63
   

Can you look at this map and say Israel does not systemically appropriate land?

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 11:19 am
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:
Also, you post a long article, but don't provide the source. I guess we should assume that the source is disreputable.
You really shouldn't thrown stones from the inside of a glasshouse!
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 11:21 am
@izzythepush,
What is more interesting to me about Advocate is simply the fact that he talks about a very small section if Israel instead of all the land stolen from the Palestinians. He has no sense of proportion or common sense.

He attempts to divert the discussion from the realities of Israel over a very small piece of land in the south.

I was hoping those who read this thread would recognize the hypocrisy of the Jews who love to use the terms "anti-Semite" and now "Judeophobics."

Foofie
 
  0  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 02:27 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

I've got a low opinion of anyone who drops napalm on small children.

I've also got a low opinion of liars. You went out of your way to stick your tongue up Gob's arse telling him how you did your best to help behind the scenes in the genocide, so you were either lying then or now.

I also have a low opinion of bigots who think some races are superior to others.

So I have a very low opinion of you, and it seems I'm not the only one, which is why you're such a pathetic childless, friendless, humourless loser.

Seasons Greetings.


Is this the Christmas spirit I've heard so much about?
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 02:28 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

I've also got a low opinion of liars. You went out of your way to stick your tongue up Gob's arse telling him how you did your best to help behind the scenes in the genocide, so you were either lying then or now.



What are you talking about? Who is Gob? I helped genocide? What genocide?

You seem to be misremembering something I said. Certainly my time in the military had no effect on anything done in Southeast Asia. I was stateside the entire time. I am not sure how you interpret my postings, but you are perhaps seeing things through the eyes of a European, not an American that joined the military back in the days of the universal draft.

There was no genocide, that I know of in Southeast Asia,unless you think of collateral damage as genocide, and then you are stretching the definition of genocide. Genocide means a planned extermination of a group. That was not done by the U.S. Strictly fighting the commies.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 02:35 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

What is more interesting to me about Advocate is simply the fact that he talks about a very small section if Israel instead of all the land stolen from the Palestinians.


The Palestineans do not have a state. The land is under Israeli hegemony since the 1967 war. Jordan should claim it, if any state would claim it. However, when land is occupied, after a war, the population becomes part of the land transfer. Sort of like the Vichy, French government. So, if some countries want to "liberate" the West Bank from Israeli occupation, that would make more sense then claiming that the population automatically becomes a new state.

It would make more sense to say that Jordan has abandoned the West Bank to the Israelis.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 02:54 pm
@Foofie,
Foofie wrote:
Sort of like the Vichy, French government.
Not really.
The French Vichy State maintained nominal sovereignty over the whole of French territory as defined by the Second Armistice at Compiègne. (But Vichy maintained full sovereignty only in the unoccupied southern Zone libre.)

The PNA has control of civil affairs in both designated areas after the 1995 Interim Agreements. (And as a result territorial administration over 11% of the West Bank.)

There's nothing which could be compared to the Zone libre. Besides that, Vichy France co-operated often (mostly) quite well with the Nazis.
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 02:59 pm
@Foofie,
You,
Quote:
The land is under Israeli hegemony since the 1967 war.


You're talking about an apartheid state that discriminates against Palestinians.

Where is your head anyways? Most call it a military occupation with no democratic rights for Palestinians. The UN and human rights organizations recognize Israel as an illegal state controlling the country with military force.
Foofie
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:12 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

You,
Quote:
The land is under Israeli hegemony since the 1967 war.


You're talking about an apartheid state that discriminates against Palestinians.

Where is your head anyways? Most call it a military occupation with no democratic rights for Palestinians. The UN and human rights organizations recognize Israel as an illegal state controlling the country with military force.


Can't be an apartheid state, since there are Arab citizens, and Arabs in the Knesset. You should wonder why the UN doesn't call for the West Bank to be given back to Jordan?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:24 pm
@Foofie,
You,
Quote:
Can't be an apartheid state, since there are Arab citizens, and Arabs in the Knesset.


You are very stupid; just because a minority of Arab citizens serve in the Knesset doesn't provide equality for all Palestinians. Why are there guard towers and walls in Israel that limits the movement of Palestinians?

That a few Arabs serve in the Knesset is an insult to anyone's intelligence if that serves as equality.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:24 pm
@Foofie,
Foofie wrote:
You should wonder why the UN doesn't call for the West Bank to be given back to Jordan?
Nothing really to wonder: there was only the UK (and perhaps Pakistan) which recognized Jordan's annexation.
oralloy
 
  0  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:25 pm
@Foofie,

cicerone imposter wrote:
You're talking about an apartheid state that discriminates against Palestinians.

Pipe down, Adolf. No one wants to hear your lowbrow anti-Semitism.


cicerone imposter wrote:
Where is your head anyways?

Most people aren't anti-Semitic vermin like you, so they reject your hideous hate speech.


cicerone imposter wrote:
Most call it a military occupation with no democratic rights for Palestinians.

Most liars maybe.

