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Latest Challenges to the Teaching of Evolution

 
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 06:14 am
@spendius,
do you have a phrase generator or do you just pull these poorly composed disconnected fulgurations out of your ass?
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:07 am
@farmerman,
In the interest of improving myself I would like to know what your objections are based on. Objection alone is useless.

What in my post can be described by a reasonable person as a "poorly composed disconnected fulguration"? Fulguration is an organic concept. Composition is not because it is not pre-determined unless you accept the materialist theory of mind and reject free will.

So you talk big about the "interconnectedness of words and phrases" and you are here disconnected in the most fundamental way. And in one short and meaningless expostulation. It cannot be called a sentence precisely because it has no meaning for anybody else and a sentence is a vehicle of communication. A good example of the control freak laying down the rules for others with nothing but fanciful and high-sounding bullshit.

All you ever do is talk up your own excellence. Your failure to respond to my post in a proper manner speaks volumes.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:12 am
@spendius,
In fact your ignorant blurt is a pretty good guide to the causes of the failures in the educational system which you were addressing. That people such as yourself are allowed anywhere near the process is the main problem.
Ionus
 
  0  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:19 am
@plainoldme,
The three R's had to make way to teach about dinosaurs as it supports an anti-religious stance . People need dinosaurs to ease their pain and suffering in this life . Religion just doesnt cut it .
Ionus
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:21 am
@spendius,
True, but he's allowed in where he can do the most harm . People who almost have a qualification have to kow-tow to his views or they dont get a piece of paper .
0 Replies
 
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:34 am
@spendius,
Hi Spendius. Your quote: Fulguration is an organic concept. Composition is not because it is not pre-determined unless you accept the materialist theory of mind and reject free will.

I do have a question for you! Just how much free will do you think God gave you?

Does not your neurology and your environment have every thing to do with who you are?

You could have been born with a severe mental handicap to a cannibal tribe!

How would that be free will? Your language, behavior, ideology, religion along with many other parts of YOU would be different
Ionus
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:36 am
@reasoning logic,
Then it wouldn't be him . Obviously HIS free will is dependant on him being him .
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:38 am
@Ionus,
Ionus wrote:

Then it wouldn't be him . Obviously HIS free will is dependant on him being him .
And this explains his free will?
Ionus
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:41 am
@reasoning logic,
No, it explains why it would belong to him if it existed . Saying if things were different is irrelevant .
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:46 am
@Ionus,
The only thing that I am saying is that it appears to me that our neurology and our environment plays a huge role in who we are and unless we can change these these two there is not much at all we can do that is free will.

farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:52 am
@reasoning logic,
what do you mean by "our neurology" ? sounds like a disease.
We are prisoners of our environment and whenever it decides to smack-down on us, we could be extinct creatures.(unless only the sherpas survive with their more efficient respiratory systems).
Although Im not sure about the lady sherpas, do theycarry the genes for respiration efficiency or do they live in the flats?
Ionus
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 07:52 am
@reasoning logic,
Are you suggesting we would only have free will if we had the power of a God ?
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 08:01 am
@Ionus,
Ionus wrote:

Are you suggesting we would only have free will if we had the power of a God ?


I am not sure Ionus!
Do you think God was able to choose if he was going to exist or not? Maybe he has just always existed without any choice of his own!
0 Replies
 
plainoldme
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 08:09 am
@Ionus,
Quote:
he three R's had to make way to teach about dinosaurs as it supports an anti-religious stance


Do you have the guts to say things like this in public? Why not put your message on a sandwich board and walk around with it. During the day. In public places.
plainoldme
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 08:37 am
@farmerman,
While the mention of diagramming creates waves of revulsion, just ask the parent of any kid (I had a conversation with a medical doctor whose 15 year old daughter is a Montessori alumna and credits the form of diagramming done in Montessori schools for her daughter's superior writing skills) who went through Montessori school and you'll get an endorsement for that sort of analysis. It is rational and it is visual, appealing to at least two learning styles.

BTW, in parochial school, we did sentence diagramming beginning in the third grade. A large number of my classmates went on to become journalists and authors and I owe that to our early training. I vividly remember a paragraph I wrote then that Sister Thomasine thought was "babyish" which would have been acceptable . . . no, make that welcome . . . as a beginning developmental (remedial) writing assignment.

Better still, go to any community college where open enrollment means anyone can register and see how these kids operate on a level between 3rd and 7th grade.

I, too, want to see Latin taught. When I was subbing a few years back, there was a fifth grade teacher who I thought should become a national role model. She had a bulletin board illustrating how Latin words evolved into Spanish, English and French words. (I think some of these deprived kids, whose parents never read to them nor took them regularly to the public library, and whose vocabularies suffer as a result, would benefit from the study of Latin. However, my daughter who is a Spanish and French teacher, disagrees.)

