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AMERICAN CONSERVATISM IN 2008 AND BEYOND

 
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 04:02 pm
@mysteryman,
Quote:

I believe Evan Bayh truly has the countries best interests at heart, unlike most politicians today.


As much as I agree with your sentiment, I believe that Bayh has zero care for the country's interests whatsoever. And his actions have reflected this.

Cycloptichorn
JamesMorrison
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 04:05 pm
Welcome to all the Motorola Droid Forum members! Please put on your kevlar lined chain mail reinforced asbestos underwear and join us on Foxfyre's beast of a thread: AMERICAN CONSERVATISIM IN 2008 AND BEYOND.

By the way where in the world is Foxie? I wish her the best and hope that she "lives long and prospers" [by her own designs, I might add] Seriously, I hope she and her other are where they want to be.

JM
okie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 05:33 pm
@parados,
You are amazing, Parados, I wonder if you would defend an axe murderer if he or she had your idealogy. Free markets are not crooked, but insider trading is.
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 05:36 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
We are just gonna have to agree to disagree.
I have met the man twice, and he impressed me as a politician that actually cares about the country, instead of lining his own pocket.
okie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 06:33 pm
@JamesMorrison,
JamesMorrison wrote:
By the way where in the world is Foxie? I wish her the best and hope that she "lives long and prospers" [by her own designs, I might add] Seriously, I hope she and her other are where they want to be.

JM

I think she migrated to another debate forum, where people are more reasonable and civil. She got tired of the outlandish personal attacks and bizarre and unfounded arguments by liberals here. I have not heard from her now for a few weeks, but I believe that was her communication at that time. I am not quoting her exactly, so my apologies to her if I misrepresent her sentiments, but I think my explanation is close to correct.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 06:42 pm
@okie,
Insider trading is illegal. Can you tell us when McCauliff was charged with it?


You love to make stuff up and then if we don't believe you, you accuse us of defending axe murderers.

In the words of one of your idols. "Go **** yourself".

0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 06:47 pm
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:
I have met the man twice, and he impressed me as a politician that actually cares about the country, instead of lining his own pocket.

I think alot of liberals care about the country, mm, but their solutions are the wrong solutions to fix the problems we have.

Rush talks alot about liberals govern by emotion and good intentions. For example, many people believe Obama has good intentions with his outlandish spending, but I think most conservatives agree that it is exactly the wrong solution to the problem. There are many other examples that could be cited, another one being poverty. Fixing poverty is not to give a man a fish, but to teach a man how to fish. Giving somebody a fish when he is hungry, yes, that is good intentioned, but does it accomplish anything? No, it only perpetuates the existing problem. There are countless examples of how politicians can either govern with their head or with their emotions.

The road to ruin is often paved by good intentions. I am sure you know this already. I realize we often vote based upon personality. Even right now, Palin is supporting McCain, out of loyalty rather than actual policy. I can understand that, but in that case, at least McCain is a Republican and somewhat conservative on many issues, while liberal leaning on others, but in the case of Bayh, mysteryman, I think it is totally illogical to vote for the guy based upon personality. Now if he was your uncle, it might be different, but in your case where you admit you agree with him on almost nothing, I think it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Fri 19 Feb, 2010 03:34 pm
Quote:
Mickey says: Ronald Reagan would not have been welcome at today's CPAC or a tea party rally, but he would not have wanted to be there, either. Neither do I.


Ronald Reagan would have been there with bells on. He would have been the guest speaker, focusing on "The joys and personal satisfaction to be found in the rape, torture and murder of countless innocents souls and the duping of 300 million vassals into not believing it ever happened".

AMERICAN CONSERVATISM IN 2008 AND BEYOND, read all about it.

Quote:


Feb 18 2010, 2:49PM
Why I'm Not at CPAC

Mickey Edwards

I was asked yesterday whether I would be going to CPAC, the annual Conservative Political Action Conference, which is currently being held a half-hour's walk from my office in D.C. It was a logical question, not only since the meetings are so close at hand but also because for five years I chaired CPAC.

CPAC brings together conservative activists from every corner of America. As national chairman of the American Conservative Union, a founding trustee of the Heritage Foundation, and director of the policy task forces for Ronald Reagan's 1980 presidential campaign, speaking at CPAC and shaping the program were high priorities on my personal agenda every year, even while serving in Congress.

