Can you look at this map and say Israel does not systemically appropriate land?

@izzythepush,

You wrote,

Quote:

You're a nice guy, but you're not a miracle worker.

None of us are miracle workers.

Quote:

Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back.

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@cicerone imposter,

You should have used the whole quote, CI. It's a concise capture of the "thinking" of most Americans - on both Israel and their own country.

“One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we’ve been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It’s simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we’ve been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back.”

Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark

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@InfraBlue,

InfraBlue wrote:

Seeing as how you’ve utterly failed to grasp it, the point I’m making is to counter the very idea of looking backwards to see who is authentically an indigenous person of the Middle East, and the ridiculous claim based on that that the Zionists were and are the indigenous population of Palestine. The Palestinians are the indigenous population. What is incumbent upon the Zionists is to give equal rights to the indigenous population of Palestine. This is what Americans have done, to a considerable degree, to the Native Americans in the US.

It doesn’t take an ivory tower to see that the genocide perpetrated in Europe does not justify the Zionists’ repression of the Palestinian peoples.

That the situation is out of my control certainly doesn’t prevent me from commenting on the glaringly obvious problems therein, much the same as your melodramatic admonitions to not respond to your posts don’t prevent me from doing so.

So, you can respond to my posts, but I can’t to yours? What a hypocrite, how quintessentially Zionist. Now that’s risible!

There are Arabs in the Knesset. Arab citizens of Israel would have been Palestineans, if they listened to the invading Arab armies in 1948, and deserted their homeland. However, some Arabs might have just known to stay put, so to speak, and now have a quality of life better than those Arabs (aka, Palestineans) that were siding with the Arab invading armies, by deserting their homeland, rather than help protect it from the invading armies (Arab or not).

Perhaps, what few seem to realize, that leaving Israel when the invading Arab armies wanted to push Jewish Israelis into the sea is tantamount to desertion. Why shouldn't the Arabs, living in what the UN considered the new state of Israel, have been willing to fight against invading (Arab) armies. The inference is that its the old "blood of my blood" crap. Or, more forthrightly, clannishness is pandered to. Few want to focus on how well Arab Israelis are now living as Israeli citizens, with representation in the Knesset.

Your not having the right, in my opinion, to respond to my posts is not based on any inherent quality of my ethnicity, but simply based on my belief that you are at least half my age, never served in the U.S. military, and with your willingness to point out my supposedly analytical shortcomings, just shows me, in my opinion, you are more than likely someone that does not choose to respect my age, nor life experience. In otherwords, little respect for me as your elder. That's fine. But, then don't be surprised if I dismiss your views, since you had the luxury of not having a military draft to contend with, as my generation did. Now, eat your vegetables so you'll grow up to be as wise as Foofie.

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

InfraBlue wrote:

Seeing as how you’ve utterly failed to grasp it,

You talk as if something else might be possible. You're a nice guy, but you're not a miracle worker.

Mea culpa. I "utterly failed to grasp it." My penance is for some people to believe I am a sock puppet.

Hey. The radio is playing the Stones' Jumping Jack Flash. Brought me into a better mood.

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@Foofie,

Quote:

you had the luxury of not having a military draft to contend with, as my generation did.

Was that WWII or the huge war crime that was Vietnam, Foofie?

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@Foofie,

You conveniently fail to mention the ethnic cleansing—which is what prompted the Arab intervention, and also answers your ridiculously disingenuous question about Arab loyalty to the Zionists--carried out by the Zionists before and during the 1948 War that resulted in a Jewish majority in the area that came under Zionist control after that war and created the Palestinian refugee crisis.

The Arab Israelis are systematically discriminated against by the Zionist regime in Israel, your assertions of how well they’re doing notwithstanding.
Your opinion, especially what with non sequiturs such as your military service and age, as to why I don’t have a right to respond to your posts has absolutely no bearing as to my right to respond, and I give you the benefit of the doubt that you’re not so oblivious at least as to that fact.

Take more fiber, it’ll help unclog you of your silly self-delusions as to your wisdom.

1 Reply

@InfraBlue,

InfraBlue wrote:

Your opinion, especially what with non sequiturs such as your military service and age, as to why I don’t have a right to respond to your posts has absolutely no bearing as to my right to respond, and I give you the benefit of the doubt that you’re not so oblivious at least as to that fact.

You have a right to whistle in the wind, but don't expect anyone to hear your whistling. Similarly, you do not meet my standards for debating. Wait patiently and you can have this world to be concerned about, without my being your audience; till then I do not have to treat you like a peer, at least not by my standards.

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@Foofie,

I hear InfraBlues whistling a lot clearer than your non sequiturs.

You Jews think you are "betters" than others when in fact it's the individual that proves whether they are better humans. Get over yourselves as being special; Jews also have the same uneducated, dumb, and ignorant people. You're a good example.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

I hear InfraBlues whistling a lot clearer than your non sequiturs.

You Jews think you are "betters" than others when in fact it's the individual that proves whether they are better humans. Get over yourselves as being special; Jews also have the same uneducated, dumb, and ignorant people. You're a good example.

