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Boy Scouts/Discrimination

 
 
Diest TKO
 
  2  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2008 08:23 pm
boyscouts get public funding.

T
K
O
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  2  
Reply Tue 17 Jul, 2012 10:25 am
Quote:
The Boy Scouts of America will keep their controversial policy banning gay scouts and leaders after a confidential two-year review, the organization said Tuesday. More


I've bought my last bag of BSA popcorn.
0 Replies
 
jcboy
 
  2  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 08:36 am
Sounds like another catholic church. Both are primarily male run and virulently homophobic. See a pattern?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-08-05/boy-scouts-sexual-abuse/56811210/1

Quote:
LOS ANGELES (AP) – Internal documents from the Boy Scouts of America reveal more than 125 cases in which men suspected of molestation allegedly continued to abuse Scouts, despite a blacklist meant to protect boys from sexual predators.

BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 09:12 am
@jcboy,
Quote:
Sounds like another catholic church. Both are primarily male run and virulently homophobic. See a pattern?


I am not taking a position here but is your comments implying that if the Boy Scouts was more welcoming to openly gay males as scout leaders and therefore would have more gay males in it there would be less homosexual child driven abuses instead of more?

One question that seem an analogy would you think it would be a good idea to allow heterosexual males as girl scout leaders and allow them to supervise early age teenage girls on camping trips for example?

If we did so do you think that as a result there would be less or more sexual misconducts in the Girl Scout then there is now?
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 09:24 am
@BillRM,
I did a fast check and it look like the girl scouts allow male leaders but as a step grandfather of a girl I would be far more comfortable with a woman as a leader on camping trips with her and more comfortable with heterosexuals males then openly gay males on camping trips with my grandsons.

Yes I am aware that this in not PC at all..............
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  4  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 09:43 am
@BillRM,
I've always thought the Boy Scouts were off on their fundamental complaint and your analogy makes the same error. Men are not uncontrolled sexual beasts incapable of using their own judgment or following society's basic rules. If heterosexual men were girl scout leaders, that doesn't mean that they will go around raping girl scouts. If men are school teachers, that doesn't mean they will lure students into their depraved clutches. The Boy Scout position has been that some pedophiles are gay therefore exclude all gay men from scouting. That's like saying most murderers are men so exclude all men from scouting (or teaching or anything else). For every father that has abused his daughter (or son), there are many who have been very successful raising confident young women and men. Why would you believe that a gay man could not be a successful father figure? The fault is stereotyping a unique person because they belong to a larger group and then using that stereotype to exclude them from a job. If a man who is an excellent candidate for a leadership position in scouting is also gay, he is still an excellent candidate. That said, Boy Scouts Of America is a private organization. I don't condone their policy nor their receiving any government funds, but they can set up their membership policies as they choose.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 12:07 pm
@engineer,
Most men are indeed have control either Homosexuals or heterosexuals and therefore could be surrounded by young females just coming into womanhood or males coming into manhood and not betrayed the trust place in them.

However there is and always will be a percent of men who will not do so or can not do so however you could bury heterosexual males under a pile of young naked boys and have little chance of a bad outcome and that can not be said for all homosexuals males and of course the reverse is true when it come to young females and heterosexual males.

I know this is a non-PC position but it is likely to be a position that large numbers of parents do share and who therefore would not entrusted their young men to either a homosexual scout leader or their young women to a straight male girl scout leader.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 12:54 pm
@engineer,
As a side note I am on the fence over this matter as profiling men as likely sexual predators is in fact distasteful to put it mildly as Firefly love to do.

It ok for my wife for example to go to a park across the street and openly try to find homes for kittens but not for me to do so as most sexual predators are males by Firefly statements.

So yes this scout ban is very very unfair to the majority of gay men and I can understand that fact still when it come to my own step grandkids I had mixed feelings.

As the more homosexuals males interacting with young men that you would have in the scout logic stated that more cases of overall sexual misconduct well likely occur even if the vast majority of gay men would never betrayed their trust.
engineer
 
  2  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 02:32 pm
@BillRM,
I understand where you are coming from. Most of us are not rational about safety concerns to our loved ones. That said, you point out the slippery slope. If men can't be trusted to take scouts out, can they really be trusted as school teachers or by themselves in parks? After all, women school teachers would never seduce students, right?