But the answer to yesterday's question was "no." No, I'm not going to CPAC. And, truth be told, most of the folks there wouldn't want me there. They wouldn't think I'm a conservative; many wouldn't think Barry Goldwater was a conservative; many, had this been three decades ago, might have been seeking a "true" conservative to run against Ronald Reagan. I don't begrudge these activists their views and they are entitled to use the term "conservative" to describe themselves if they so choose. But the views many of them profess have little in common with the distinctly American kind of conservatism that gave birth to CPAC and the modern American conservative movement. Instead, what many of today's self-proclaimed "conservatives" proclaim is an ideology borrowed from what Donald Rumsfeld famously dismissed as "old Europe." Winston Churchill, one of Europe's better-known conservatives, was half-American and his incredible strength of character helped Great Britain survive World War II, but when asked to define conservatism, Churchill responded that conservatism was about reverence for king and church. But America has no king and has no national church. That distinction is crucial and one in which today's so-called conservatives have switched sides; crossed the ocean, if you will.

What distinguished modern American conservatism was that it had its roots not in the British kings, but in John Locke and Adam Smith and other champions of individual liberties and individual empowerment. European conservatism--the kind that has now become the rage for the American Right--was top-down and centered on state power. The rise of modern American conservatism, on the other hand, had a distinctly Madisonian flair, embracing the fundamentals of American constitutional limits on central authority. European conservatism found its voice in magisterial decree, religious edict, and acts of parliaments in which members may or may not have ever visited the communities they were presumed to "represent." American conservatism found its voice in a Constitution that placed every major power in the hands of the people, through their representatives, and ensured that those representatives would actually be residents of the communities that elected them. American conservatism embraced a Constitution that separated and constrained powers, that specified --highlighted--a few of the protected liberties of the people coupled with clear assertions that all undelegated powers--all other unsurrendered liberties--remained with the people rather than the government. A Constitution that placed unambiguous limitations, including direct prohibitions, on the attempted exercise of governmental authority.

Today there are few things that set a "conservatives'" teeth on edge more than a defense of "civil liberties;" yet that is what American conservatism was all about--protecting the liberties of the people. It was a system designed to protect the people from an over-reaching government, not to protect the government from the people. American constitutionalism was a historical high-point in recognizing individual worth. Stop at CPAC today and you will find rooms full of ardent, zealous, fervent young men and women who believe the government should be allowed to torture (we condemned people at Nuremberg for doing that), who believe the government should be able to lock people up without charges and hold them indefinitely (something Henry VIII agreed was a proper exercise of government authority). Who believe the government should be able to read a citizen's mail and listen in on a citizen's phone calls, all without a warrant (the Constitution of course prohibits searches without a warrant, but nobody cares less about the Constitution than some of today's ersatz conservatives).

I'm not at CPAC because I believe in America. I believe in liberty. I believe that governments should be held in check. I believe people matter. I believe in the flag not because of its shape or color but because of the principles it stands for--the principles in the Constitution, the principles repeated and underlined and highlighted and boldfaced and italicized in the Bill of Rights. The George W. whose presidency and precedents I admire was the first president, not the 43d. It is James Madison I admire, not John Yoo. Thomas Paine, not Glenn Beck. Jefferson, not Limbaugh.

Ronald Reagan would not have been welcome at today's CPAC or a tea party rally, but he would not have wanted to be there, either. Neither do I.


http://correspondents.theatlantic.com/mickey_edwards/2010/02/why_im_not_at_cpac.php/?pid=ynews
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Feb, 2010 04:21 pm
Quote:
The Mount Vernon Statement

Constitutional Conservatism: A Statement for the 21st Century

We recommit ourselves to the ideas of the American Founding. Through the Constitution, the Founders created an enduring framework of limited government based on the rule of law. They sought to secure national independence, provide for economic opportunity, establish true religious liberty and maintain a flourishing society of republican self-government.

These principles define us as a country and inspire us as a people. They are responsible for a prosperous, just nation unlike any other in the world. They are our highest achievements, serving not only as powerful beacons to all who strive for freedom and seek self-government, but as warnings to tyrants and despots everywhere.

