for you. Cool."
panzade
 
  2  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 04:51 pm
I don't know if this will help because the circumstances are different, but when I was about eleven I stole something from my Scoutmaster and my parents made me return it to him and apologize.

It was the most excruciating moment of my young life and I remember the shame to this day
trickysitu
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 04:54 pm
@panzade,
That's why we have to treat this with tenderness......could scar her for life!
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 04:57 pm
@Merry Andrew,
I may send you a copy of Sleepers..MA. Though I exaggerate - I don't foresee this all going that kind of bad. I do think tricky needs some legal advice and probable family counselling advice, which sounds easy but isn't with the recalcitrant, as I figure you know.

I do agree that daughter could benefit by some intervention, but intervention is, to me, fraught with possibilities for making things worse.

Eighteen is the problem number here, not that I know details on how that works.
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  2  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 04:57 pm
@trickysitu,
What I meant was, it was a good lesson and left me understanding that stealing is wrong....not that it scarred me for life. A Life Lesson.
0 Replies
 
Phoenix32890
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 05:02 pm
@panzade,
panzade- In one of my posts I mentioned that I would behave differently if the girl were 12. I can certainly understand that at the age of 11, you DID learn a good lesson that you will never forget.

At 18, there is a big difference, and IMO, things have to be handled a bit differently.

As different facts become known, I am curious about a few things:

What does this girl do? Go to high school? College? Work? Is she sucessful at what she does?

How much is the stolen item worth? The worth of the item might well make a difference if the police become involved. (Grand vs. petty larceny)

What other, if any, behavioral problems has the girl exhibited?

What is this business about her leaving when things don't go her way? Where does she go?

I get the impression that some people on this forum are perceiving her as a kid. Good grief, she's eighteen. She can vote, and she can join the army. She is not a baby. I know that some 18 year olds are immature, but they are expected to behave responsibly.
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 05:06 pm
@Phoenix32890,
In my post I mentioned that my circumstances were different, but she was a minor when she did it and I think she should return the object and apologize. Period
FreeDuck
 
  3  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 06:04 pm
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:

Whoa. Send it back anonymously and punish her yourself. Too often these things can blow up and cause a lot of fuss. You have no idea how the people will react to finding out your daughter stole their object. It's expensive and time consuming when authorities get involved.

Best bet, clean it very well to get rid of any fingerprints or identifying marks of who had possession of it and leave it on their doorstep or back door or what ever. Take caution if it is breakable.

Then sit her down, explain to her what she did wrong and then work out a punishment. Community service is always a good idea and there is nothing wrong with that. Take away some privileges as well. Punishment is suppose to suck.

Let her know that this was also her one get out jail free card and if she ever does something like that again, you will take to the cops yourself.

I would certainly be wary of letting the other family know it was your daughter though. You are just asking for meaningless trouble.

I understand the fear behind this suggestion, but it feels to me like you'd be shielding her from actual tangible consequences and substituting them for your own artificial ones. Further, I'd suggest that the mom in this case might be easily manipulated into offering a gentle punishment or not enforcing it.

Yes, you don't know what those people will do, but that's part of why stealing **** is such an awful idea. At some point she's going to have to deal with real consequences imposed by people who don't love her. Better now than later.
OCCOM BILL
 
  3  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 06:08 pm
@trickysitu,
Welcome to A2K trickysitu! Interesting dilemma, and I too can see the merits of every position posted.

Personally, I’ve no choice but to agree with the "own it" crowd and would waste no time informing her that she had two choices:

1. You return this item and apologize to these people.
or
2. I'll return this item and apologize to these people.

Then I'd paint a pretty clear picture of the former being the infinitely more forgivable option in the eyes of the victims, as well as the court's should the victims choose to pursue justice.

I doubt very many people would be spiteful enough to call the police back into it, considering they would by now in effect be punishing her for doing the right thing, as well as the insurance angle that really is pretty likely and perhaps even the reason for the police’s initial involvement. Even if they did, I would be surprised if the State's attorney wouldn't be happy to offer a deferred prosecution agreement (providing this is a first offense)... in which she would only need to satisfy the State's conditions (Like counseling, fines, costs, community service, etc.) and keep her nose clean for a length of time before the matter was erased forever from the books... though as Panzade indicated; the lesson would remain learned for life. And it's a damn good lesson. One well worth the risks, in my opinion.