Most people who tell the truth, point out that the Palestinians vote for their own government.


cicerone imposter wrote:
The UN and human rights organizations recognize Israel as an illegal state controlling the country with military force.

Only Nazis and other anti-Semites think that Israel is an illegal state.
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:29 pm
@oralloy,
Show me how my statement,
Quote:
You're talking about an apartheid state that discriminates against Palestinians.
is anti-Semitic?



cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:32 pm
@cicerone imposter,
From True Torah Jews.
Quote:
Religious Jews Protest Outside Prison Where Yeshiva Students are Held

Dec. 12, 2013
Several hundred Orthodox men demonstrated outside the IDF’s Prison 6 in Atlit Monday morning, Dec. 9, in protest at the ongoing detention of two yeshiva students who were arrested for failing to report for military duty.

The protest was organized by the anti-Zionist Eidah Charedis communal organization, while members of Hasidic group Toldos Aharon also participated, as well as members of the Lithuanian yeshiva community, led by Rabbi Shmuel Auerbach.

The senior rabbi of the Eidah, Rabbi Yitzhak Tuvia Weiss, was in attendance at the protests, as was Rabbi Moshe Shternbuch, along with the Grand Rabbi of Toldos Aharon, Rabbi David Kahn, and several other senior rabbis.

Despite their requests, the rabbis from the Eidah were not permitted to visit the two detainees, which generated considerable consternation among the protesters, although the demonstration remained nonviolent.
Protestors held up signs saying “We will all go to prison” and declaring their willingness to “give up their lives” for the struggle against haredi enlistment to the army.

One sign held aloft by a demonstrator read “Behold I am ready and willing to give up my life and to rot in jail [in order] not to go to the impure army.”

The arrests have led to a spate of demonstrations in Jerusalem, Beit Shemesh and outside Prison 6 next to Atlit. A government bill to increase Orthodox enlistment is being reviewed in a special Knesset committee at the moment, and the panel members are expected to vote on the central components of the legislation in the coming weeks.

Our Comment:

In solidarity with our brethren suffering under the State of Israel, we Torah Jews in America have launched a campaign of our own against this religious persecution. The first stage will consist of calling our local representatives in the Senate and House and asking them to speak up for freedom of religion in the State of Israel.

Click here for our flyer containing instructions on how to call your representatives and deliver the appropriate message.

(The flyer is in Yiddish but the text for the phone call and the list of representatives are in English.)

If you see that this flyer is not circulating in your neighborhood, please print it out and place it in public places to be mezakeh es harabim.

As the Satmar Rebbe famously wrote in Vayoel Moshe 113, the Israeli politicians do not fear the protests of Jews who are under their state and subject to their control, but they do fear and are embarrassed when Jews protest in other countries and the non-Jews hear that there are Jews who are willing to put their lives on the line for the Torah. It is very possible that such protests may lead to fewer anti-religious decrees. Therefore, we cannot sit idly while the Israeli government does whatever it pleases. We must speak up!
Foofie
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:35 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Foofie wrote:
You should wonder why the UN doesn't call for the West Bank to be given back to Jordan?
Nothing really to wonder: there was only the UK (and perhaps Pakistan) which recognized Jordan's annexation.


Then to whom does the West Bank belong to? And, the population would then be under that respective state's hegemony. I compare it to the Vichy government. Naturally, if the western powers want to liberate it, who am I to question that. But, to give the Arabs its own West Bank state, having taken on the cute moniker of Palestineans, might be just more charitable than politics reflects? The Palestineans have a national identity like the French, Germans, British, Italians, Spanish? How come I was never taught Palestinean history in school? Something is wrong with the picture that pro-Palestineans are painting, in my opinion.
Foofie
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:37 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Your point is that you are going to enroll in a Yeshiva?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:48 pm
@Foofie,
Stupid question from a stupid person. End of discussion.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 03:49 pm
@cicerone imposter,
I'm still waiting for oralboy to respond.

Quote:
@oralloy,
Show me how my statement,
Quote:
You're talking about an apartheid state that discriminates against Palestinians.
is anti-Semitic?
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 04:06 pm
@Foofie,
Foofie wrote:
How come I was never taught Palestinean history in school?
I have no idea.
Perhaps, however, it's the same reason why I wasn't taught the history of any and all of the about 200 countries in the world?

But - as an aside - it is very interesting that you were taught the individual history of various countries at school! Good for you - and good done by your school! (We only got to know about roughly in geography classes - history was more focused on periods.)
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 04:09 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
I don't remember studying Palestine history, but history course in grade school was one of the most hated in my youth. History became interesting when I started travel outside the US, and now I love history.

BTW, the only thing I remember about history from my youth is "Columbus sailed the blue in 1492."
Advocate
 
  1  
Mon 23 Dec, 2013 05:22 pm
@cicerone imposter,
I can understand why you, Walter, MIT, Izzy, et al., love the Pals. The Pals treat their women like chattel, persecute and kill minorities, such as Christians, Jews, atheists, et al. They even kill each other, including their children, if they are adulterous, homosexual, disobedient, informers, etc.

The Pals are a lovely bunch, just like you all.
 

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