Why would anyone vote for McCain?

It doesn't really matter if McCain was tortured or not (except to Foofie, of course), he simply is not capable to be president. Okay, let me rephrase
that as Bush isn't capable either and got into office anyway.

McCain, by his own admittance, does not know the first thing about the economy, he knows very little to none about international leaders (remember him referring to Putin as "President of Germany"). McCain is almost 10 years past the legal retirement age in this country, yet is delusional enough to think that he is qualified to run for the most important position in the US and the world for that matter.

Perhaps he was tortured indeed, and has some residual mental challenges
left.

A Presidential candidate who sings bomb, bomb, bomb Iran in public is a ticking time bomb imo. McCain's temper could be a problem in the campaign and he is easily provoked.

It doesn't really matter if McCain was tortured or not (except to Foofie, of course), he simply is not capable to be president. Okay, let me rephrase
that as Bush isn't capable either and got into office anyway.

McCain, by his own admittance, does not know the first thing about the economy, he knows very little to none about international leaders (remember him referring to Putin as "President of Germany"). McCain is almost 10 years past the legal retirement age in this country, yet is delusional enough to think that he is qualified to run for the most important position in the US and the world for that matter.

Perhaps he was tortured indeed, and has some residual mental challenges
left.

A Presidential candidate who sings bomb, bomb, bomb Iran in public is a ticking time bomb imo. McCain's temper could be a problem in the campaign and he is easily provoked.

This aint a new story and I aint saying I believe it. Simply pointing out that it exists.

Well, to quote Cyclo, you posted it so you must believe it.

McCain has addressed the accusations for years. He could be telling the truth for all I know. "McCain's campaign criticizes group for mailer challenging his POW record in Vietnam"
01.16.08 -- 11:46AMBy Charles Gelman

McCain's campaign criticizes group for mailer challenging his POW record in Vietnam


JEFFREY COLLINS
AP Features

Jan 15, 2008 20:07 EST

Supporters of Republican John McCain on Tuesday assailed a mailer sent to state newspaper editors claiming he sold out fellow POWs to get better treatment while held prisoner in Vietnam.

"Nothing could be further from the truth. I know because I was there," Orson Swindle, a retired Marine lieutenant colonel and former prisoner of war, said in a statement about the mailing from Vietnam Veterans Against John McCain.

The group's organizer, Jerry Kiley, who said he also is a Vietnam veteran, said in a telephone phone interview that he has been trying for years to spread what he said is the truth about McCain's record.

"John McCain has created this myth that he is a hero and he is not," Kiley said from his home in Garnerville, N.Y.

Kiley's group cites as evidence a May 1973 U.S. News & World Report article by McCain in which he said he realized, on his third or fourth day of captivity after his plane was shot down in 1967, that his knee was so swollen the blood might pool in it and kill him. So he offered to give military information to his captors in exchange for medical treatment.

In the article, McCain said he told the story to make the point that the North Vietnamese only gave medical treatment to POWs if they thought they were going to get something in return. He did not say that he went through with his end of the deal.

Kiley claims information McCain gave to the North Vietnamese led to an increase in U.S. planes being shot down.

McCain's spokesman, B.J. Boling, said McCain never passed military information to the North Vietnamese. He said the campaign was publicizing the mailer "to serve as an example of how we can bring these shadowy groups out into the open."

Kiley said his group sent the mailing to 80 newspaper editors. He said he is considering sending the information to editors in states with later primaries. South Carolina's Republican primary is Saturday.

McCain's state supporters have created what they call a "Truth Squad" to counter the kind of negative attacks that derailed his candidacy here in 2000.

Four years ago in the Democratic presidential race, a group calling itself Swift Boat Veterans For Truth ran television ads that challenged Democratic nominee John Kerry's service record in Vietnam.
link

"Demands for military information were accompanied by threats to terminate my medical treatment if I [McCain] did not cooperate. Eventually, I gave them my ship's name and squadron number, and confirmed that my target had been the power plant." Page 193-194, Faith of My Fathers by John McCain.

