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THE GENERAL ELECTION 2008

 
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Wed 2 Jul, 2008 08:48 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Being a Community Organizer most certainly does prepare one for the presidency, more then being shot down and held in a prison camp. It teaches one the realities of organizational skills and hard work in the real world and gives a good perspective as to the actual problems people face

Cycloptichorn


According to your theory, working the cash register at the corner gas station prepares one for the presidency.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 2 Jul, 2008 09:28 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Being a Community Organizer most certainly does prepare one for the presidency, more then being shot down and held in a prison camp. It teaches one the realities of organizational skills and hard work in the real world and gives a good perspective as to the actual problems people face

Cycloptichorn


Even if that community organizer experience was with ACORN?
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 2 Jul, 2008 09:53 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Being a Community Organizer most certainly does prepare one for the presidency, more then being shot down and held in a prison camp. It teaches one the realities of organizational skills and hard work in the real world and gives a good perspective as to the actual problems people face

Cycloptichorn


According to your theory, working the cash register at the corner gas station prepares one for the presidency.


Not really. But I can see how you conservatives would mistake the two.

Wait, no, I can't.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Jul, 2008 08:31 am
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Being a Community Organizer most certainly does prepare one for the presidency, more then being shot down and held in a prison camp. It teaches one the realities of organizational skills and hard work in the real world and gives a good perspective as to the actual problems people face

Cycloptichorn


According to your theory, working the cash register at the corner gas station prepares one for the presidency.


Not really. But I can see how you conservatives would mistake the two.

Wait, no, I can't.

Cycloptichorn


Are you suggesting a cashier doesn't learn the realities of organizational skills and hard work in the real world, or receive a good perspective as to the actual problems people face?
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Jul, 2008 08:47 am
Ticomaya wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Being a Community Organizer most certainly does prepare one for the presidency, more then being shot down and held in a prison camp. It teaches one the realities of organizational skills and hard work in the real world and gives a good perspective as to the actual problems people face

Cycloptichorn


According to your theory, working the cash register at the corner gas station prepares one for the presidency.


Not really. But I can see how you conservatives would mistake the two.

Wait, no, I can't.

Cycloptichorn


Are you suggesting a cashier doesn't learn the realities of organizational skills and hard work in the real world, or receive a good perspective as to the actual problems people face?


Also we know what skills a cashier needs to do his/her job and what that job entails. But nobody is bothering to define what skills a 'community organizer' needs or even what a community organizer does.

It seems that Obama's 'community organizer' experience could be seen as being of the kind that prepare him to do manipulative politics.

Quote:
What if Barack Obama's most important radical connection has been hiding in plain sight all along? Obama has had an intimate and long-term association with the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (Acorn), the largest radical group in America. If I told you Obama had close ties with MoveOn.org or Code Pink, you'd know what I was talking about. Acorn is at least as radical as these better-known groups, arguably more so. Yet because Acorn works locally, in carefully selected urban areas, its national profile is lower. Acorn likes it that way. And so, I'd wager, does Barack Obama.

MORE HERE

Why low profile? Of course it is because of ACORN's more radical side coupled with some politically unattractive activities. ACORN did get some national publicity in a recent election when it was found that they had organized and conducted an aggressive voter registration project but conveniently lost or misplaced all or most of the Republican registrations they collected.

And while Obama very well may not have participated in the more radical or politically unattractive side of ACORN, there are some questions of the ethics of Obama sitting on some foundation boards while he was in a position to direct large amounts of cash to those foundations, especially through his involvement with ACORN.

This could all be a tempest in a teapot and amount to nothing at all. But I always get curious when something so prevalent in Obama's resume and now being used as evidence of an important qualification to be President is receiving so little scrutiny by the drive by media. If my curiosity catches on, it could get interesting.
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Jul, 2008 07:49 am
bm
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Jul, 2008 09:23 am
On the Obama thread, it was suggested that Obama's promise to unite red and blue states could not be accomplished from Center Field. This would certainly account for his obvous shift to the center during the general election. My question is will he vacate center field entirely once he is elected. I think his track record to date suggests that as a probability.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Jul, 2008 09:33 am
The other thing that may be working against Obama is his the growing number of stumbles that I think is beginning to erode confidence in his readiness and/or being up to the job of POTUS. The latest was yesterday when he 'wanted all American school children to speak Spanish'. With illegal immigration still a sore spot out there, this did not resonate well across the country.