You are coming across as a bigoted prick. Jews don't think they are better than others. That is a bigoted stereotype.

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@Advocate,

Aren't you one of those "Jews" who uses words like "your betters?" LOL

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

You Jews think you are "betters" than others when in fact it's the individual that proves whether they are better humans. Get over yourselves as being special; Jews also have the same uneducated, dumb, and ignorant people. You're a good example.

We Jews are also getting taller. How about your fellow Japanese-Americans?

But, since so many people are so aware of my being Jewish, I do feel like some sort of celebrity.

It's not that Jews feel "special." I do think many just do not have the Gentile habit of wanting to associate with anyone, so to speak. Part of the Jewish culture seems to impart, in my opinion, a set of standards, as to who to associate with. So, perhaps, many do try to associate with college educated, non-Jews of certain backgrounds. That could exclude many, and those excluded might likely think that Jews feel "better" than them. It might just be that many Jews are exercising the same descriminating attitude that many upper class WASP's exercise. In other words, there are more groups in the U.S. that "act" with an elitism. Jews might be one of those groups. What's wrong with that, if some Jews only want to associate with what they consider peers?

Plus, they may not all relate well to those that seem "different" from what they are used to? I could not really initially relate well to you. You would blame my Jewishness. I would blame your being raised in a certain socio-economic group. Sorry, if I am class conscious. So are many others, especially WASP's in my opinion. They get a free pass to be exclusive, but Jews have to rub elbows with every Gentile that wants to be friendly with some Jew? Stop with the liberal crap. You still have the stigma in some people's minds of having had a hard, unfortunate early life, and they just might not feel comfortable with you, regardless of how you overcame that early experience. You might not be understanding me, since I believe you subscribe to a very liberal/progressive world view.

The short answer is that many Jews are no less clannish than many other groups. Plus, if they are secular, that clannishness might just have been extrapolated to educated Gentiles of a certain socio-economic background.

Plus, let's be honest, some people are bigoted against certain other groups. That is not based on being "special." Just that they choose to relate only to certain folks that they feel comfortable with. And, you would not feel comfortable with me, regardless of my Jewishness. Nor would I feel comfortable with you. The world you live in is so big. Mine is much smaller.

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@Foofie,

Foofie wrote:

But, since so many people are so aware of my being Jewish, I do feel like some sort of celebrity.

How on Earth did that Happen? It's not like you broadcast it all the bleeding time.

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@izzythepush,

I've must've been an honorary Jew in my working days, because I worked for three bosses who were Jews. They all treated me very well with regular pay increases and promotions, and one even invited me to the annual Seder meal.

Hot dog. I must be special too!

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@cicerone imposter,

I never said, nor would I say, that Jews are better.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

I've must've been an honorary Jew in my working days, because I worked for three bosses who were Jews. They all treated me very well with regular pay increases and promotions, and one even invited me to the annual Seder meal.

Hot dog. I must be special too!

What a pity it is that your former employers didn't know what a Jew (and Israel) hater that you are.

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@Advocate,

That's where you're wrong. I'm not a Jew-hater or any race-hater. I only speak ill of people - no matter what race or ethnicity - who treat others unequally.

Your head is screwed on wrong, because you fail to understand fundamental human decency.

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@cicerone imposter,

Anthony Bordain had a program that just finished on CNN on his visit to Gaza. He was escorted by a newspaper woman who showed him around, and as his usual activity on such trips, he had a meal with a Palestinian family. At the end, Bordain talked to a Jew, and even he said the "The wall is ugly. We can see it from here."

Palestinians in Gaza cannot go beyond nine miles to fish for food. If the Israelis catch them, their fishing nets are destroyed. So much for democracy in Israel.

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@cicerone imposter,

The Jews on this thread should research a man called Chiune Sugihara. They might learn something about humanity.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Anthony Bordain had a program that just finished on CNN on his visit to Gaza. He was escorted by a newspaper woman who showed him around, and as his usual activity on such trips, he had a meal with a Palestinian family. At the end, Bordain talked to a Jew, and even he said the "The wall is ugly. We can see it from here."

Palestinians in Gaza cannot go beyond nine miles to fish for food. If the Israelis catch them, their fishing nets are destroyed. So much for democracy in Israel.

As you should know, the Palestinians effectively built the fence (and wall) with their suicidal and other attacks. Israel had to do something. The interesting thing is that the fence has worked almost perfectly. There were neighborhoods in Israel under constant, and various, attacks from the Pals . With the advent of the fence, the p;eople there live peacefully and secure. As you should know from the Southern border of California, good fences make good neighbors.

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@Advocate,

You are simple blind; Israel has many walls surrounding Palestinian villages - even in the West Bank and near Jerusalem. I've seen and taken pictures of them, and have displayed them on this thread.

You'll never learn to accept facts, because your bigotry won't allow it.

You do know what a bigot is, right?

Quote:

big·ot noun \ˈbi-gət\
: a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes other people, ideas, etc. : a bigoted person; especially : a person who hates or refuses to accept the members of a particular group (such as a racial or religious group)

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Can you look at this map and say Israel does not systemically appropriate land?

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