friends

That would end any of my friendships.

I can tolerate other political views than mine and have friends who do.

But humanly, I'm unable to tolerate views and positions that harm a person, just because he/she is different...

dys, did you talk to him about it?

Dys
Dys, did you tell your friend about your reaction to his racist statement? If no, why not? Is it possible to learn why he feels that way?

I'm puzzled that you never discovered his racism during your 15 year friendship.

You said the two of you had helped each other through tough times. Is this one of those times? Could you get him to talk about why he feels as he does? Would talking about it help him to change his attitude?

Your friend needs your help to rid himself of his racism. Would he do the same for you? Has he asked why you have taken yourself out of his life?

Five years is a long time to wonder about it. Why not take the chance? The Lady Diane would be helpful to both of you at such a sensitive time.

BBB

I've taken the same track. What starts as fledgeling friendship quickly becomes adversarial when the acquaintance proves out to be a bigot. I can't keep my mouth shut when someone discrimiates based on race or other such considerations. It's okay to disagree politically, within reasonable bounds. After all, I, a member of the liberal camp, believe that true conservatism can be reasond with. But, no; I can't be friends with the bigots.

I had a friend (who is still my friend) whom i have known for more than a decade, and he commonly made racist remarks. I told him i would not hang out in such an atmosphere, and he desisted. I don't delude myself that his opinions have necessarily changed, but he does not express such sentiments in my presence, which is sufficient for me. I don't consider it reasonable to assume that i can change others, and would resent an attempt by others to change me. I do think, however, that my remark had an influence on him. This was one of those odd situations in which his expressed opinion did not match his behavior--i've never seen him treat black people any differently than anyone else whom he encountered. I suspect his racist remarks were simply an unconsidered repetition of the kind of remarks he would have heard in his early life--he came from a background of ignorant and bigoted people, but did not give any evidence by his behavior that he practiced bigotry himself. He simply expressed it.

I forgot to use spell check. Sorry.

That ain't gonna end our friendship..

Hey Dys

It's a tough one a?

I have a friend who is racist - though of course vehemently denies it... he's (they) are American - I also have "ex" friends here in Devon who are racist and have done/not done, said other things -

my American friends - well, I tolerate their attitudes because I love them and though I do not agree with how they feel, it's their beliefs etc that cause their bigotry. In their house - their opinions and right to talk, in my house, they would still say things but I just say i disagree and we normally not go into indpeth discussions on it. I love them so accept them for who they are even though I do not understand their feelings / thoughts behind their views. Different people, different upbringings, different views on life.

The "ex" friends here... I choose not to see them because even tho I cared for them deeply, their opinions are so far from mine on issues more than race etc... and I just can't be bothered to try and make it work any more. e.g. him... "my child will never be gay because we dressed him in blue and he plays football" - I just don't understand that mentality so... no longer choose to engage in a relationship with them. (lots of other stuff too re mental health and gumph... many reasons).

I also have parents who are homophobic and have "racist tendancies shall we say)... which I find very hard to tolerate - but it is who they are (and yet my Uncle who died many years ago was gay). We do not have open discussions any longer as it causes too much heartache.

I guess you tolerate people and their views provided it does not cause you to hurt. If you were to turn up at your friends house with an African American and your friend chose not to let you in the door because of it... then I would feel that would be intolerable.

If their views are "generalised" and not personal - doesn't make it right - but then everyone has their own points of view.

If I knew someone was an extremely bad person personally, and they turned up at my house with a "friend" of mine - I do not know quite what I would do - if I felt uncomfortable in my own home with them being there - I guess my feelings would have to be more important than my friends feelings. I haven't had that experience yet - so I am not sure.

If someone came to my house who, for instance, hit's their kids as a punishment, though I disagree with it, would I allow them to do it in my house? In front of my child? I don't know. It's hard to ask someone to leave - even when you find it hard to tolerate something. But that goes for swearing, or anything like that. My 15years swears all the time (doesn't live here) - I tolerate it because he is my son and I cannot control what he says or does. People drink alcohol and can become abusive and nasty.... I find that hard to tolerate, yet I know people who do it. Some folk I would not give the time of day. Some folk I would tolerate it knowing they are not "bad" per se, but I would choose not to stay around them whilst they are drinking.

It's hard - I think it all comes down to how much you feel about someone personally to know what you can and will, or can't and won't tolerate.

With friends you have to weigh up what their relationship means to you, as opposed to what their views on life mean to you. Sometimes you can tolerate compromise, sometimes it just isn't possible.

