Your cellphone plan is petty stuff! Heck for now just turn it off. Since it's a new phone it's almost always him calling.
Normally, I think people go a bit overboard when discussing 'abuse' and 'harrassment'. I dismiss a lot of it. This, however, is not one of those times.
Seriously, this guy sounds like a real fruitcake. You may not need to go so far as getting a restraining order, but I'm really wondering what it's going to take to get rid of him.
Phone companies will sometimes give you a new number, but normally it's with some 'proof' that you are being stalked and/or abused. It can't hurt to give your provider a call and ask.
Also, do you live alone/with a roommate or family? I'd give those people a heads up about what's going on.
The guy has called here at work and hung up (sometimes up to 15 times in a row) endangering her job. He has done it to my cellphone when he thinks she's with me.
There is more than sufficient proof of his telephone stalking.
ditto what craven and sugar just said. Turn the phone off for now and see if he doesn't just give up. Something tells me he isn't going to though.
The phone company should be able to quickly look at your call log and see what is going on. In many jurisdictions, this is enough for them to issue another number.
Yep, what ehBeth said. The phone company can pull the logs. The guy is stalking you. It's time to (a) get the phone number changed and (b) contact your local police and give them the heads up. Even if you don't want to file charges, it doesn't hurt to make them aware that this is going on. This info could save your life and it'll certainly help you with your peace of mind.
How's it going, Justabrat?
You sort of asked what is the pull that keeps people sucked into these sorts of relationships - I THINK it is the sweet, smooth clicking together of cunningly complementary vulnerabilities. There is a consequent "so right, so familiar, so at home" feeling - plus lots and lots of drama and consequent high emotional arousal, which some of us can be a little fond of - especially if we are used to it from early relationships. (Ok, so I sound like a bad shrink - sorry! - Craven can tell you that I AM a bad shrink, so at least I am being true to myself! - but this is one I have done lots of thinking about over a long and chequered career - though my particular clickings are different).
I think of it as being a bit like velcro! Dunno if that conceptualization helps at all?
Thing is, I am 99% certain that this fella will do the same in his next relationship, too - and the one after that, and the one after that.......while you can clearly learn. Good luck with it! Got a new phone number yet?
I'm not a shrink at all, but I have heard, albeit via anthropolgical hearsay that the 'bad boy' wins the fight with wimmins. Biological it is, choosing the hunter, the agitator, the abuser over the nice guy, the thinker, the planner, the safe one...why? Hmm....well, in olden times, the agressive ones were the ones who protected the wimmins. Life was also terribly abusive back then, but life continued, based on the idea of 'protection.' Wimmins still have an inborn feeling that the 'psycho' will 'protect' them somehow, and that personal abuse can somehow be 'forgiven'. So wrong....
Mins are also biologically wired to think they need to impress, possess, and what not, to keep up with crap they shouldn't even be concerned with. Also bad. Very bad indeed. "Arrgh!! My personal evolved ape self be better than yours! I dominate all!" Yikes! Scary stuff...
Cut your ties...I originally suggested getting back with your ex, but it seems the consensus is that you should be on your own.
You may be right about the origin of attraction, Cav. But I do believe we have evolved considerably since then. Well, ahem, MOST of us anyway.
Lots & lots of reasons why such behavior is still around, though (low self-esteem, bullying, manipulation, fear, etc.) and none of those reasons is good.
Advice to justabrat
The second guy sounds abusive, and I would strongly suggest you should leave him forthwith.
As for the first guy, there are several possibilities that come to mind. On the one hand, you could have left him for screwed-up reasons. The allure of being addicted to the second guy may have basely pulled you away from him. Or it may be that the first guy really was boring, prudish, or otherwise unreasonable. Or it may be that you were also addicted to the first guy just as you seem to be addicted to the second guy, and that you chose the second guy merely because he was the same as the first, only more so.
As for the third possibility, that the first guy is like the second only less so, it should go without saying you should leave both guys in the dust of your past and move on. Perhaps you can fall back on your family? If your family tells you "I told you so", well, don't look at that as a defeat. If, for instance, your problems with some guys were a result of an excess reaction to your parent's fears and anxieties, then yeah, you will be a target for manipulation, but that is no big deal--you will gain practice in resisting such and manipulation isn't win-lose like being screwed-up or addicted is--you can be just a little manipulated without that being such a big deal. Subjecting yourself to some manipulation from parents is not like a former cigarette smoker choosing to smoke a few cigarettes, for instance. And of course, your parents if typical (or clean friends or other close relatives) might be able to help you get through withdrawal and actually help to keep you from reverting (puritanism isn't completely bad).
