9
   

Would it have been possible for Jesus to have sinned?

 
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Feb, 2009 11:00 pm
@edgarblythe,
You're lookin' good
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  3  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 07:33 am
@neologist,
Quote:
We seem to be approaching this from a different set of axioms. The topical question, IMO, presumes the validity of the Bible.

The question of whether or not the Bible is God's word probably belongs in a different thread.



This is absolute bullshit, Neo. You have been caught bullshitting...and you are not ethical enough to simply acknowledge that you have.

You can presume anything you want to about the Bible...but if you write the words “It is a fact that Jesus was not God”...you are not giving an opinion...you are stating a guess as a fact.

You even acknowledged that...and then recanted.

You are playing some kind of childish game here...and I think you are a jerk for doing so. There was a decent discussion going on before you started this bullshit...but...what the hell, at least you are shitting in your own thread.
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 10:01 am
@Frank Apisa,
You are right, Frank. And I'm sorry.
I was attempting to be not so serious.
Apparently that was a serious mistake.

I firmly believe that Jesus is not God
And that he had and does have free will
And could have sinned, but did not.

I am prepared to defend these beliefs using the Bible
Which, in spite of others' beliefs to the contrary, I believe to be inerrant.

But, sometimes I go off on mental tangents.
Which I attribute to my having been born in New Jersey.
Razz

Ridgefield, in fact.
tycoon
 
  2  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 12:21 pm
Jesus, in a moment of blind rage (very sinful IMO), overturned the tables of the moneylenders, which is blatant vandalism. I believe it's wrong to allow your emotions to engulf you, and I think it's wrong to destroy other people's property in such a wanton manner. This should rise to the level of a sin.

We've got a two-fer here--two sins in one act. Quite an embarassment.

And please don't tell me it is some metaphorical table representing some metaphorical nation.
fresco
 
  2  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 12:29 pm
@tycoon,
Tycoon,

You are not playing the game. Smile

For the believer:
Jesus was either "God" (in which case he is "sinless" by definition) or doing "God's Work" (i.e. only following orders).

0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 12:36 pm
@neologist,
Now that's more like it, Neo. Thank you.

Allow me to comment on some items individually.

Quote:
I firmly believe that Jesus is not God


I also guess that Jesus was not GOD. (Glad we are in agreement on something like this.)

In any case, I do not know if there even is a GOD...and on that question, I have no guess to offer.


Quote:
And that he had and does have free will
And could have sinned, but did not.

I am prepared to defend these beliefs using the Bible
Which, in spite of others' beliefs to the contrary, I believe to be inerrant.


I would bet my house that you would be able to use the Bible to successfully defend that!

I would bet my house that someone else could use the Bible to successfully defend the exact opposite.

I would bet my house that almost anyone with any kind of ingenuity could use the Bible to defend damn near anything they wanted to.

I do not mean this next comment as a gratuitous insult, Neo, but in my opinion...the Bible is an absurd book...filled with all sorts of inconsistencies and inanities...and is vastly over-rated as a work of literature.

Quote:

But, sometimes I go off on mental tangents.
Which I attribute to my having been born in New Jersey.


Ridgefield, in fact.


People from Jersey do tend to do that.

You may be surprised to hear this, but even I have been known to do it.
Steve 41oo
 
  2  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 02:26 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Jesus wept
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 03:35 pm
@Steve 41oo,
Quote:
Jesus wept


You know that for a fact...or is it something you made up because you think it sounds good?
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 09:12 pm
@tycoon,
tycoon wrote:

Jesus, in a moment of blind rage (very sinful IMO), overturned the tables of the moneylenders, which is blatant vandalism. I believe it's wrong to allow your emotions to engulf you, and I think it's wrong to destroy other people's property in such a wanton manner. This should rise to the level of a sin.

We've got a two-fer here--two sins in one act. Quite an embarassment.

And please don't tell me it is some metaphorical table representing some metaphorical nation.
Not at all metaphorical. Instead, completely justified.