THE VIDEO CLIP

And Rasmussen's poll posted yesterday:

Voters Reject Obama's call for Bilingualism
Wednesday, July 09, 2008

Barack Obama said yesterday that ""instead of worrying about whether immigrants can learn English, " Americans "need to make sure your child can speak Spanish " A national telephone survey conducted last month by Rasmussen Reports found that U.S. voters overwhelmingly disagree with the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee. (see video)

Eighty-three percent (83%) place a higher priority on encouraging immigrants to speak English as their primary language. Just 13% take the opposite view and say it is more important for Americans to learn other languages.

In his comments, Obama emphasized the economic benefits of learning a second language: ""If you have a foreign language, that is a powerful tool to get a job."" Data suggests that most voters see the issue in a broader context.

A separate survey found that one factor fueling the anger over immigration is the belief that most government officials encourage immigrants to retain the culture of their home country. This helps explain why voters who are angry about immigration are primarily angry at the government, not immigrants. Among those angry about immigration, 59% believe most government officials encourage immigrants to retain their home country culture.

Last fall, a Rasmussen Reports survey found that 77% of Americans believed that employers should be allowed to require employees to speak English while on the job. With the Supreme Court recently upholding tougher standards for voter identification at the polls, 65% of voters now believe election ballots should only be printed in English. Thirty-two percent (32%) say they should be printed in both English and Spanish.

The importance of assimilation into the culture is highlighted in another recent survey: 54% of voters say it is more important to encourage all immigrants to embrace American culture than it is to reduce the number of immigrants. Just 36% take the opposite view and say reducing immigration is a higher priority. That survey, as with many others, also found a strong preference for ballots and other government documents to be printed in English only.

Only 26% believe that every American should be able to speak at least two languages. In his recent comments, Obama said parents should be thinking, ""How can your child become bilingual? We should have every child speaking more than one language.""

Broken down along party lines, 79% of Republicans and 59% of Democrats reject the idea that all Americans should know multiple languages. Among unaffiliated voters, 68% say their fellow citizens do not need to know a language other than English.
LINK
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Jul, 2008 11:06 am
http://media.townhall.com/Townhall/Car/b/bg0709cd.jpg
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Jul, 2008 11:09 am
http://media.townhall.com/Townhall/Car/b/holb080703.jpg
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 09:23 am
Obama is being criticized for, what some deem arrogantly, requesting a speech/photo op at the Brandenburg Gate when he makes his gratuitous (my term) trip to Europe this summer. The German government resists that as such a forum is normally a privilege granted to vistiing heads of state, not political candidates. The Mayor, however, caught up in the Obamamania phenomenon really really wants to grant permission.

Meanwhile, as it goes in politics, you see all kinds of innuendo that it is President Bush who is trying to thwart Obama's hopes there and therefore is accused of interfering in a political campaign. So what else is new? While there is always room for criticism, the stuff that President Bush has been blamed for reaches ridiculous proportions including a whole lot of stuff that is manufactured by Obama supporters--previously Gore and Kerry supporters--and I wouldn't be surprised if by the Obama campaign itself. Such as this.

Well at least the Germans have enough class to defend our President on this one. Good for them.

Germany denies Bush thwarted Obama speech
By Erik Kirschbaum
Fri Jul 11, 2008

BERLIN (Reuters) - The German government denied on Friday that Washington had put any pressure on Chancellor Angela Merkel to block a proposed speech by U.S. presidential candidate Barack Obama in Berlin in late July.

Merkel's spokesman Ulrich Wilhelm said the Illinois senator was welcome in Berlin even if details of his visit are still unclear. He said, however, that Merkel had not dropped her objections to Obama speaking at the Brandenburg Gate.