What about the other two possibilities, in which the first male is not at all addictive or abusive? The second possibility, that he is boring or otherwise unworthy of you, should be handled similarly to the first possibility, that you left him unjustly. If you go back to a physical relationship right away, that is likely to make the first guy think you are trying to play him off the other second guy. If the first guy is your typical decent male, he is likely to have been very unsettled by your behavior with your second boyfriend and your wanting to go back to him in a sexual way right away could turn him into something similar to a bitter bible-thumping hell-fire-and-brimstone Bible- thumping TV evangelist. That's probably not what you want. He will wonder whether you just might be trying to make the second boyfriend more jealous in order to provoke the second boyfriend into being more addictively controlling. An even worse possibility is that you will make the first guy so insecure as to cause him to try to emulate the second guy in the latter's abusiveness. You might be tempted into prematurely seeking a physical relationship with the first guy from your feeling a need to reassure yourself that you are desirable or from your desire to reduce your withdrawal. If that's what you choose, that would be much better than staying with the second guy, but IMO not quite as preferable to allowing yourself to somewhat level off and to cleanse yourself emotionally before seeking physical intimacy with the first guy. Once you have chilled out for a while, you pretty much won't have lost anything except time, and so basically should be just as desirable as before.
But, assuming the first guy was not also addictively or abusively controlling, I would say you should very quickly reestablish non-intimate contact with him. If the first guy likes you, he is likely to have on some level emotionally felt the need to heroically rescue you from your new abusive boyfriend. It's a very awkward and unsettling state of mind for a male in that state--feeling on some level that you screwed-up and need to be rescued, yet on another level wanting to respect your feelings and your right to choose males freely. If you are open with him when you reform, showing your reformation, you will not need to fear his wasting his time or driving himself insane plotting your rescue. And you won't have to put up with whatever crazy behavior you might cause in him. So reform and make him know you have reformed. This will cause his emotions to settle down, and then, your emotions both reasonable again, you can safely, if you want to, be with him intimately. If in fact you should not start or restart a physical relationship, because, for example, he is just too boring or whatever, then of course do not do so, and if you want eventually stop or lessen your friendship with him. But if the first guy is in fact at least typically decent, IMO you owe him at the least (as a sort of penance for your screwed-up behavior) to make sure that you make an effort (via conversation following your reformation) to relieve him of any painful emotional baggage that you may have unjustly weighed him down with.
A guess would be that if you did what you did with the second guy as an emotional reaction to something clean the first guy didn't give you, that suggests an emotional attraction to the first guy that makes me think you love him. On the other hand, if you just left the first guy from boredom or lack of love or pleasure, and tried the second guy for no particular reason relating to the first guy, my guess is that you probably aren't much in love with the first guy, and that you should (after chilling out for a while) seek someone new.
Dlowan's and Cavfancier's explanations for the pull of abusive relationships to some women is wrong, IMO. It's simple addiction, I think.
justabrat, call the police. This guy has stepped over the line.
Codependency
I would say that wanting an abusive person is generally not codependency as Husker's last post defines and describes. Yes, Justabrat's abusive boyfriend seems to be trying to make her feel screwed-up, but for not wanting to be screwed-up (though maybe the main real purpose of his complaints is to terrorize her). If Justabrat were to go back to him, I'd say she should feel screwed-up (for wanting to be screwed-up) and ashamed (but of course, she shouldn't feel screwed-up for not wanting to be screwed-up or for seeking advice, no she should feel proud for that). Contrary to what many self-help and pop psychology gurus say, self-esteem and proactivity aren't always appropriate (in particular, not when you feel you may really be strongly addicted to something bad). And just because people often wrongly try to make you feel screwed-up doesn't mean that the phenomenon of being screwed-up is merely some sort of social construct; in fact, that it is so easy to manipulate people in this way suggests that there is a purpose to people feeling ashamed and screwed-up, or else people wouldn't have evolved to so easily feel that way.
Yeah, I gotta agree. The phone calls, the threats, the constant up and down between threat and 'You're my world'....this can only end messy if you don't take control of the situation, which I think would actually do wonders for you, and give you a clear head about what to do next. step offered some good insight. Perhaps you should ask yourself if this behaviour pattern of yours is an addiction. I put it in different words, but the sentiment was pretty much the same. Husker posted a good link as well. There is a HUGE difference between working together as a couple for mutual benefit and love, and "NEEDING" the partner to "SURVIVE". Get out now. This will only get worse.
She's out. Still! I hope....
Great news Craven. Thanks for letting us know. This has surely been on my mind.
BTW Deb she liked the explanation you posted.
What are the Compliance Patterns in Codependence?
Wow, thanks to everyone for the responses. I have been staying away from the 2nd guy, and have seen the ex for lunch (as friends). I even asked him to check out this topic.
In order for him to better understand what i'm feeling and possibly understand help him deal with his own feelings.
I told him my decision at the moment is for us to be friends and maybe in a couple of months after I get used to being by myself, we can go from there.
I also told him that I do not expect him to wait around for me and that if he meets someone else, and I show up one day, all he needs to do is tell me and I will walk away.
I only want him to be happy. He deserves it. We both made mistakes in our relationship and now its up to me to grow up (as I often refuse to do) and do the right thing for everyone.
justabrat
