John McCain has always been a phony & a scumbag; want proof?

Re: John McCain's real base is the Press


You know NOTHING of how "casual" my reading of said piece was, Cyclo, since (unlike you) I haven't looked anywhere near this site in several days.

The sheer inanity of judging commentary by speed of response will become evident to you as and when your side-effects like involontary spasms, presumably including frantic nonsensical typing, from your psychiatric medication stop. Wishing you better health soon

Re: John McCain's real base is the Press


I said your disregard was casual, not that your reading was casual. You didn't address any of the points in the piece, but merely criticized the length. I never claimed you didn't read it or that you read it casually.

Your attempt at personal insult falls flat and is mocked. Better reading comprehension will help avoid embarrassment such as this in the future.

Cycloptichorn

Re: John McCain's real base is the Press
[quote="Cycloptichorn]

Your attempt at personal insult falls flat and is mocked. Better reading comprehension will help avoid embarrassment such as this in the future.

Cycloptichorn[/quote]

This ain't no "attempt", Cycl, this is fact. Look up "demonstrable fact" next time you come across a dictionary - not a likely occurrence, as you surely take some time off from posting in order to eat, sleep, use the bathroom.....ummm... surely?!

Re: John McCain's real base is the Press


This ain't no "attempt", Cycl, this is fact. Look up "demonstrable fact" next time you come across a dictionary - not a likely occurrence, as you surely take some time off from posting in order to eat, sleep, use the bathroom.....ummm... surely?![/quote]

Can you point out the 'demonstrable fact?' Specifically, please. For I contend that your insult was in fact lame, did fall flat, was mocked, and is now being mocked yet again

You ought to stop digging.

Cycloptichorn

Re: John McCain's real base is the Press


BBB,
Its hard to take you serious when you post stuff like this.
I only read the part I quoted and couldnt go any further.

You are supposedly quoting an article that hasnt been published yet.
Today is June 20, and the article you quoted wont be available till July 7.
Thats 18 days from now.

The Nation does not release its edition that long in advance.

Re: John McCain's real base is the Press


One should always take a rabid dog seriously, not matter how crazed they might be.

Sorry for the length of this list. I made it as succinct as I could without much verbosity. As we all know, John McCain has an impressive list of experience as a Washington politician. The links are mostly to articles that contain links to specific supporting sources.



* McCain supported the drilling moratorium; http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/16/AR2008061602148.html now he's against it.

* McCain strongly opposes a windfall-tax on oil company profits. Three weeks earlier, he was perfectly comfortable with the idea.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/18/mccains-offshore-drilling_n_107872.html

* McCain thought Bush's warrantless-wiretap program circumvented the law; http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15781.html now he believes the opposite.

* McCain defended privatizing Social Security. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15863.html
Now he says he's against privatization (though he actually still supports it.)

* McCain wanted to change the Republican Party platform to protect abortion rights in cases of rape and incest.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/10/mccain-flips-on-abortion_n_101115.html Now he doesn't.

* McCain thought the estate was perfectly tax fair. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15825.html Now he believes the opposite.

* He opposed indefinite detention of suspect terrorists.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15864.html
When the Supreme Court reached the same conclusion, he called it "one of the worst decisions in the history of this country."

* McCain said he would "not impose a litmus test on any nominee."
http://www.americablog.com/2008/06/now-mccain-is-flip-flopping-on-judges.html He used to promise the opposite.

* McCain believes the telecoms should be forced to explain their role in the administration's warrantless surveillance program as a condition for retroactive immunity. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/28/AR2008052802967.html He used to believe the opposite.

* McCain supported storing spent nuclear fuel at Yucca Mountain in Nevada. http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2008/may/28/mccains-about-face-yucca/ Now he believes the opposite.

* McCain supported moving "towards normalization of relations with Cuba." http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15617.html
Now he believes the opposite.

* McCain believed the U.S. should engage in diplomacy with Hamas.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15557.html
Now he believes the opposite.

* McCain believed the U.S. should engage in diplomacy with Syria.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15564.html Now he believes the opposite.

