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Will Obama Need a Wheelchair in Near Future?

 
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 10:12 am
dagmaraka wrote:
From wikipedia :

[quote]African Americans or Black Americans are citizens or residents of the United States who have origins in any of the black racial groups of Africa.[5] In the United States, the term is generally used for Americans with at least partial Sub-Saharan African ancestry. African Americans make up the single largest racial minority in the United States,[7] though Hispanics compose the largest ethnic minority.


(why speculate and invent what the term means when there are definitions out there?)[/quote]

Anyone can add to Wikipedia.

I lived through the evolution of the terminology; you did not; the current usage might be historically incorrect for us older native Americans.

If you want to get technical, we possibly have a common ancestor in the last one-thousand years from Eastern Europe; however, I would guess you do not consider me family.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 10:17 am
H2O_MAN wrote:
Some say we all have roots that can be traced all the way back to Africa, be we are all members of the same human race.

Why denigrate the human race by hyphenating?


Follow your logic: we then are all African-American.
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old europe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 10:20 am
Foofie wrote:
The term African-American reflects, in my opinion, an evolution of the politically correct terms that Black Americans, with ancestors here from the pre-Civil War, wanted to be called.


Why only Black Americans with ancestors from pre-Civil War times? What did Americans with origins in one of the black racial groups of Africa whose ancestors arrived in America after the Civil War want to be called?
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dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 10:22 am
Foofie wrote:
dagmaraka wrote:
From wikipedia :

[quote]African Americans or Black Americans are citizens or residents of the United States who have origins in any of the black racial groups of Africa.[5] In the United States, the term is generally used for Americans with at least partial Sub-Saharan African ancestry. African Americans make up the single largest racial minority in the United States,[7] though Hispanics compose the largest ethnic minority.


(why speculate and invent what the term means when there are definitions out there?)


Anyone can add to Wikipedia.

I lived through the evolution of the terminology; you did not; the current usage might be historically incorrect for us older native Americans.

If you want to get technical, we possibly have a common ancestor in the last one-thousand years from Eastern Europe; however, I would guess you do not consider me family.[/quote]

i really do not care about your or anyone's heritage. that's not what defines people for me.

and you having lived here? that doesn't give you monopoly on truth. wiki is edited, by edited by many and fact-checked and if something is not supported by data or references, it is flagged. but anyway, there are tons of other definitions out there.

native american? you? Laughing let's not even go there.
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H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 10:24 am
Foofie wrote:
H2O_MAN wrote:
Some say we all have roots that can be traced all the way back to Africa, be we are all members of the same human race.

Why denigrate the human race by hyphenating?


Follow your logic: we then are all African-American.


No - We here in the US are Americans.
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 10:32 am
dagmaraka wrote:
native american? you? Laughing let's not even go there.


That was a bit odd, wasn't it?
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 10:36 am
well, especially while we talk about established terminology Very Happy
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Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 11:28 am
dagmaraka wrote:

native american? you? Laughing let's not even go there.


I am using the term like my other identify: native New Yorker.

I am not a Native American. I am an American born in this country; a native.

And, much is politically correct today, so I discount what does not coincide with my own experience. Like today Russians are Eastern Europeans; in my childhood, Russians were referred to as Eurasians. Not that either is correct, but I am just explaining the usage of terms that I remember.

Another example: While today my ancestry might be referred to as Eastern European Jewish, the German Jews that were here before my grandparents referred to them as Oriental Jews (since Russia is on the Asian continent). See. Times change the usage of terminilogy.

Or, in WWI there were posters in the U.S. to join the military saying something about "beating the Huns." How many people today think of Germans as Huns? Canard or not, it was standard usage then.

And, since so much of this thread is Obama related, let us be honest and admit that less than 100 years ago there was a term that individuals of mixed Black and White parentage referred to themselves as. It was not considered an epithet, but became one when there was a politically raised consciousness that desired group cohesion, in my opinion.

Continuing the quest for candidness, there was also the term octoroon (one-eighth Black) which might have been used in small town America, more than urban America, since the inference was that someone might be blond and blue-eyed, but there are Black ancestors in the family.

I am not sure how well you relate to the historical racial divide in this country, since I do not know if your perceptions tend to reflect a current "snap-shot" of how you see society today. That is why I find it difficult to discuss this topic with you. You might have read a lot, but there are other perceptions that one picks up, if they grew up in this country, in my opinion.
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dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 02:01 pm
that's all good and well, but if you discount what doesn't coincide with your experience, you may have difficulty communicating with people, who mostly go by established (and always evolving) definitions.

after all, if we all gave our own meaning to things, we'd all be just talking jibberish at each other.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 31 Jul, 2008 06:59 pm
dagmaraka wrote:
that's all good and well, but if you discount what doesn't coincide with your experience, you may have difficulty communicating with people, who mostly go by established (and always evolving) definitions.

after all, if we all gave our own meaning to things, we'd all be just talking jibberish at each other.


You mean like the barbarians could not, or would not, learn Latin?

Anyway, while definitions are "always evolving," they evolve nowadays oftentimes to effect a euphemism for political correctness. A personal example, there never was a word historically as "Jewish." In the U.S. it took the place of "Jew," since Jew was so often used as a negative epithet. Or, in the South it might still be phrased as a possible question, "Are you Jew?" not caring that it is considered impolite to not put the article "a" in front of the noun.

My point? If one knows the historical usage of terms, they understand much more than evolving terminology; they also oftentimes understand social history and what a euphemism is camouflaging.
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