West Berlin was a focal point of Cold War tensions, kept alive during a Soviet blockade six decades ago by a U.S.-led Air Lift. Since then, American presidents from John F. Kennedy to Ronald Reagan have delivered major speeches here.

Leading German newspapers, including Bild and Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, reported that Bush administration officials attending a G8 summit in Japan this week expressed reservations to the German delegation about Obama speaking at the landmark.

"The reports are completely unfounded," Wilhelm said when asked about the reports and a suggestion from Berlin Mayor Klaus Wowereit that the Bush administration had pressured Merkel.

"There were no expectations whatsoever expressed either outright or tacitly in that regard from American President Bush or his staff. It's pure fiction."

Wilhelm's deputy Thomas Steg on Wednesday made clear that Merkel frowned on any speech by the U.S. presidential candidate at the Brandenburg Gate, a symbol of German unity trapped in a no-man's land by the Berlin Wall during the Cold War.

Steg said Merkel was not happy to see the Brandenburg Gate used for "electioneering", calling the idea "odd".

That snub prompted a sharp response from Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier's spokesman, who said Germany would be honored by an Obama visit of any kind.

Merkel and Steinmeier, who are from rival parties forced into a coalition, may face off in a federal election next year.

The two sides tried to paper over the differences at a news conference on Friday after Wednesday's row.

"The chancellor and the foreign minister are looking forward to the possible Obama visit," Wilhelm said.

"It's obviously an administrative matter for the city of Berlin and Senator Obama to decide the whereabouts of a public appearance. It's not a federal decision. We're in direct contact and confident of reaching a suitable solution for everyone." (Editing by Ibon Villelabeitia)
LINK
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Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 09:47 am
Why, that's odd, just today, Der Speigel reported:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,564805,00.html

Quote:
The German government, however, is more concerned with other possible side-effects of the speech. An overly warm welcome for Obama could anger the Republican candidate, John McCain, as it would not exactly be a good starting point should McCain be elected this autumn. Furthermore, any indication that Berlin is over-eager to see the end of the Bush administration is not likely to play well in Washington.

Indeed, Deputy Treasury Secretary Robert Kimmitt told the mass circulation tabloid Bild that "it would be nice if the German government would focus on strengthening its contacts to us rather than already beginning to look for our successors."


In addition,

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0708/Brandenburg_Gate_gate.html

Ben Smith reports that his German-speaking readers have found reports in the German press saying that an American official "berated" a German official about the speech idea.

Hmmm.... my guess is that the Bush administration DID pressure them, that at least one of them went on the record with criticism, and that the German gov't is now trying to hush the whole thing up and spin.

The mayor already has granted permission, and Obama's speech is going to move forward. Bush and the Republicans definitely don't want this to happen, for it will be a major event for Obama and one which is likely to draw several hundred thousand viewers, as he is massively popular in Germany.

You're all wet on this one, Fox... buying into such lame spin, you ought to be ashamed...

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 10:37 am
So apparently the liberal driveby media is manufacturing propaganda again or it is being fed to them by the Obama campaign or others, huh? Or do the Germans themselves denying the story, when they are obviously enamored with Obama, not have any credibility at all?

There are no lengths to which some will not distort or flat out lie for a cause. Nor is there apparently any limit to Obama's propensity for pompous arrogance.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 10:41 am
Is it normal for American presidential candidates to make speeches in other countries? seems odd, but maybe it's the thing?
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 10:47 am
ehBeth wrote:
Is it normal for American presidential candidates to make speeches in other countries? seems odd, but maybe it's the thing?


It is not normal for American candidates to use the Brandenburg gate as a backdrop for a speech. Such privilege has always been reserved for heads of state, and you would think a candidate with class would bow to propriety in such a matter.

Quote:
Published: 9 Jul 08 16:03 CET
Online: http://www.thelocal.de/12975/

German Chancellor Angela Merkel has expressed misgivings about US Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama speaking in front of Berlin's famed Brandenburg Gate.