That being said, I don't know her history, the victim's personality, the value of the item or how tough the authorities are in your area. There are certainly risks... but that's the reason she shouldn't have done it... and facing same is the reason she may never again.

Whatever you decide; be sure those people get their property back pronto, one way or another, or just by your writing here, you may very well be considered a party to the crime. Possession of stolen property becomes an issue at about the same time you become aware of it.

Best of luck, and please do us a favor and let us know how it plays out.
CalamityJane
 
  4  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 06:10 pm
@trickysitu,
trickysitu wrote:

That's why we have to treat this with tenderness......could scar her for life!


Being taught responsibility does not scar one for life.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 06:32 pm
YOu should send the thing back anonymously....and not tell anyone about what you know other than your daughter and her dad. You should have a come to Jesus meeting with her, first find out if there is anything more going on here than theft, and if is simple theft then she needs to know that if this sort of thing happens again then there will be serious consequences. These should be laid out, and should be on the order of magnitude of being kicked out of the house or paying rent to stay. She gets one chance to come clean on all of her crimes to date, after that if she gets caught then she gets rung up.
0 Replies
 
Butrflynet
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 06:38 pm
Some other points of view on all this:

It has been in her closet all this time. If she was the one who put it there (for whatever reason) she has known it was there all this time. Some of her acting out behavior might be a result of guilt eating at her. Having to return the item and apologize might provide that needed outlet and help her "start over" now that she's an adult. Might resolve several behavior issues.

I'd also like to know if mom routinely cleans the daughter's closet or if this was the first time. If this was the first time, what instigated it? Did the daughter know ahead of time that mom would be cleaning the closet? Did she put up any kind of protest? If she didn't know ahead of time, has she since noticed that her closet was cleaned and did she appear to look to see if the item had been discovered in the cleaning?



panzade
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Sep, 2009 07:24 pm
@FreeDuck,
Quote:
Yes, you don't know what those people will do, but that's part of why stealing **** is such an awful idea. At some point she's going to have to deal with real consequences imposed by people who don't love her. Better now than later.


bottom line ducky
0 Replies
 
Izzie
 
  2  
Reply Tue 15 Sep, 2009 01:14 am
@OCCOM BILL,
OCCOM BILL wrote:


That being said, I don't know her history, the victim's personality, the value of the item or how tough the authorities are in your area. There are certainly risks... but that's the reason she shouldn't have done it... and facing same is the reason she may never again.

Whatever you decide; be sure those people get their property back pronto, one way or another, or just by your writing here, you may very well be considered a party to the crime. Possession of stolen property becomes an issue at about the same time you become aware of it.

Best of luck, and please do us a favor and let us know how it plays out.



yeppers, ditto OBill!

The owners should get back their property - I don't see how you can do that without coming clean. Tough tough call.

good luck trickysitu.
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  2  
Reply Tue 15 Sep, 2009 07:04 am
@Butrflynet,
Butrflynet wrote:
It has been in her closet all this time. If she was the one who put it there (for whatever reason) she has known it was there all this time. Some of her acting out behavior might be a result of guilt eating at her. Having to return the item and apologize might provide that needed outlet and help her "start over" now that she's an adult. Might resolve several behavior issues.


I was thinking along those same lines... If she took it she knows it's "hot" and has chosen to keep it hidden rather than try to sell it. It may be because it's already reported as stolen but perhaps it's because she has a conscience and doesn't want to go to the next step. It's also possible that she's holding it for someone else or that she doesn't know it's there. Lots of different possibilities.

OCCOM BILL wrote:
1. You return this item and apologize to these people.
or
2. I'll return this item and apologize to these people.


or

3. You return this item and I'll go with you if you want me too.
0 Replies
 
trickysitu
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Sep, 2009 08:20 am
@trickysitu,
To all that have been so kind to offer up a solution to my dilema....going to spend a few more days pondering the situation. But I think I really know the right thing to do, just need the encouragement for all of you.
Thanks again....I'll keep ya posted
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Sep, 2009 08:30 am
@trickysitu,
thanks for posting. Nobody would want to have to make this choice I think

Good luck
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Sep, 2009 08:38 am
Sorry to say - it occurs to me that once confronted, your daughter may just throw the object in the trash. Not knowing her, I'm not sure how off base I am on that as a possibility. Anyway, this possibility sways me a bit more toward your going with her to see the people it was taken from. (I think I might still speak with an attorney first, just in case.)
0 Replies
 
 

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