The kids were studying ancient Egypt and there were dioramas made by the kids depicting Egyptian religion and culture. Science projects were all over the room as were their essays -- written in cursive -- hanging neatly from the cork strip above the chalk boards.

I prefer teaching government to civics. The difference is civics is about the role of the citizen while government is just that. When my older two were Montessori students, the upper school kids researched drilling in the ANWAR and studied government. My daughter is 33 and she was 10 when they did this, so it was 23 years ago. The upper school kids went to Washington where they presented their data in person to Senators Kennedy and Kerry.

Do you know that biology is such a struggle for kids that at least one high school broke the curriculum into two academic years for slower students? That is the wrong solution. The proper solution -- aside from stressing reading more so that the students can understand their text books -- is to bring down the teaching of science into elementary school.

I read a criticism of elementary school science teaching that said kids at that age should learn by observing and experimenting. In other words, kids should learn through what is called the scientific method.

And, yes, the problem is that science graduates do not want to enter the low paid profession of teaching. On the other hand, I worked as a college guide at a museum with a girl I considered dumb who was majoring in "science education" at a third string state university. Science education and not physics, chemistry or biology.

The other thing is that right hates teaching the arts which are the first thing to be cut. I argue that studying music in school bolsters mathematic ability and provides a different way of thinking. Furthermore, consider Gustavo Dudamel, music director of the LA Philharmonic, a product of Venezuela's El Sistema. Granted, Dudamel is from a musical family and heredity must certainly play a role in his talent, but El Sistema provides a means of helping poor and disadvantaged kids that many AMericans would never accept.

I mentioned cursive above. There is some minor drum beating by the right to re-instate the teaching of cursive -- many students can not read cursive. I suggest that teaching cursive and teaching art share something in common: the development of fine motor skills.

0 Replies
 
plainoldme
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 08:42 am
@reasoning logic,

Quote:
Fulguration is an organic concept. Composition is not because it is not pre-determined unless you accept the materialist theory of mind and reject free will.


Spendius actually wrote that?! I seldom read his posts in their entirety. Too much gibberish. What the destruction of tissue has to do with composition -- which I assume he means writing -- is anyone's guess. Truthfully, he writes like a middle schooler who just discovered the Thesaurus.
Ionus
 
  0  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 08:43 am
@plainoldme,
So how much of precious educating time for our children is taken up with supporting evolution and biology ? How many children will need information on dinosaurs and the ecology of the local pond rather than know how to count their change and physically write a letter as opposed to typing it with poor spelling ?

Quote:
Do you have the guts to say things like this in public?
What do you imagine will happen ? People like you will toot their horn ? You wouldnt have the guts to get out of the car swinging . How about you ? Where is your sandwich board ?
wandeljw
 
  0  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 08:46 am
Quote:
Why does U.S. fail in science education?
(By Mark Roth, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, March 20, 2011)

The few times that Huan Kiat Koh came home with poor grades when he was growing up in Singapore, he vividly remembers his mother's response.

"She would scold me, and then tell me to sit down and work," said Mr. Koh, a sophomore majoring in materials science at Carnegie Mellon University. "In general in Singapore, parents feel grades are very important for their kids.

"I think I read that American parents, when their kids get bad test scores, tend to be more sympathetic and worry about the kids' self-esteem," he said wryly.

That "tiger mother" approach may be one reason Singapore students consistently score at the top on international science knowledge tests, and American parents' more forgiving attitude may play some role in the less impressive U.S. scores.

In the 2007 TIMSS test, which stands for Trends in International Mathematics and Science Study, students from Singapore took first or second place in all science categories. The United States ranked 11th.

Results like this have generated concern at the highest levels.

President Barack Obama has repeatedly pushed to improve science and math education in America -- most recently this month. In a speech in Arlington, Va., he complained that "the quality of our math and science education lags behind many other nations."

Carol Johnson, superintendent of the Boston Public Schools, added her own concerns after a news conference on poor science test scores in urban districts last month.

"If we are truly to equip all our students to compete in the global economy, we must give them the tools to outthink and outperform their counterparts around the world, " she said.

In the midst of this hand-wringing, a larger question remains: Why do students who live in a nation that is the acknowledged world leader in scientific research lag behind other countries on science knowledge?

The answer is complicated, say experts, and involves everything from poverty, to poor training of teachers, to attitudes about learning, to the disturbing level of scientific illiteracy among American adults.

******************************************************

A major reason for poor U.S. science test scores is the huge gap between students in affluent and poor school districts, which is often reflected in racial disparities in scores.

Jack Buckley, commissioner of the National Center for Education Statistics in Washington, D.C., said American student rankings look very different when white and black students' scores are considered separately.