* He argued the NRA should not have a role in the Republican Party's policy making. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15573.html Now he believes the opposite.

* McCain supported his own lobbying-reform legislation from 1997.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/20/mccains-97-lobbyist-bill_n_102662.html Now he doesn't.

* He wanted political support from radical televangelists like John Hagee and Rod Parsley. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15633.html Now he doesn't.

* McCain supported the Lieberman/Warner legislation to combat global warming. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15699.html
Now he doesn't.

* McCain pledged in February 2008 that he would not, under any circumstances, raise taxes. Specifically, McCain was asked if he is a "'read my lips' candidate, no new taxes, no matter what?" referring to George H.W. Bush's 1988 pledge. "No new taxes," McCain responded. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/14761.html, "Two weeks later, McCain said I'm not making a 'read my lips' statement, in that I will not raise taxes."

* McCain is both for and against a "rogue state rollback as a focus of his foreign policy vision." http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/04/mccain-rewrites.html

* McCain says he considered and did not consider joining John Kerry's Democratic ticket in 2004. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/14818.html

* In 1998, he championed raising cigarette taxes to fund programs to cut under age smoking, insisting that it would prevent illnesses and provide resources for public health programs. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15033.html Now, McCain opposes a $0.61-per-pack tax increase, won't commit to supporting a regulation bill he's co-sponsoring, and has hired Philip Morris' former lobbyist as his senior campaign adviser.

* McCain has changed his economic worldview on multiple occasions.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15337.html

* McCain has changed his mind about a long-term U.S. military presence in Iraq on multiple occasions.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15370.html.

* McCain is both for and against attacking Barack Obama over his former pastor at his former church. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15358.html

* McCain believes Americans are both better and worse off than they were before Bush took office.
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/04/19/mccain-economy-bloomberg/

* McCain is both for and against earmarks for Arizona.
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/01/06/mccain-earmark/

* McCain believes his endorsement from radical televangelist John Hagee was both a good and bad idea.
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/04/21/hagee-flip-flop/

* McCain's first mortgage plan was premised on the notion that homeowners facing foreclosure shouldn't be "rewarded" for acting "irresponsibly." His second mortgage plan took largely the opposite position.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/15176.html.

* McCain vowed, if elected, to balance the federal budget by the end of his first term. Soon after, he decided he would no longer even try to reach that goal.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/16/us/politics/16mccain.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin

* In February 2008, McCain reversed course on prohibiting waterboarding.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/10/emtimeem-has-mccain-flip_n_96179.html

* McCain used to champion the Law of the Sea convention; even volunteering to testify on the treaty's behalf before a Senate committee. http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071031/NATION/110310071/1001
Now he opposes it.

* McCain was a co-sponsor of the DREAM Act which would grant legal status to illegal immigrants' kids who graduate from high school.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071031/NATION/110310071/1001 Now he's against it.

* On immigration policy in general, McCain announced in February 2008 that he would vote against his own legislation.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/14447.html

* In 2006, McCain sponsored legislation to require grassroots lobbying coalitions to reveal their financial donors. In 2007, after receiving "feedback" on the proposal, McCain told far-right activist groups that he opposes his own measure.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9658.html

* McCain said before the war in Iraq, "We will win this conflict. We will win it easily." Four years later, McCain said he knew all along that the war in Iraq war was "probably going to be long and hard and tough."
http://electioncentral.tpmcafe.com/blog/electioncentral/2007/jan/05/olbermann_crowns_mccain_worst_persons_for_flip_flopping

* McCain said he was the "greatest critic" of Rumsfeld's failed Iraq policy. In December 2003, McCain praised the same strategy as "a mission accomplished." In March 2004, he said, "I'm confident we're on the right course ." http://thinkprogress.org/2007/08/18/mccain-greatest-critic/
In December 2005, he said, "Overall, I think a year from now, we will have made a fair amount of progress if we stay the course."

