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Is it wrong to kill evil people?

 
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  0  
Reply Mon 7 Jul, 2008 11:44 am
anything or anyone who runs contrary to the needs and comfort of the quinneys is evil and requires immediate disposal.

It's a simple rule and covers every situation and contingency.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 7 Jul, 2008 05:10 pm
Yeah, but where to ya hide the bodies?
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  0  
Reply Mon 7 Jul, 2008 05:14 pm
existential potential wrote:
Setanta, you were right to mention "Beyond good and evil", but you did put it in a way that implied that that book was the final word on "good and evil" which of course it certainly isn't.


No, i didn't imply any such thing. I had pointed out that the good/bad dichotomy could be described in what are essentially utilitarian terms--what is beneficial is good, what harms is bad. I was making the point that there is a difference between the good/bad dichotomy and the good/evil dichotomy. This was challenged with a rather dull witted assertion to the effect that good and bad cannot be defined that way.

I only mentioned Beyond Good and Evil because it has a succinct discussion of the fundamental differences between the good/bad and the good/evil dichotomies, and as Nietzsche was educated as a philologist, that part of the discussion was probably the most "value neutral" part of the work, since he looks at those dichotomies as they arise in the comparisons of the operative words in several different languages.

I could have explained that in that detail to the member who had made the stupid objection, but it is my experience of that member that that would have been an exercise in casting pearls before swine.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Jul, 2008 12:32 am
Re: Is it wrong to kill evil people?
DrewDad wrote:
Only so long as they have no redeeming qualities, I imagine.

It depends upon what the evil person is doing when u kill him
(to prevent him from doing it)

or

upon what the evil person has done before u kill him
(if u r killing him out of vengeance).




David
0 Replies
 
Robert Gentel
 
  0  
Reply Sat 26 Jul, 2008 01:44 am
hawkeye10 wrote:
You have to conclude that this is no longer (if it ever was) an area of agreement. It was once the western norm that life is sacred, that a man does not have a right to take another man's life, only God does. However, when the most powerful nation on earth, the leader of the free world, regularly adopts a policy of assassination (the latest target "high value terrorist targets"-what ever the hell that means) then it is no longer a norm that we live by.


By that standard, it never was.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Jul, 2008 04:40 pm
If an innocent man is convicted of a crime,
after a fair trial in a government run court,
that is a horrible thing.

If a citizen "vigilante" hunts down an innocent man
and with or without a trial, inflicts vengeance upon him that is EQUALLY horrible,
if (for the sake of argument) the inflicted penalties are equally severe.


If a citizen, in " vigilante " mode
hunts down and kills a multiple murderer,
is there any IMMORALITY in that ?
I don 't see any immorality in that.

No man is morally obligated to obey any law; he is merely under threat
of vengeance by government, if he does not.

Morality is not defined by the law issued by a government.
(Historicallly, governments have been much less moral than individual citizens.)





COMMENT ? (That does not mean just hurl personal insults.)



David
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Jul, 2008 05:52 pm
The laws of this country would still find you guilty of a crime; it doesn't matter whether it's moral or immoral.

You had options before creating any vigilante group, and that is to call the cops for "them" to arrest the (multiple murder) criminal and bring him to justice.

Attempted murder or premeditated murder is a crime in the US.

Morality is a very subjective criteria that is not only different by culture, but in history of the same culture.

This kind of "what if" scenarios are not realistic.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Jul, 2008 09:14 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:


Quote:
The laws of this country would still find you guilty of a crime;
it doesn't matter whether it's moral or immoral.

True, but this is a separate and distinct issue.
For example, Jack Ruby knew for sure that he 'd be convicted
of killing Oswald, since he did it in front of the sheriff, half the town
and on national TV, but he did it anyway.
Apparently, in his vu, it was the right thing to do.



Quote:

You had options before creating any vigilante group,
and that is to call the cops for "them" to arrest the (multiple murder) criminal and bring him to justice.

Yes.
That is the EASIEST way to handle it.
As a general rule,
that 's what I 'd do; or possibly just forget about it,
depending on how I felt about it.




Quote:

Attempted murder or premeditated murder is a crime in the US.

Yes,
but analysing the law is not what this thread is about.
I was asking about what is right or rong,
not what is legal or illegal.



Quote:

Morality is a very subjective criteria that is not only different by culture,
but in history of the same culture.

This kind of "what if" scenarios are not realistic.

Thay can be interesting, tho.


I remember an actor called "Mr. T" saying in an interview
that his mother complained of having been robbed
by someone in their neighborhood.
He said that he and his brothers hunted him down
and "you won 't see him no more."

If I were on a jury before whom he and his brothers
were prosecuted for homicide, under those circumstances,
I 'd find them not guilty.