One report dated read, "To a question of the correspondent, McCain answered: 'My assignment to the Oriskany, I told myself, was due to serious losses in pilots, which were sustained by this aircraft carrier (due to its raids on the North Vietnam territory - VNA) and which necessitated replacements. From 10 to 12 pilots were transferred like me from the Forrestal to the Oriskany. Before I was shot down, we had made several sorties. Altogether, I made about 23 flights over North Vietnam.'"

In that report, McCain was quoted describing the number of aircraft in his flight, information about rescue ships, and the order of which his attack was supposed to take place.

CalamityJane wrote:

It doesn't really matter if McCain was tortured or not (except to Foofie, of course), he simply is not capable to be president. Okay, let me rephrase
that as Bush isn't capable either and got into office anyway.

McCain, by his own admittance, does not know the first thing about the economy, he knows very little to none about international leaders (remember him referring to Putin as "President of Germany"). McCain is almost 10 years past the legal retirement age in this country, yet is delusional enough to think that he is qualified to run for the most important position in the US and the world for that matter.

Perhaps he was tortured indeed, and has some residual mental challenges
left.

Over 20 years in the Senate, working tax bills is ignored from your analysis?

Over 20 years in the Senate working foreign relations is ignored from your analysis?

But the fact he is 70 years old is relavent?

Compare his experience to the carpetbagger from New York. She can not keep track of her billing records and you will trust her with your taxes?

The youngster from Ill has a total of how many years of service in the House and Senate?

Very shallow analysis, yet not unexpected.

woiyo wrote:

CalamityJane wrote:

It doesn't really matter if McCain was tortured or not (except to Foofie, of course), he simply is not capable to be president. Okay, let me rephrase
that as Bush isn't capable either and got into office anyway.

McCain, by his own admittance, does not know the first thing about the economy, he knows very little to none about international leaders (remember him referring to Putin as "President of Germany"). McCain is almost 10 years past the legal retirement age in this country, yet is delusional enough to think that he is qualified to run for the most important position in the US and the world for that matter.

Perhaps he was tortured indeed, and has some residual mental challenges
left.

Over 20 years in the Senate, working tax bills is ignored from your analysis?

Over 20 years in the Senate working foreign relations is ignored from your analysis?

But the fact he is 70 years old is relavent?

Compare his experience to the carpetbagger from New York. She can not keep track of her billing records and you will trust her with your taxes?

The youngster from Ill has a total of how many years of service in the House and Senate?

Very shallow analysis, yet not unexpected.

Then it is even more embarrassing that after 20 years of being in the
Senate, McCain makes such statements about the economy and international leaders. Was he sleeping for 20 years?

I don't follow your carpetbagger - what's that?

McCain, by his own admittance, does not know the first thing about the economy, ...

... he knows very little to none about international leaders (remember him referring to Putin as "President of Germany").

... McCain is almost 10 years past the legal retirement age in this country, ...

... yet is delusional enough to think that he is qualified to run for the most important position in the US and the world for that matter.

Conservative Sense & Sensibility
The Right's choices right now.

February 7, 2008 6:30 AM

Today, many in the Republican party and the conservative movement are saying some strange things about the prospect of our very likely nominee, Senator John McCain, and his ascent to the GOP nomination. Many think he will destroy the conservative movement if not the Republican party, and many have even said they simply will not vote for him in a general election if he heads the GOP ticket. Moreover, others have even said they would consider voting for Senator Hillary Clinton or that there is simply no difference between Senators Clinton and Barack Obama on the one hand, and Senator John McCain on the other. Some who have said the foregoing are our dear and close friends, allies, and callers.

This sense and sensibility is simply wrong.