In one of the major international tests, the European-based Program for International Student Assessment, or PISA, American students as a whole scored 502 in 2009, slightly above the industrialized nation average of 500.

But if white students are considered separately, Mr. Buckley said, their score would have been 532, which would have ranked them sixth, while African-American students as a group had a score of only 435, putting them between Bulgaria and Romania.

Economic differences play a key role in that discrepancy, said Arthur Eisenkraft, a science education expert at the University of Massachusetts at Boston.

"Certainly we've always known there are high correlations between poverty and how kids do in school," Mr. Eisenkraft said.

*******************************************************

The downside of demographic effects in America is particularly noticeable in large urban school districts like Pittsburgh.

Of the 17 big-city school districts that participated in the National Assessment of Educational Progress science tests in 2009, only two -- Charlotte, N.C., and Jefferson County, Ky. (which includes Louisville) -- had more than a third of their students scoring in the proficient range. More disturbing, eight of the districts had more than half of their students scoring below the basic level, ranging from Los Angeles at 55 percent to Detroit at 74 percent.

"And basic means basic," said Alan J. Friedman, a science education consultant who spoke at a NAEP press conference convened by the National Assessment of Educational Progress in Boston last month. "If you're doing below basic in science at the eighth-grade level, you may be freezing yourself out of a whole lifetime of career options and advancement opportunities.

"It's not a pretty picture."

*************************************************************

In Asian countries and other parts of the world, parents believe that doing well in science is mostly a matter of hard work. But in many American households, he said, there is a more of a belief in innate ability.

As a result, "whenever students have their first failures, they say, 'Well I'm not good at science and that's just how it is.' "

That notion -- that you either have the gift or you don't -- "is particularly damaging in science because the reality of science is you're basically always failing," said Mr. Pellathy, who has a Ph.D. in physics.

"When I was a student," he recalled, "one time I got two weeks of data out of a piece of equipment I had worked on for an entire year. So if you don't have that mindset that your failures are setting you up for your subsequent success, you won't keep going."

Besides the sheer value of hard work, it's also important to teach students how to analyze problems and figure out solutions, and not just accumulate facts, said the University of Massachusetts' Mr. Eisenkraft.

He recalled visiting an elementary school one time where the principal proudly told him that every student in the school was required to memorize the order of the planets.

"I said to him, 'I'm not going to argue with that, but when you have them learn that, don't do it during science time because it has nothing to do with science.' The science question is how do we know Venus is closer to the Sun than the Earth, or how do we know the Earth goes around the Sun?"

The NAEP test in particular has questions that ask students to do that kind of analysis, which may explain some of the poor U.S. results, especially if students are taking state tests that are more about memorizing scientific concepts.

Mr. Eisenkraft said he has seen some states where the state test scores track students' NAEP scores pretty closely, but others where "98 percent of the students are passing the state test, but only 12 percent of them are proficient on NAEP."

"The only interpretation I can make is the students are being lied to -- they're being told they're doing all right at science, and how is the child supposed to know the state is allowing him to pass a test that is not the same as other students are taking around the country?"

***********************************************************

Another general problem: Many teachers who lead science classes don't have much training in it, and often they haven't taken many science courses in college.

That becomes particularly critical if the content is controversial, as in teaching evolution in biology classes.

Eric Plutzer, a political science professor at Penn State University, has found that 28 percent of high school biology teachers do a good job of teaching evolution and are comfortable with the subject, while 13 percent do not believe in Darwinian evolution and often won't teach it.

That leaves a broad group of nearly 60 percent of teachers who accept the concepts of evolution but are wary of dealing with critics in their communities, Mr. Plutzer said. As a result, they often tell their students they have to teach evolution because it's part of the state standards, "but everyone is free to believe what they want."

While the opposition to evolutionary biology usually has religious roots in America, there is a broader issue that affects adults in this country -- an overall lack of scientific literacy.

Jon Miller, a University of Michigan researcher who has done surveys on this issue for years, said there are two ways to look at the statistics.

On the one hand, scientific literacy has been rising, going from 10 percent in 1988 to 28 percent in 2008, which makes America second only to Sweden.

On the other hand, he said, "we live in a democracy and when only 28 percent of the people can understand climate change, for instance, that's not enough."

It's also not enough to keep American students competitive in the job market.

"People mistakenly believe that getting a diploma will guarantee them a good job for life," Mr. Miller said. "What we know about today's economy is that sometimes a piece of paper will get you an interview, but if you don't know the information, it won't get you very far."
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 08:46 am
@plainoldme,
It frightens me that you and FM are responsible for educating when you are in clear need of some yourselves . You really dont understand Spendi because you start off with hate . Everything is a foregone conclusion from there .
plainoldme
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2011 08:46 am
@Ionus,
You're in La La Land.
 

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