Latest Challenges to the Teaching of Evolution

@farmerman,

That's extended, big-time trolling.

It has no bearing on the teaching of evolution which is a completely seperate subject to evolution.

It might be offered as a justification of teaching religion on the grounds that the despair it might provoke in those of a nervous disposition could be ameliorated by religion.

The use of the term "humans" is misleading. It suggests that an operatic diva in the Metroploltan Opera, say, is somehow the equivalent of our primitive ancestors when we know that the latter's females were no more than reproductive mechanisms. I imagine that Janet Hopkins would think the post misogynistic.

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@spendius,

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I imagine that Janet Hopkins would think the post misogynistic.

Well dont say misogynistic like it is a bad thing....

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@farmerman,

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Youre staring to scare me.

Io is merely taking the logic of organic evolution to its very obvious and exceedingly simple conclusion. And social evolution you have on Ignore for reasons which it would insult the intelligence of viewers to point out again.

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@Ionus,

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Well dont say misogynistic like it is a bad thing....

It is a bad thing. Women have the right to do anything they wish in my view. That's why I steer well clear of all those who have not been tamed.

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@Ionus,

Ionus wrote:

Quote:

Quote:
Why would atheists tolerate anyone who cant survive without help?
Compassion and empathy, same as everyone else.
Doesnt show much faith in evolution does it if people firmly believe evolution is right but then flaunt it at the cost of our survival as a species.

I'm not sure what you are talking about, but the selective pressures related to humans (a species which benefits greatly from interaction with others) are not the same as the selective pressures on other species. So not only would atheists feel and respond to compassion and empathy as any other people would, but humanity as a species evolved with selective pressure associated with societal success. So to answer your original question, there are many reasons why atheists would tolerate and even assist someone who can't survive without help.

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@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

Quote:
Doesnt show much faith in evolution does it if people firmly believe evolution is right but then flaunt it at the cost of our survival as a species.
I know Im gonna regret this but whaaaaat?

Yeh, I didn't quite get that one either.

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@rosborne979,

Is English this guy's 4th language? LOL

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@cicerone imposter,

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Doesnt show much faith in evolution does it if people firmly believe evolution is right but then flaunt it at the cost of our survival as a species.

It's neat. Very easy to understand and succinct. The only things wrong with it is the missed apostrophe in "doesn't" and the absent question mark. Which are mere quibbles.

I can't understand why anybody above 6th grade would have any difficulty with it. Perhaps they might not understand why a respectable married man is the perfect case to point up its simple and true message.

Maybe fm, ros and ci. don't wish to let it get further than half-way along the optic nerve. Ignore has many variations. Unlike respectable married men with a missionary caste of mind.

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Ignore is a state of mind. It can be perfected by constant practice.

"I wish I hadn't heard that" is a sort of Pagan prayer to try to eradicate what was heard when off guard. The Ignore button on A2K is the crudest and simplest manifestation of the syndrome. The previous 3 posts to my last post are only slightly less obvious.

More complex ones are when a dictator surrounds himself with functionaries who daren't tell them anything he or, heaven forfend, She, wished they hadn't heard.

Which, from a speculative scientific point of view, might lead one to a hypothesis that any use of any variation of Ignore signifies a dictatorial sensibility which could only criticise Hosni Mubarak because he is a dictator and they are not. To be consistent I mean. Thinking a bit critically about wonderful reality.

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The final paragraph in my last post is actually confused enough to warrant the Ignore tactics of fm, ros and ci.

I get into personifying sensibilities. I would have to rework the damn thing to avoid such a crass error and I haven't the time nor the inclination. I've been stuck in Manchester's ring road complexities for too long today in a decent drizzle. One gets a sense of one's significance in such circumstances.

That's why the paths of Popes, Potentates, Premiers, Presidents and Prime Ministers (this is good--I can feel it) are eased for them so that no tangle of incompetences impedes their pompous progress as it might cause them to feel less significant and it is their significance which gives us our little iota of it.

Hence, the procedures we see on TV to make the path smooth for our leaders, and it has become very silly when a She has got Her sticky mitts on it, are a form of institutionalised Ignore. Quite expensive too. What Mr Obama's entrance into London for a conference must have cost I shudder to think and I wouldn't mind betting that a fair proportion of it trickled down into the flesh-spots of our noble Capital. I imagine it was not unlike a magic carpet experience for Mr Obama and he was only a beginner at the time. Unlike my day trip.

This is why people say that leaders have lost touch with the people. How can they not do. Could one have explained a traffic jam to Queen Victoria.

For the leader to get stuck in a traffic jam would tell him or Her how badly they were running the country in the starkest possible terms with a White Paper on the New Alternative Energy policy and thousands of vehicle are puffing out noxious fumes to not much effect is due for coming out and being argued over for months, if not years.

We pay out to have our leaders become detached from the people in order to get at our iota of vicarious significance. If we are proud of their manner of progess and its reflections upon ourselves we ought to be proud of having paid for it. Been patrons so to speak.

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@rosborne979,

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the selective pressures related to humans (a species which benefits greatly from interaction with others) are not the same as the selective pressures on other species.

Name one that is unique.

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So to answer your original question, there are many reasons why atheists would tolerate and even assist someone who can't survive without help.

I know they do, but what is the reason if it goes against evolution ?

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@cicerone imposter,

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Is English this guy's 4th language? LOL

Most people dont brag about their stupidity but you have always been different. Is that your best contribution ? Nothing more intellectual to say then bite at my heels ?