Each one of these founding ideas is presently under sustained attack. In recent decades, America’s principles have been undermined and redefined in our culture, our universities and our politics. The selfevident truths of 1776 have been supplanted by the notion that no such truths exist. The federal government today ignores the limits of the Constitution, which is increasingly dismissed as obsolete and irrelevant.

Some insist that America must change, cast off the old and put on the new. But where would this lead " forward or backward, up or down? Isn’t this idea of change an empty promise or even a dangerous deception?

The change we urgently need, a change consistent with the American ideal, is not movement away from but toward our founding principles. At this important time, we need a restatement of Constitutional conservatism grounded in the priceless principle of ordered liberty articulated in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution.

The conservatism of the Declaration asserts self-evident truths based on the laws of nature and nature’s God. It defends life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. It traces authority to the consent of the governed. It recognizes man’s self-interest but also his capacity for virtue.

The conservatism of the Constitution limits government’s powers but ensures that government performs its proper job effectively. It refines popular will through the filter of representation. It provides checks and balances through the several branches of government and a federal republic.

A Constitutional conservatism unites all conservatives through the natural fusion provided by American principles. It reminds economic conservatives that morality is essential to limited government, social conservatives that unlimited government is a threat to moral self-government, and national security conservatives that energetic but responsible government is the key to America’s safety and leadership role in the world.

A Constitutional conservatism based on first principles provides the framework for a consistent and meaningful policy agenda.
• It applies the principle of limited government based on the
rule of law to every proposal.
• It honors the central place of individual liberty in American
politics and life.
• It encourages free enterprise, the individual entrepreneur, and
economic reforms grounded in market solutions.
• It supports America’s national interest in advancing freedom
and opposing tyranny in the world and prudently considers what we can and should do to that
end.
• It informs conservatism’s firm defense of family, neighborhood,
community, and faith.

If we are to succeed in the critical political and policy battles ahead, we must be certain of our purpose.

We must begin by retaking and resolutely defending the high ground of America’s founding principles.

February 17, 2010 = SIGNERS =
Edwin Meese, former U.S. Attorney General under President Reagan
Wendy Wright, president of Concerned Women for America
Edwin Feulner, Jr., president of the Heritage Foundation
Lee Edwards, Distinguished Fellow in Conservative Thought at the Heritage Foundation, was present at the Sharon Statement signing.
Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council
Becky Norton Dunlop, president of the Council for National Policy
Brent Bozell, president of the Media Research Center
Alfred Regnery, publisher of the American Spectator
David Keene, president of the American Conservative Union
David McIntosh, co-founder of the Federalist Society
T. Kenneth Cribb, former domestic policy adviser to President Reagan
Grover Norquist, president of Americans for Tax Reform
William Wilson, President, Americans for Limited Government
Elaine Donnelly, Center for Military Readiness
Richard Viguerie, Chairman, ConservativeHQ.com
Kenneth Blackwell, Coalition for a Conservative Majority
Colin Hanna, President, Let Freedom Ring
Kathryn J. Lopez, National Review
...
GOD BLESS AMERICA
LINDA K DAVIS BERGLUND

PERSONAL LIBERTY,
FREE MARKET,
LESS GOVERNMENT
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Feb, 2010 05:49 pm
OBAMA AND SAUL ALINSKY

Three of Obama's mentors in Chicago were trained by Saul Alinsky. Obama was hired in 1986 by the Alinsky team to organize residents on the South Side. The proposed solution to every problem on the South Side was distribution of government funds.

According to Alinsky, we are not virtuous by not wanting power. We are really cowards for not wanting power, because power is good and powerlessness is evil.

Alinsky's most basic principle for radicals is: lie to opponents and disarm them by pretending to be moderates and liberals.

Alinsky stated, " the issue is never the issue. The issue is always the revolution." The stated cause is never the real cause, but only an occasion to advance the real cause which is accumulation of power to make the revolution.

Alinsky's demagogic standard of the revolution is democracy--a democracy which upends all social hierarchies, including those based on merit. Alinsky built his initial power base among the underclass and the urban poor by calling to make the last ones first and the first ones last until they become equal to the last ones.

Source: BARACK OBAMA'S RULES FOR REVOLUTION, THE ALINSKY MODEL by David Horowitz
wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Sun 21 Feb, 2010 01:03 pm
Quote:
Saturday Night Beck
(Bill Bennett, National Review Online, February 21, 2010)

There’s a lot to say about CPAC. This morning the major papers are highlighting Glenn Beck’s speech. I like Glenn a lot and I think he has something to teach us. But not what he offered last night.