Merkel doesn't think the US election battle should be played out in front of the gate, and said she viewed the possibility of Obama culminating his July 24 visit to Berlin at the famous landmark with "certain displeasure," government spokesperson Thomas Steg said on Wednesday.

The decision as to whether Obama will be allowed to give a speech before the iconic monument lies with the city senate. In the past, only elected US presidents have been allowed to use the Brandenburg Gate for their addresses.

Foreign Minister Frank Walter Steinmeier, on the other hand, doesn't see a problem with allowing Obama the use of Pariser Platz, his spokesperson Jens Plötner said Wednesday.

But the question of where Obama might give a speech on his campaign stop in Berlin is causing tension between Merkel and Berlin's Mayor Wowereit, who said on Tuesday he would be happy to see Obama speak at the Brandenburg Gate. Some politicians and journalists have accused Wowereit of having selfish reasons for encouraging Berlin senate approval of the speech, though.

"Do you think Wowi [Wowereit's nickname] would let the opportunity to appear with Barack Obama go by?" Green Party deputy floor leader Jürgen Trittin said on German broadcaster N24 recently. "I think he's saying, 'He should go on, I'll be in the photo, and everything will be great'."

Obama has also been accused of wanting to use the Brandenburg Gate to cultivate media hype that he is the next JFK. "With the planned speech in Berlin at the Brandenburg gate, Obama is aiming for the Kennedy effect," German news magazine Der Spiegel's Washington correspondent Marc Pitzke wrote on Tuesday. "He is using this to tie himself to Kennedy's 1963 Berlin visit to The Wall and his 'Ich bin ein Berliner' speech at the Schöneberg city hall."

While the German government waits on the Berlin senate vote, they have offered a potential compromise: Obama will be allowed to walk through the Brandenburg Gate.

"Every other important American guest has gone through the Brandenburg Gate," Karsten Voigt, government coordinator for German-American relations told Der Spiegel on Tuesday. "There were always journalists present, and the guest was always able to say something too."

The Berlin visit will be part of a European tour that is set to include stops in Germany, France and the UK.
http://www.thelocal.de/12975/20080709/
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 10:52 am
Yeah, that privilege sure is restricted. I mean, what an important site!

Last week, a topless parade was held there, and two weeks ago, it was the site of a massive, drunken Football-watching party.

A holy site, how can we possibly let Obama give a speech in such a place!

What a bunch of f*cking whiny babies the right wing has become.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 11:00 am
I think the German chancellor would not appreciate being called a 'f*cking whiny baby' or 'right wing'. Speaking of propriety.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 11:02 am
Foxfyre wrote:
I think the German chancellor would not appreciate being called a 'f*cking whiny baby' or 'right wing'. Speaking of propriety.


If the shoe fits.

It's more the right-wing in America I'm referring to. The Chancellor is responding to pressure from Bush's people on this one; she didn't invent the pressure herself.

Obama is going to give the speech there, and you bunch can moan and whine about it being inappropriate all you like, and we'll just keep right on trucking. Won't that be nice?

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 11:05 am
I think the German Chancellor would also not appreciate being called a liar. She says there has been no pressure--zero, nada, zilch--from the Bush administration or any other Republicans.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Jul, 2008 11:09 am
Foxfyre wrote:
I think the German Chancellor would also not appreciate being called a liar. She says there has been no pressure--zero, nada, zilch--from the Bush administration or any other Republicans.


Bull, for a few reasons:

First, she didn't state anything like that. A spokesman for the gov't said that, and we all know that doesn't translate to the top, unless you are looking to hold Bush responsible for things Perino and McClellan had to say.

Second, from your article above:

Quote:


"The reports are completely unfounded," Wilhelm said when asked about the reports and a suggestion from Berlin Mayor Klaus Wowereit that the Bush administration had pressured Merkel.

"There were no expectations whatsoever expressed either outright or tacitly in that regard from American President Bush or his staff. It's pure fiction."


This is directly contradicted, not only by reports in the German press which don't name someone specifically, but also by: Deputy Treasury Secretary Robert Kimmitt, who went on the record criticizing the move.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
 

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