AMERICAN CONSERVATISM IN 2008 AND BEYOND

Many US doctors will shut down there practice and do something else for a living if ObamaCare becomes a reality.

1 Reply

@H2O MAN,

Good for them! Another use of "fear."

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@cicerone imposter,

PrezBO is the master at using fear to get what he wants...

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@cicerone imposter,

From YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdTtL6rBG24

Are all doctors against the universal health plan?

I don't think so; they want a voice in the plan - from those more intelligent doctors who believe in a universal health plan. All those other "doctors" are not too smart; they just complain and use fear like conservatives without working to provide solutions.

They are the No Doctors.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Are all doctors against the universal health plan?

Who knows what some doctors think about a so-called universal health plan... I do know that many US
doctors will shut down there practice and do something else for a living if ObamaCare becomes a reality.

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

I certainly would not take Think Progress and Daily Kos as reliable authorities on much of anything other than the extreme Left point of view. If Fox was the ONLY media source ALLOWED to do a documentary in the White House, that would be one thing. That was not the case, nor were they aiding and abetting the President in pushing through a controversial program when they did it. Had any other news organizations asked for such access and been denied it, that would be pertinent. That did not happen, however.

ABC will be PROMOTING the President's healthcare initiative and DISALLOWING any opposing point of view and THAT is the problem here. Not whether something is 'unprecedented'. Daily Kos is using its frequent tactic of building a straw man to attack in this case as they can't very well actually discuss whether a supposedly objective media source should be promoting the President's agenda on a controversial issue.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Obama was involved in at least spending half of the TARP money.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Economy/story?id=6626721&page=1

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@H2O MAN,

You are so sure doctors will quit their practice to change careers, what will they do that will meet or match what they're used to making?

Doctors in the US are still the highest average income professionals.

They know how to play into their own fears without having complete information on what the universal health care will even end up looking like.

Ignorance have taken over their brains.

Quote:

Income Offered to Top 20 Recruited Specialties
(Base salary or income guarantee only, does not include production bonus or benefits)
..................Low....... Average..... High
Family Practice
2007/08 $120,000 $172,000 $275,000
2006/07 $120,000 $161,000 $250,000
2005/06 $115,000 $145,000 $220,000
2004/05 $125,000 $150,000 $200,000
Family Practice with Obstetrics
2007/08 $140,000 $184,000 $275,000
2006/07 $145,000 $159,000 $200,000
2005/06 $140,000 $158,000 $180,000
2004/05 N/A N/A N/A
Internal Medicine
2007/08 $125,000 $176,000 $330,000
2006/07 $135,000 $174,000 $275,000
2005/06 $130,000 $162,000 $250,000
2004/05 $130,000 $161,000 $210,000
Hospitalist
2007/08 $150,000 $181,000 $300,000
2006/07 $145,000 $180,000 $250,000
2005/06 $140,000 $175,000 $190,000
2004/05 $150,000 $171,000 $210,000
OB/GYN
2007/08 $160,000 $255,000 $405,000
2006/07 $200,000 $247,000 $345,000
2005/06 $175,000 $234,000 $450,000
2004/05 $200,000 $247,000 $320,000
Orthopedic Surgery
2007/08 $250,000 $439,000 $750,000
2006/07 $250,000 $413,000 $650,000
2005/06 $250,000 $370,000 $515,000
2004/05 $250,000 $361,000 $650,000
Radiology
2007/08 $230,000 $401,000 $750,000
2006/07 $250,000 $380,000 $500,000
2005/06 $240,000 $351,000 $500,000
2004/05 $250,000 $355,000 $500,000

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@cicerone imposter,

Ignorance and the total lack of common sense has taken over the US government and it's trickling down from the top.

1 Reply

@H2O MAN,

waterboy wrote:

Quote:

Ignorance and the total lack of common sense has taken over the US government and it's trickling down from the top.

Please show evidence/proof of your claim?

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

waterboy wrote:
Quote:
Ignorance and the total lack of common sense has taken over the US government and it's trickling down from the top.