I think that the reasoning in support of that is worth discussing.




`
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Jul, 2008 09:53 pm
OmSigDAVID wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:


Quote:
The laws of this country would still find you guilty of a crime;
it doesn't matter whether it's moral or immoral.

True, but this is a separate and distinct issue.
For example, Jack Ruby knew for sure that he 'd be convicted
of killing Oswald, since he did it in front of the sheriff, half the town
and on national TV, but he did it anyway.
Apparently, in his vu, it was the right thing to do.

We can't separate morals and our laws, because the laws of our country is the final arbiter of what happens in the final analysis; it doesn't matter what each individual's moral claims.


Quote:

You had options before creating any vigilante group,
and that is to call the cops for "them" to arrest the (multiple murder) criminal and bring him to justice.

Yes.
That is the EASIEST way to handle it.
As a general rule,
that 's what I 'd do; or possibly just forget about it,
depending on how I felt about it.

Each individual determines how they will respond to any crime. Some will even get involved in the attempt to stop the crime, but I believe most will not take any action - during or after they witness a crime.



Quote:

Attempted murder or premeditated murder is a crime in the US.

Yes,
but analysing the law is not what this thread is about.
I was asking about what is right or rong,
not what is legal or illegal.

I believe that my above response answers this question; some will act, and most not.


Quote:

Morality is a very subjective criteria that is not only different by culture,
but in history of the same culture.

This kind of "what if" scenarios are not realistic.

Thay can be interesting, tho.


I remember an actor called "Mr. T" saying in an interview
that his mother complained of having been robbed
by someone in their neighborhood.
He said that he and his brothers hunted him down
and "you won 't see him no more."

If I were on a jury before whom he and his brothers
were prosecuted for homicide, under those circumstances,
I 'd find them not guilty.

I think that the reasoning in support of that is worth discussing.

Barring the legal aspects of any crime (although you would find them not guilty in the scenario you described), and addressing only the moral aspects of it, we will find that different people will have different responses to any one crime. There will never be an easy "consensus" as to the morality of any crime, because different people have different concepts of morality.



`
0 Replies
 
JLNobody
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 Aug, 2008 01:10 pm
As I understand the philologist turned philospher,Nietzsche, Setanta's summary is spot on:

"Beyond Good and Evil is a work in which [Nietzsche] expounds his philosophical view that there is no actual, absolute morality. But the point for bringing it up here is that it begins with a philological examination of the dichotomies good/bad, and good/evil. There is a point to be made that the good/bad dichotomy hinges upon utility (that which benefits me is good, that which harms me is bad), but that the good/evil dichotomy is an appeal to an absolute moral standard."

And--while "radical" in his originality and honesty--Nietzsche may also be characterized as one of the most influential philosophers today.
0 Replies
 
OGIONIK
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 Aug, 2008 07:08 pm
killing is perfectly ok in itself.

even if they are good, its how the world works.
0 Replies
 
JLNobody
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 Aug, 2008 10:11 pm
That comes as close to "evil" as we are going to hear. It may be BEYOND good and evil, with its matter of fact reference to the way things work, but, with regard to values it certainly isn't "perfectly o.k.".
0 Replies
 
Gelisgesti
 
  2  
Reply Fri 1 Aug, 2008 11:13 pm
It is permissable only on a preemptive basis .... or if they won't give up their national treasures or agricultural discoveries or oil stuff.
0 Replies
 
OGIONIK
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 Aug, 2008 11:16 pm
JLNobody wrote:
That comes as close to "evil" as we are going to hear. It may be BEYOND good and evil, with its matter of fact reference to the way things work, but, with regard to values it certainly isn't "perfectly o.k.".


who you to tell nature how to operate.


nature loves killing, thats how we eat.
0 Replies
 
OGIONIK
 
  0  
Reply Fri 1 Aug, 2008 11:18 pm
its funny, people dont think anything of eating a plant.


imagine if somone pulled you out of bed and started chewing on you.


wouldnt be fun i imagine...
0 Replies
 
Sglass
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 Aug, 2008 11:21 pm
Bad Karma
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Aug, 2008 01:04 am
Yeah,
at least an animal can try to get away, or fight back,
but a plant is rooted down. It doesn t seem fair.
0 Replies
 
OGIONIK
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Aug, 2008 02:19 am
im telling you.

plants got it bad.

except ones with poisons.




those ones are evil. kill em' all RARARAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
0 Replies
 
JLNobody
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Aug, 2008 03:13 pm
I guess death IS a good analgesic.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Aug, 2008 03:42 pm
Some poisonous plants are used as herbs for medicinal purposes.
0 Replies
 
 

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