The money lenders were in violation of the law. They charged exorbitant rates while they ripped off folks who may have travelled many miles to worship at the temple. They deserved what they got
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 09:14 pm
@Frank Apisa,
We really need to share a brewski, Frank.

http://web4.ehost-services.com/el2ton1/cheers.gif
0 Replies
 
qwik1320
 
  2  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 09:34 pm
@neologist,
And what happened to the gold the one Wiseman brought?
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 11:47 pm
@qwik1320,
qwik1320 wrote:

And what happened to the gold the one Wiseman brought?
Has there been a criminal investigation?
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Fri 13 Feb, 2009 06:10 am
@tycoon,
tycoon wrote:

Jesus, in a moment of blind rage (very sinful IMO), overturned the tables of the moneylenders, which is blatant vandalism. I believe it's wrong to allow your emotions to engulf you, and I think it's wrong to destroy other people's property in such a wanton manner. This should rise to the level of a sin.

We've got a two-fer here--two sins in one act. Quite an embarassment.

And please don't tell me it is some metaphorical table representing some metaphorical nation.


Blind rage? If you know the bible, then you know that this is the second time he had warned them. The first time is recorded in the book of John.

You consider the throwing over of tables to be a sin? Where do you get your definition of sin?
tycoon
 
  2  
Reply Sat 14 Feb, 2009 12:23 pm
@Intrepid,
Intrepid wrote:

tycoon wrote:

Jesus, in a moment of blind rage (very sinful IMO), overturned the tables of the moneylenders, which is blatant vandalism. I believe it's wrong to allow your emotions to engulf you, and I think it's wrong to destroy other people's property in such a wanton manner. This should rise to the level of a sin.

We've got a two-fer here--two sins in one act. Quite an embarassment.

And please don't tell me it is some metaphorical table representing some metaphorical nation.


Blind rage? If you know the bible, then you know that this is the second time he had warned them. The first time is recorded in the book of John.

You consider the throwing over of tables to be a sin? Where do you get your definition of sin?



Definition of a sin? After reading the Bible we can state quite clearly that sin is arbitrary. Some of the stupidest things are treated as sins, while some of the most egregious behaviors are condoned.

Perhaps you can supply a definition of sin?

For me, I know a sin when I see it. As an example, when Jesus says that in order to be saved, one must leave one's family and follow him. If that isn't a sin, I don't know what is. To interfere with the only truly sacred thing in this world, a family , and insist on cleaving himself into the middle of a relationship with your wife or children until it splits is the sin of sins.

In fact, that's worse than a sin. That's infamous.
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Sat 14 Feb, 2009 12:26 pm
@tycoon,
Simple. A sin is anything that is an offence to God.

According to your post you have read the bible. "after reading the bible". Do you understand everything? Do you put your own perceptions on it? Do you believe any of it? Have you actually read it?
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Reply Sat 14 Feb, 2009 01:03 pm
@Intrepid,
Quote:
Simple. A sin is anything that is an offence to God.


I agree.

Then we are left with the problem of what offends any god that might exist.

In the case of Christians...I guess using the Bible is a decent idea.

So...we know that homosexual conduct offends the god of the Bible...and that owning slaves does not.

Hummmm.

How do we handle that?
tycoon
 
  2  
Reply Sat 14 Feb, 2009 02:33 pm
@Intrepid,
Intrepid wrote:

Simple. A sin is anything that is an offence to God.

According to your post you have read the bible. "after reading the bible". Do you understand everything? Do you put your own perceptions on it? Do you believe any of it? Have you actually read it?


No I don't claim to understand everything in the Bible. Others here certainly seem to though. When I relate a story in its simple literal sense--as I believe much of the Bible was meant to be understood--I'm told I don't understand the Bible. Then they tell me in no uncertain terms what the story means. I just don't buy it.

BTW, is wrath--the kind displayed by Jesus in the Temple--one of the seven deadly sins? If so, is God offended by it?
Chumly
 
  2  
Reply Sat 14 Feb, 2009 02:54 pm
@neologist,
Why get yourself so twisted over a myth? Your time and efforts would be better spent learning physics.
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 Feb, 2009 02:29 am
@Chumly,
Chumly,

I tend to agree. But do you not think that even physicists are obliged to indulge in what might be termed "esoteric mental gymnastics" when they get involved with topics like "non-locality" etc ?

0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 Feb, 2009 04:20 am
@tycoon,
Since there is nowhere in the bible that you will find your reference to "7 deadly sins" (as you would know if you read it) ...the answer is no.
 

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