* McCain went from saying he would not support repeal of Roe v. Wade http://mediamatters.org/items/200610310003 to saying the exact opposite. http://thinkprogress.org/2006/11/19/mccain-abortion/

* McCain went from saying gay marriage should be allowed http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/8809.html to saying gay marriage shouldn't be allowed. http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2007/02/mccain200702?printable=true&currentPage=all

* McCain criticized TV preacher Jerry Falwell as "an agent of intolerance" in 2002, but then decided to cozy up to the man who said Americans "deserved" the 9/11 attacks.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/6988.html

* McCain used to oppose Bush's tax cuts for the very wealthy, but he reversed course.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/6731.html in February

* On a related note, he said 2005 that he opposed the tax cuts because they were "too tilted to the wealthy.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/03/us/politics/03mccain.html?ref=us
By 2007, he denied ever having said this, and insisted he opposed the cuts because of increased government spending.

* In 2000, McCain accused Texas businessmen Sam and Charles Wyly of being corrupt, spending "dirty money" to help finance Bush's presidential campaign. McCain not only filed a complaint against the Wylys for allegedly violating campaign finance law, he also lashed out at them publicly. In April, McCain reached out to the Wylys for support.
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=1880630&page=1

* McCain supported a major campaign-finance reform measure that bore his name. In June 2007, he abandoned his own legislation.
http://www.nysun.com/article/36949

* McCain opposed a holiday to honor Martin Luther King, Jr., before he supported it.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/usnw/20070115/pl_usnw/dnc__mccain_spends_mlk_holiday_pandering_to_the_far_right

* McCain was against presidential candidates campaigning at Bob Jones University before he was for it.
http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/8313.html

* McCain was anti-ethanol. Now he's pro-ethanol.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15637887/

* McCain was both for and against state promotion of the Confederate flag. http://mediamatters.org/items/200610310003

* McCain decided http://nymag.com/news/people/24750/index5.html in 2000 that he didn't want anything to do with former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger, believing he "would taint the image of the 'Straight Talk Express.'" Kissinger is now the Honorary Co-Chair for his presidential campaign in New York.http://thinkprogress.org/2006/12/19/mccain-kissinger/

Butrflynet
WOW! Butrflynet. You must have stayed awake all night to compile such an extensive list of McCain's pandering flip-flops. No wonder he can't keep track of them all.

Thanks.

Mom BBB

How odd I've seen this same list elsewhere... taking credit for others work? Tsk, tsk...

http://forums.myspace.com/p/4025775/44994798.aspx?fuseaction=forums.viewpost

http://news.aol.com/political-machine/2008/06/20/hot-seat-how-honest-is-obama/?icid=100214839x1204319720x1200184533

http://republitarian.com/?p=1187

http://www.democrats.org/page/community/post/UnitedWeStandTogether/CN4x

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6395247

yeah, thanks for the list.

I didn't take credit for it. I did, however, shorten it by quite a bit by removing some of the inane silly stuff some people were adding on to the many versions of the list. Also did some editing of the URLs to cleanup what some early generation of it had screwed up. Also verified each link to ensure it worked and had supporting sources.

That much of it, yes, I'll take credit for it. Thanks.

Also, thanks for the links to other places versions of it have been posted. I hadn't looked for it elsewhere. You saved me some time.

But no comment on the McCain flipflops?

The depths of ignorance displayed by some posters here are so abysmal that the name of John Maynard Keynes will probably be unknown. Still, here's what Keynes said to someone who accused him of flip-flopping:



http://www.economist.com/research/Economics/alphabetic.cfm?letter=K

Have the facts on torture, or taxation, or anything else changed all that much, that McCain gets a pass on flip-flopping on issues for political expediency?

Nope.

Cycloptichorn

Article in "U.S. News & World Report" of May 14, 1973 >

"How the POW's Fought Back" by John S. McCain III, Lieut. Commander, U.S. Navy

> will, to anyone with sufficient intelligence to read and understand simple English, demonstrate that the so-called "flipflops" of McCain are exactly comparable to those of Keynes - see above - and that the core of his convictions has remained unchanged to this day.