If you miss your friend - is it worth contacting him - tell him you miss him - and explain why you have lost contact... "friends" - true friends are hard to find. If you miss him - call him or write a note.... it all depends on how much the friendship means personally. I don't think people can change "bigotry" or "their view of life" because someone else thinks differently - people have their own opinions "right or wrong" - who is to say - but compromise or acceptance of who they are, I guess is what it's about ... I may be wrong, I guess that's just what I do - somethings I will compromise on ... others, well, not in a millions years!

(sorry rambling now )

dys- I concur with Setanta. Talk with your friend. Try to find out where he is coming from. It seems to me that after fifteen years of friendship, it is unwise to cut it off without asking for an explanation.

Has he attempted to connect with you after the remark? At the time, did you argue about it? Apparently, from what you have written, at the time of your breakup, it was the first time that he had indicated that he did not care to socialize with African-Americans.

It was not that he was the sort of person who constantly made bigoted remarks. THAT I would never stand. Perhaps he felt comfortable enough with you to open himself up to you. You and I really don't know. I think that it would be wise for you to explore things further with this friend before you write him off.

one of my better friends in life , I call Miss Toxic.
She is a bush supporter of the worst kind. She is a walking contradiction and racist in her own right.

But that is her. And though I love her, I know my limits.

I can only take her in small spurts and waves..

but there are things that she could do that would end our friendship just as quickly.

I think limits are our own and once they are hit, you dont need to question them. You will feel it. And that is the end. You are who and what you surround yourself with. So make it feel good.

That's rough, and it sure would depend on the overall relationship, to me.

I'd for sure ask about it, and explore it, and if this was something standing between my friend and I that couldn't be worked out, then sometimes yes we all have our own limits.

Once, I left a long friendship due not to the words or actions of a friend but her inactions.

She had chosen a sexist, racist, man into her life. The relationship started to get rocky. He was from a different culture, a different 'race' if you like to call it that.

This man when I met him answered my introduction with "What are you doing? What is this? Women don't speak to men like that. You don't speak without being spoken to first".

My friend stood by and said nothing. Deferred to him.

Though I understand, and did at the time, understand this man to be abusive and my friend in need of support - that was my line.

She not only could not , would not stand up for herself, she allowed another to treat me like trash and went along with it in silence. That has no place in my life, hard line.

So some have criticized me for my decision there, but like Shewolf says, we all have our boundaries.

Sometimes these things, often, are the straws too that broke the camels back. There were other things going on: but trying to make it work for the sake of the friendship, and sometimes allowing a little too much to pass and it builds up.

Many years ago I spent a few weeks staying with my sister in FL. She decided to throw a party near the end of my stay and wanted to invite all the folks I'd made friendships with while I was there. This included one black co-worker of hers and she faced a significant dilemma. Many of her friends/neighbors would never step foot in her house again if she invited this man into her home for a social occasion. She couldn't face him in the workplace if she didn't. She eventually decided that peace and harmony in the neighborhood was more meaningful to her than making a personal stand on behalf of her workmate.

I would have made the opposite choice, but she is my sister and we maintain a civil relationship. I haven't forgotten, obviously, but she needs to live in her own skin and I need to live in mine. We still talk about bigotry and we are still on opposite sides of worrying about what the neighbors think. I don't understand her position but I will never change her, nor will she ever change me.

Speaking in a bigoted manner in the privacy of one's home is a potentially different animal than acting in a bigoted manner in public.

That is only true, seems to me, if there is truly privacy. Having outsiders (fiends, visitors, etc.) makes it more like public.

From the confines of one's thought, to the expression in full public.

Thinking hard on this.

I doubt I could ever get even friendly with someone who, immediately or shortly after meeting them showed signs of bigotry. I call few people friends, and we became friends not just because of what we already had in common, but because each of us saw in the other something we aspire to. I don't have to be around people that have hate like that, life's too short. I also would be embarrassed to have to make excuses for that person to other people.

I'm trying to imagine knowing someone for 10 years before realizing they were a bigot. Honestly, I don't know if I can. I'm not disbelieving you dys, I guess I mean if I found something like that out after knowing them so long, shocked would be a mild word.

A lot of my immediate family have bigoted ways, and I find I have nothing to communicate with them about.

Sorry, that probably doesn't help you. Didn't help me either.

Mr B and I recently watch the movie "The Straight Story" about a man who was estranged from his brother over some long-ago argument. He got word that his brother had suffered a stroke and he became obsessed with seeing the brother again to try to make peace. He was no longer able to drive, so he hitched a wagon to the back of his John Deere tractor and drove it across Iowa and into WI where his brother lived. It's based on a true story.

Much of the story is about the people he met along his journey, but it also was very much a story of burying old hatchets and making peace. It was definitely a tear-jerker but a very good movie.

He was no longer able to drive, but he drove a John Deere tractor and wagon across Iowa and into WI and it's based on a true story?

No, it was a lawn mower. Nice story and movie...