Analogizing his own struggles with alcohol to the problems of our polity and in our politics, he said, “Hello, my name is the Republican party, and I have a problem!” “I’m addicted to spending and big government.” ”It is still morning in America.” ”It just happens to be kind of a head-pounding, hung-over, vomiting-for-four-hours kind of morning in America. And it’s shaping up to be kind of a nasty day. But it is still morning in America.” And, again, “I believe in redemption, but the first step to getting redemption is you’ve got to admit that you’ve got a problem. I have not heard people in the Republican party yet admit that they have a problem.”

Glenn is among the best talkers in the business of broadcast. I am not sure he’s a very good listener.

First, there is a good and strong tradition in alcohol and drug treatment that personal failings should not be extrapolated into the public sphere; that too often when this is done, conclusions are reached based on the wrong motives and, often, the wrong analysis. Glenn has made that mistake here and taken to our politics a cosmologizing of his own deficiencies. This is not a baseless criticism; they are his own deficiencies that he keeps publicly redounding to and analogizing to. It is wrong and he is wrong.

Second, for him to continue to say that he does not hear the Republican party admit its failings or problems is to ignore some of the loudest and brightest lights in the party. From Jim DeMint to Tom Coburn to Mike Pence to Paul Ryan, any number of Republicans have admitted the excesses of the party and done constructive and serious work to correct them and find and promote solutions. Even John McCain has said again and again that “the Republican party lost its way.” These leaders, and many others, have been offering real proposals, not ill-informed muttering diatribes that can’t distinguish between conservative and liberal, free enterprise and controlled markets, or night and day. Does Glenn truly believe there is no difference between a Tom Coburn, for example, and a Harry Reid or a Charles Schumer or a Barbara Boxer? Between a Paul Ryan or Michele Bachmann and a Nancy Pelosi or Barney Frank?

Third, to admit it is still “morning in America” but a “vomiting for four hours” kind of morning is to diminish, discourage, and disparage all the work of the conservative, Republican, and independent resistance of the past year. The Tea Partiers know better than this. I don’t think they would describe their rallies and resistance as a bilious purging but, rather, as a very positive democratic reaction aimed at correcting the wrongs of the current political leadership. The mainstream media may describe their reactions as an unhealthy expurgation. I do not.

A year ago, we were told the Republican party and the conservative movement were moribund. Today they are ascendant, and it is the left and the Democratic party that are on defense " even while they are in control. That’s quite an amazing achievement. But anyone who knows the history of this country and its political movements should not be surprised. America has a long tradition of antibodies that kick in. From Carter we got Reagan. And from Ted Kennedy and Barack Obama we took back a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate, with midterm elections on the horizon that Republicans and conservatives are actually excited about, not afraid of.

To say the GOP and the Democrats are no different, to say the GOP needs to hit a recovery-program-type bottom and hang its head in remorse, is to delay our own country’s recovery from the problems the Democratic left is inflicting. The stakes are too important to go through that kind of exercise, which will ultimately go nowhere anyway " because it’s already happened.

The first task of a serious political analyst is to see things as they are. There is a difference between morning and night. There is a difference between drunk and sober. And there is a difference between the Republican and Democratic parties. To ignore these differences, or propagate the myth that they don’t exist, is not only discouraging, it is dangerous.
okie
 
  1  
Reply Sun 21 Feb, 2010 02:45 pm
@ican711nm,
ican711nm wrote:

OBAMA AND SAUL ALINSKY

They deserve each other.
0 Replies
 
Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Sun 21 Feb, 2010 02:55 pm
@wandeljw,
Thanks for posting that. I think Beck is more right than wrong on this.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  0  
Reply Mon 22 Feb, 2010 03:08 pm
Quote:
From: [email protected]
Subject: American Citizens "Be Damned"

EXECUTIVE ORDERS AND "RECONCILIATION" bypass Congressional checks and balances! Can we wait for 2010 elections?

The president's proposal, which is still being written, will be posted on the Internet by Monday morning, senior administration officials and Congressional aides told the New York Times.

By piggybacking the legislation onto a budget bill, Democrats would be able to advance their HealthCare Bill with a simple majority of just 51 votes, averting a Republican filibuster in the Senate!