Please show evidence/proof of your claim?

I find it very strange that you constantly badger me for evidence/proof, yet
you and your ilk never ask the same from Obama and his ilk... very strange.

Are you liberals afraid of the truth?

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@Foxfyre,

Well Foxfyre. I certainly wouldn't take your word that ABC is the only media allowed to report from the WH under Obama or have exclusive interviews.

Clip of CNBC interview at WH

Quote:

NPR.org, June 1, 2009 · The following is a transcript of an interview of President Obama, conducted at the White House on Monday by NPR hosts Michele Norris and Steve Inskeep.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=104806528

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2009/06/16/transcript-of-obamas-interview-with-the-journal/

Quote:

June 16, 2009 - A transcript of The Journal’s interview with President Obama

Quote:

INTERVIEW OF THE PRESIDENT BY COLUMNISTS

Aboard Air Force One En Route Chicago, Ill.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/postpartisan/2009/02/obama_interview_transcript.html

Quote:

Lionel Barber, Chrystia Freeland and Edward Luce of the Financial Times interviewed President Obama in Washington on March 27 2009. This is the transcript of the interview.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/5ee69cb2-1c8d-11de-977c-00144feabdc0.html

As to your argument about Fox news, it is pretty clear that Fox was promoting Bush's war on terror and not allowing any opposing viewpoints when they did their interview. Fox is clearly caught with their pants down if they want to complain about special treatment. You can find no evidence of any opposing viewpoint to the Bush's war on terror in the Fox interviews at the WH.

The only strawman I see Fox is your argument that ABC is the only media source ALLOWED to do a "documentary" in the White House. ABC is NOT doing a "documentary"

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

You are so sure doctors will quit their practice to change careers, what will they do that will meet or match what they're used to making?

Doctors in the US are still the highest average income professionals.

They know how to play into their own fears without having complete information on what the universal health care will even end up looking like.

Ignorance have taken over their brains.

You are not accurately representing or qualifying the statistics you provide, and you fail to address the alternatives.

In the first place medical doctors only start making salaries in those ranges more than a decade after medical school and the heavy debts that usually result. In the second most lawyers, particularly the tort lawyers who so assiduously support and contribute to the Democrats, make a good deal more.

In nations with single payer systems which, in effect, regulate the incomes of doctors, such as Britain and Canada, the number of people who choose to enter medicine is dropping. Increasingly these countries depend on immigrant doctors, often trained in other countries, to fill their needs for doctors and provide their medical care.

No surprise here. Price controls always lead to reductions in supply, mediocre service, and a lack of investment and innovation.

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@genoves,

genoves wrote:

But, I must comment that, although I too think that Barack Hussein Obama is highly dangerous to the well being of the United States, he will not be impeached.

The reasons are many--some more important than others--One of the most important is his race. I am sure that you are aware that the highest crime one can commit in the USA is not murder or arson or pederasty, it is being a RACIST.

That is why, Ican, in the most recent polls, Obama's support on the deficit, the stimulus package, the health plan and the cap and trade legislation is slowly being pulled away where(most importantly) even the moderate politically undeclared middle is now stating thier opposition to the POLIC IES of Obama. They are not, however, stating their opposition to him as a person. I believe that most of our populace has been brainwashed to such an extent that they will not criticize a black person even though he or she is clearly in error because such criticism might be construed as RACIST.

Some of our children have learned such RELATIVISTIC garbage in some of the most PROGRESSIVE of our schools.

Excellent point, that this may explain the apparent contradictions of polling showing people opposed to Obama's policies, but still judge Obama favorably. This has always been the danger, and many of us pointed this out, this has always been the danger of electing a president based upon race, and celebrating that occasion to an extreme extent. This dynamic that has been injected into the office has now prepared a very volatile situation in the event Obama fails big time, which I think he is. Those that voted for him based upon race cannot oppose him based upon policy, after all they did not vote him in based upon policy, and they will continue to rag on about race and those that oppose him based upon policy, accusing them of racism. Incidentally, the same principle applies to immigration policy. Their racism continues unabated and then more fuel is poured on the fire. For conservatives like myself, we opposed Obama based upon policy, always did, race means little or nothing. We all have different backgrounds and different shades of skin color.