As for the scouts, it seems to me that the cases of abuse experienced by the Boy Scouts and other organizations come from closeted pedophiles, not openly gay men. Call it the Sandusky syndrone.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 02:50 pm
@engineer,
Quote:
If men can't be trusted to take scouts out, can they really be trusted as school teachers or by themselves in parks? After all, women school teachers would never seduce students, right?



I know what you are saying and agree with it but and there is always a but I think that my main problem is not having men straight or gay being around children but in being in control of a group of children where there only one adult and the group is out of touch with the rest of society such as on camping trips. In fact I would had similar if less concerns over females being in that position.

I have no clue if the scouts allow troops going out of touch with the rest of society with only one adult along.

If that is not the case my problems with gays scout leaders are greatly reduce.

Footnote there is zero reason to ban gay youths from being scouts and that part of the ban I see no justifications even an emotional justifications for.
engineer
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 02:57 pm
@BillRM,
After several incidents a few years ago, the Boy Scouts require two adults at all events.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Aug, 2012 03:05 pm
@engineer,
Quote:
After several incidents a few years ago, the Boy Scouts require two adults at all events.


Thanks for the information oh as a second footnote as a atheist I have a little problem with the boy scout banning such from being scouts or scout leaders also.

Even if you only need to state you believe in an Einstein type god IE there is some force of some type behind the universe and it laws.
0 Replies
 
tsarstepan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Oct, 2012 12:24 pm
More blatant discrimination is afoot:
Teenage Boy Scout Denied Organization's Top Rank Because He's Gay
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2012/10/05/162371701/teenage-boy-scout-denied-organizations-top-rank-because-hes-gay
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Oct, 2012 08:23 am
@tsarstepan,
online petition


http://www.change.org/petitions/boy-scouts-don-t-let-your-anti-gay-policy-deny-my-son-his-eagle-award

Boy Scouts: Don't let your anti-gay policy deny my son his Eagle award
by Karen Andresen
Moraga, CA Sign this petition
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My son Ryan needs your help.

Ryan joined the Boy Scouts when he was just six years old, and since then, he's dreamed of earning his Eagle award -- the highest rank in the Boy Scouts.

Ryan is now a senior in high school, and just completed the final requirements to earn his Eagle Award. He's an honor student with great SAT scores, who's hoping to attend the University of San Francisco. But because he recently came out to his friends and family as gay, leaders from our local Boy Scout troop say they won't approve his Eagle award.

A Boy Scout gets his Eagle by earning many badges, completing all lower Scout rank requirements, and carrying out an approved final project. So Ryan decided to build a "Tolerance Wall" for his school, to show bully victims -- like Ryan -- that they are not alone. Ryan worked countless hours with elementary students to amass a wall of 288 unique tiles, all illustrating acts of kindness.

But when leadership in Troop 212 (San Francisco Bay Area) found out that Ryan was gay, the Scoutmaster said he refused to sign the official paperwork designating Ryan as an Eagle Scout, despite the fact that Ryan completed all of the requirements.

Many troops around the country are standing up, choosing to reject the Boy Scouts' discriminatory policy. I sincerely hope that Ryan's troop will become one of them. And with your help, they just might.

It hurts me so much to watch Ryan suffer for being who he is, because to me, he's perfect. Ryan has worked for nearly 12 years to become an Eagle Scout, and nothing would make him more proud than earning that well-deserved distinction. I hope that if enough people come together, we can convince my son's troop leaders to help him feel proud of who he is and all he's accomplished.

"Citizenship in the Community," a merit badge earned, means standing up for what is right, and I am proud of Ryan for doing just that. Will you stand with him too, and join this campaign?

Petition Letter
I'm urging leaders from Troop 212 to reject the Boy Scouts of America's discriminatory anti-gay policy and to give Ryan Andresen the Eagle award he's earned.

Ryan joined the Boy Scouts when he was just six years old, and since then, he's dreamed of earning his Eagle award -- the highest rank in the Boy Scouts.

Ryan is now a senior in high school, and just completed the final requirements to earn...
0 Replies
 
 

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