The White House signaled Thursday that "an aggressive, all-Democrat strategy for overhauling the nation's health system remains a serious option," even as Obama invites Republicans to next week's televised summit to seek possible compromises.

"It will be a reconciliation bill," the Times quoted a Democrat aide as saying. "If Republicans don't come with any substantial offers, this is what we would do."

The administration's stance could set the stage for a political showdown, with Democrats struggling to enact the president's top domestic priority and Republicans trying to block what many conservatives see as government overreach.

Obama's plan, like the House and Senate bills, would expand coverage to some 30 million+, require most Americans to carry insurance or face financial penalties, and block insurers from denying coverage to people with pre-existing medical conditions, the Times reported.
0 Replies
 
JamesMorrison
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 Feb, 2010 09:32 am
Something you probably won't see in the American "domesticated" press: AGW in trouble.

http://blogs.the-american-interest.com/wrm/2010/02/21/left-wing-european-press-attacks-ipcc-un-climate-change-dilettentes/

JM
0 Replies
 
JamesMorrison
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 Feb, 2010 07:45 pm
I previously mentioned that there might be an investigation into U.S. involvment in the promotion of AGW( Anthropogenic Global Warming )theology. Really? Al Gore in the Dock with NASA's Goddard people?
Quote:
"Senator James Inhofe (R-OK) today asked the Obama administration to investigate what he called “the greatest scientific scandal of our generation” " the actions of climate scientists revealed by the Climategate files, and the subsequent admissions by the editors of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) Fourth Assessment Report (AR4).

Senator Inhofe also called for former Vice President Al Gore to be called back to the Senate to testify.

“In [Gore's] science fiction movie, every assertion has been rebutted,” Inhofe said. He believes Vice President Gore should defend himself and his movie before Congress.

http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/climategate-and-the-law-senator-inhofe-to-ask-for-congressional-criminal-investigation-pajamas-mediapjtv-exclusive/
Given the present Adminstration's efforts against (non-government owned) Toyota why not investigate Al Gore's cottage industry of AGW? Oh, that's right...never mind. Be interesting to see how the liberals will handle this. Probably Obama will just ignore him. If Congress flips to conservative control and evidence is deemed sufficient will some of these people be accused of violating the first Amendment (Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion...)? I know, I know...it's just a joke!

Not to worry though, the EPA's boss lady Lisa Jackson assures us that the new revelations questioning GW science has not affected her agency's determination to destroy the American economy by fiat.
Quote:
Jackson also noted:

[The errors Inhofe had presented were] international events. The information on the glaciers and other events doesn’t weaken … the evidence we considered [to make the Endangerment Finding on CO2.]

http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/breaking-senator-barbara-boxer-and-epa-administrator-lisa-jackson-throw-ipcc-under-the-bus/
Leaving aside the implied fact that U.S.'s GW CO2 is somehow separated from that generated from "international events", what evidence did you use, Lisa? Confused

JM
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Feb, 2010 10:47 am
@JamesMorrison,
Quote:
Be interesting to see how the liberals will handle this. Probably Obama will just ignore him.


We'll just laugh at it. It's more idiocy from people who understand less about science then they do politics.

I wonder why you think it's inappropriate for the government to warn people that Toyotas have been accelerating without control and killing people; maybe you think they should just keep their mouths shut about it, so that no right-wingers such as yourself could intimate that there is corruption going on in order to sell Chevys? Rolling Eyes

The EPA isn't doing anything by 'fiat.' The SC - a Conservative-dominated SC - ruled that they are within their rights to regulate our economy based on emissions of CO2. Or perhaps you forgot that ruling?

Cycloptichorn
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Feb, 2010 10:49 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:


We'll just laugh at it. It's more idiocy from people who understand less about science then they do politics.

Cycloptichorn


I think you have just described yourself.
Cycloptichorn
 
  2  
Reply Wed 24 Feb, 2010 10:51 am
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:


We'll just laugh at it. It's more idiocy from people who understand less about science then they do politics.

Cycloptichorn


I think you have just described yourself.


Oh yeah? Well, I'm rubber and you're glue! So there!

Can you please return to the days when you argued on a level higher then a fifth-grader, George?

Cycloptichorn
okie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Feb, 2010 11:02 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Everyone is full of compliments today!
 

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