I think his time as a pow has little to nothing to do with his flipping for political expediency some 30 years later, and it's frankly an attempt at distraction for you to even bring it up. It has nothing to do with current political events whatsoever.

Where were his convictions when he was decrying Bush's tax plan a few years back? When he was speaking against lobbyists and torture? Nowhere to be found.

Cycloptichorn

Alternatively one could argue that your experience of life is far insufficient for you to really understand a searing experience such as the one of McCain's to which you refer, or the enduring qualities which coping with it indicates (not everyone did). In this and other posts you have amply demonstrated (to me at least) a lack of understanding of the real subjective impact of the issues involved. No fault implied here - you just haven't experienced anything at all like it, and don't know.


You don't know that. With respect to the tax plan, economic conditions today(compared to several years ago) are more than sufficiently different to change anyones opinion about tax policy. Indeed there is a serious economic argument to be made for the proposition that Obama's proposed increases in the capital gains & dividend, income and payroll tax schedules will have truly disastrous effects on the economy under the present conditions. With respect to your allegations about torture, you are simply distorting the facts of the matter.

Your first response is immaterial, as McCain's time as a POW had nothing to do with his flip-flops politically later on in life; or, if it did, then he is not mentally fit to hold office. You can't have it both ways, George.

I hate your insinuations. You know very little about my life, yet seem to feel free to say that I do not even possess the judgment to tell whether or not McCain should get a pass due to his torture, where others would not.

You are merely trying to excuse that which has no real excuse: the shallow and craven nature of McCain's practice of putting political expediency above all other concerns. I would like to see an in-depth and specific discussion by you as to why McCain should not be held responsible for things that other politicians would, due to his time as a POW. As it is, I simply think your position is full of ****. What happened to him was a tragedy and the fact that he stood up to his captors was noble. A true hero. Since that time he has degraded and been corrupted significantly. Keating alone proves this to be true, not even discussing his horrendous lack of standards in his personal life. I believe his actions in the 30 years since his captivity are perfectly able to be discussed without constantly and continually falling back on the weak and pathetic crutch of 'but, he was tortured, you can't treat him like a normal adult, mwahh!' Yet you and other defenders of his seem perfectly unable to do so. Weak.

As for your second paragraph, I have two questions:

What is so different between now and 2003, that McCain could completely flip his position on tax cuts, and you give him a pass about it? Specifically.

Second, I wonder if you can explain how McCain quite voiceferously spoke out against the Administrations' bill, which he said would not do enough to ban torture- and then sign on to and support a corrected bill which allowed far more abuses then the original?

I'm starting to believe that you are not really capable of rationally judging the problems with McCain, in the same way that you and others accused Obama supporters of being unable to judge problems.

Cycloptichorn

Ah; I should add, that I think taking economic advice from the same group who got us into our current mess is the height of idiocy. You seem to ignore that our current financial situation in this country was caused in large part by your party, the Republican party, and their beliefs as to the way things should be done. To say that "Indeed there is a serious economic argument to be made for the proposition that Obama's proposed increases in the capital gains & dividend, income and payroll tax schedules will have truly disastrous effects on the economy under the present conditions," without acknowledging that those who are making this argument have shown that they do not possess the qualities necessary to properly steward our economy, is rather laughable

To put it simply, the Conservative position on taxation and economics has no credibility left, sir. Your elected leaders have made a dog's dinner of things, and there isn't much question as to who is to blame: those who continually and constantly decry regulation whilst attempting to pass yet further tax cuts for the rich. The public seems to agree, and that is why Obama is leading on the issues of Energy and Taxation.

Cycloptichorn

"The public seems to agree, and that is why Obama is leading on the issues of Energy and Taxation. "

Really? I suspect you really mean YOU believe Obama leads in these areas.

Raising taxes is not the end all , cure all, that Obama would have you believe.

McCain injured in flip-flop accident
McCain injured in flip-flop accident

http://www.gocomics.com/badreporter/?ref=ql_cmcs