Genoves, I think you have nailed a very pertinent point, a dynamic that may be going on in the polls.

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Parados is correct; the idea that Fox did not promote the Bush Admin's position on almost every issue, with exclusive access to the WH and WH officials, while attacking or not reporting on dissent, is an unbelievable falsehood. I truly wonder how someone could make that claim without knowing deep in their heart that they are peddling lies.

I would also add that those who post links from Fox News, the Washington Times and WorldNutDaily are on pretty thin ice when it comes to criticizing others for posting from partisan websites and sources.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@georgeob1,

georgeob, You use the same jargon of the conservatives that isn't even true; what makes you think it's going to be a single-payer system? From my readings of the plan so far, it will be a combination of private and public systems. Your conclusions about how the US plan will immulate the Canadian and British systems in paying doctors has not been established.

How does one "qualify" the statistics produced by the medical profession? As with most professions, it takes years to achieve the highest levels of income based on merit and skill. There are lawyers who's pay is below any average - as with any profession; no different with doctors.

Finally, your "price controls" is your conservative meme to instill fear and nothing else. The plan is to increase efficiencies into the system that will save the overall cost of health care, and not by "price controls."

Good try, but no cupie doll for you!

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

I would also add that those who post links from Fox News, the Washington Times and WorldNutDaily are on pretty thin ice when it comes to criticizing others for posting from partisan websites and sources.

Cycloptichorn

I believe that the same thing could be truthfully said about those who use NBC, CNBC, CNN or ABC; or the esteemed New York Times for their sources.

The deceitful harrangues of Sean Hannity are different from those of Rachel Madow, Bill Maher, Keith Oberman and others of that ilk, only in style and technique. None of it remotely resembles objective reporting of news or events -- it is all propoganda motivated by fixed points of view and political objectives..

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@georgeob1,

I don't think it matters not which station has the most bias; it depends on what we can be determine to be factual and honest reporting.

We all know they are biased; which station tells more half-truths and biased inference than facts.

That's the bottom line.

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@georgeob1,

georgeob1 wrote:

cicerone imposter wrote:

You are so sure doctors will quit their practice to change careers, what will they do that will meet or match what they're used to making?

Doctors in the US are still the highest average income professionals.

They know how to play into their own fears without having complete information on what the universal health care will even end up looking like.

Ignorance have taken over their brains.

You are not accurately representing or qualifying the statistics you provide, and you fail to address the alternatives.

In the first place medical doctors only start making salaries in those ranges more than a decade after medical school and the heavy debts that usually result. In the second most lawyers, particularly the tort lawyers who so assiduously support and contribute to the Democrats, make a good deal more.

In nations with single payer systems which, in effect, regulate the incomes of doctors, such as Britain and Canada, the number of people who choose to enter medicine is dropping. Increasingly these countries depend on immigrant doctors, often trained in other countries, to fill their needs for doctors and provide their medical care.

No surprise here. Price controls always lead to reductions in supply, mediocre service, and a lack of investment and innovation.

The amount made by lawyers is not material to this discussion, but simply something you threw in, b/c decrying lawyers (and especially tort lawyers) is a fun and familiar thing for Conservatives to do, despite a lack of evidence to back their arguments up.

You do realize that the system being proposed here in the states isn't a single-payer system, and making comparisons to countries which use a single-payer system is not going to provide accurate data for a discussion of the future of healthcare here in America?

Cycloptichorn

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@georgeob1,

At least Hannity admits his bias, which is a correct bias in my opinion. 50 years ago, it would not have been considered much of a bias at all, it was what most Americans thought. Thats how far the country has slid.

2 Replies

AMERICAN CONSERVATISM IN 2008 AND BEYOND

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