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@Ionus,

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I know they do, but what is the reason if it goes against evolution ?

Having it both ways of course. Being an evolutionist when it is necessary to prove that Christian inhibitions on aspects of sexual behaviour, which are not covered by law, are silly or worse and ignoring evolution when it is necessary to be thought a good person. It's schizophrenic really.

Being an evolutionist is handy also for drawing attention to the self and for venting vituperations, a form of low-level sadism, at a large and easy target but those only work by defining science in a very limited way or before a stupid audience.

Teaching evolution obviously requires the teachers to be of the type described and selection procedures for recruiting them to be skewed to produce the numbers required. With the recruitment pool being so small and the salaries of teachers being what they are I can't see 50,000,000 kids getting the standard of biology teaching they deserve.

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@cicerone imposter,

A neat trick in the "ignore " feature is to place your cursor over the word "ignored" and the name of the ignored will come up (This is only important to those of us that have multiple folks on ignore)
Life is so simple with that new addition, it prevents having to peek if you want to check on someones behavior.

The way these features on A2K continue to grow as "Add ons" is similar to how evolution works aint it?

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@farmerman,

Why are you proud of being arrogant and childish ? I can never understand why some here think they are more important if they ignore someone. Dont morals exist where you people live ? Why are you a better person if you dont listen to others ? Too insecure to accept differences ?

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@farmerman,

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The way these features on A2K continue to grow as "Add ons" is similar to how evolution works aint it?

Of course it is. And it never stops. What matters is the direction it takes us. Those of us who have Ignore on Ignore are just as much entitled to say that it is a positive evolutionary adaptation and taking us in a different direction from those who have their fellow debaters on Ignore which they see as a "sport".

One thing is sure. There was a time before Ignore and it arriving is new enough to be considered a mutation. Like a flounder having an eye up its arse would be.

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@Ionus,

Ionus wrote:

Quote:
the selective pressures related to humans (a species which benefits greatly from interaction with others) are not the same as the selective pressures on other species.
Name one that is unique.

Any behavior which benefits the individual within its cultural group can become a selective pressure. And since human culture is unique to humans, those behavioral benefits are also unique to humans.

Ionus wrote:

Quote:
So to answer your original question, there are many reasons why atheists would tolerate and even assist someone who can't survive without help.
I know they do, but what is the reason if it goes against evolution ?

Compassion and empathy. And here we are again.

1 Reply

@Ionus,

Ignore is an important feature to free the discussion of petulant and self centered trolling. Obviously those ignored would try to convinvce others that the one who is ignoring is being childish. ACtually by maintaining intellectual curiosity and civility in a debate is probably the best way to NOT be ignored. But several of the correspondents dont get it and they demand their "face time" even though theor attempts at argument are wholly insufficient and mostly gasconades of self abuse.

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I know they do, but what is the reason if it goes against evolution ?

Do you realize how silly this even sounds? Im trying to hold on to a decent discussion with you but it gets difficult when statements like that seem to make sense to you. As you can see, many of us from different viewpoints think its silliness. Now , the only question left is whether it was merely firing for effect

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OKLAHOMA UPDATE

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Evolution bills draw national attention
( By Dustin Hughes, Sand Springs Leader, February 9, 2011)

A pair of bills dealing with the teaching of evolution in Oklahoma public schools has drawn national attention - including scrutiny from a science education advocacy group.

House Bill 1551, filed by State Rep. Sally Kern (R-Oklahoma City) and Senate Bill 554, filed by State Sen. Josh Breechen (R-Coalgate), both would allow for alternate explanations other than natural selection to be put into play in science courses.

Backers of the bills say they allow for open discussion about controversies in science.

Opponents say the bills are a back-door attempt to introduce creationism into the classroom.

Kern’s bill states “some scientific subjects, such as biological evolution, the chemical origins of life, global warming, and human cloning can cause controversy.” The bill would prohibit students from being penalized because they subscribe to a particular position on scientific theories.

“No student should ever be penalized for personal views on this issue,” Kern said.

“They are both what we call ‘Academic Freedom’ bills,” said Steven Newton, programs and policy director for the National Center for Science Education. The California-based nonprofit defends the teaching of evolution in public schools, Newton said.

“It sounds nice,” Newton said. “Who’s against scientific education, scientific freedom?”

But he said the bills really are meant to cast doubt specifically on evolution.

In a statement, Kern said the bill was meant to allow for a full discussion of scientific ideas and promote critical thinking.

“It’s a simple fact that the presentation of some issues in science classes can lead to controversy, which can discourage teachers from engaging students in an open discussion of the issues,” Kern said. “Our students are not well-served by glossing over controversies and I believe schools should develop policies that help guide teachers through this process.”

“My response to that would be that the only controversies that are in this realm are manufactured by the creationist side,” Newton said. “They’re not controversies recognized by any practicing scientists.”

Newton said the language in the bills closely follows that of model legislation published by the Discovery Institute, a group that supports teaching of intelligent design in schools, saying that some segments were “cut and pasted.”

Newton said, if passed, the legislation could have a chilling effect on Oklahoma schools and students, especially those pursuing scientific or medical fields.

Kern said the legislation is meant to promote discussion in the classroom by opening up alternative theories.

“There is a process scientific ideas go through to eventually be accepted for public school curriculum. You don’t do it legislatively,” Newton said.

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@wandeljw,

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Backers of the bills say they allow for open discussion about controversies in science.

Well, then they must not be interested in evolution, since it is not scientifically controversial.

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