We know the conservative indictment against Senator McCain ?- we hear it every day, and even recite some of it ourselves some days. We concede much of it. There is a great deal on which the senator and we do not agree. And yet there is another brief that needs to be submitted in light of some of the latest things we've heard from friends, callers, and others. Namely, that it will not matter to them whether Senators McCain or Clinton or Obama are elected if that is their ultimate choice.

There is a great deal of difference between Senators McCain and Clinton (and Obama), and those records become important as we recognize a few simple facts: We are in an existential war against Islamic terrorists throughout the world. This very week, Senator Clinton was asked what her first act in office would be. She stated that first act would be the beginning of the withdrawal of our troops from Iraq within 60 days. Her first act. That is a surrender to the enemy ?- there is no other way to portray such a withdrawal and there is no other way it will be portrayed by our enemies and other observers around the world.

Some will say, "She can't mean it, she's stronger and more sensible than that." Caution: Recall that Senator Clinton will be our commander-in-chief from a party that also runs the Senate and House ?- and the leadership in the Senate and House, not to mention the most active members in them, want us out of Iraq. Even on her most "sensible" day do we think she can be relieved of that pressure? The Democrats on the Hill have been chomping at the bit to make good on their 2006 promises; will she really turn on them? Can she?

Second, we come to the realization that at least one Supreme Court justice is about to retire, and several others will be over age 70 come January 2009. Do we really think the nominees Senator McCain or Clinton (or Obama ) would appoint will be no different?

Let's go to their records, to the very time-period opponents of Senator McCain cite in their indictment of him.

McCain voted to defund Planned Parenthood last year, Clinton didn't and would likely expand Planned Parenthood's taxpayer funding.

McCain voted to ban partial-birth abortion, Clinton didn't and would likely reverse the partial-birth abortion ban.

McCain voted for Roberts and Alito and made the case for them in the media, Clinton didn't.

McCain has never voted for a tax increase, Clinton will increase taxes.

McCain will continue the Bush tax cuts, Clinton will end them.

McCain will end pork-barrel spending, Clinton supports the endowment of projects like the Woodstock Museum with taxpayer funding.

McCain will not cut and run in Iraq, Clinton will work with Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senator Harry Reid to do just that.

McCain sponsored legislation to keep the Fairness Doctrine from rearing its head again, Clinton has not and has signaled moves to revive it.

McCain supports school choice, Clinton does not.

Clinton will mandate health insurance, McCain will not.

McCain voted to convict Bill Clinton on impeachment, Clinton was a witting accomplice in President Bill Clinton's scandals.

McCain has an ACU (American Conservative Union) rating of 82.3; Clinton has a rating of 9.

McCain has 0-percent rating from NARAL; Clinton has 100 percent.

McCain is endorsed by Tom Coburn, Jack Kemp, Steve Forbes, Rudy Giuliani, Sam Brownback, Tim Pawlenty, Phil Gramm, Jeff Flake, Jon Kyl, and Ted Olson. Hillary's endorsers? Barbra Streisand, Maxine Waters, Gray Davis, Robert Kennedy Jr., Jennifer Granholm, and she will have the endorsements of Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer, and Harry Reid if and when she becomes the Democratic nominee for President.

As for those who have taken to labeling Senator McCain a liberal, we reject that.

A liberal does not have a zero rating from NARAL and a 17-percent voting record with the AFL-CIO (the same rating as Sen. Jim DeMint, by way of comparison).

A liberal does not have this written about him by Sen. Jon Kyl: "On the ever-important issue of life, Senator McCain has a record of voting for pro-life legislation: He has voted for bans on partial birth abortion; he has supported Unborn Victims of Violence Act and parental notification for minors; and he has voted against using federal money to distribute morning-after contraception in schools. He has repeatedly cosponsored the Child Custody Protection Act, which prohibits the transportation of minors across state lines in order to circumvent state laws, requiring instead the involvement of parents in abortion decisions."

A liberal does not vote to defund Planned Parenthood.

A liberal does not go on television and radio to defend Sam Alito and John Roberts.

A liberal does not go on the road to campaign for Social Security retirement accounts.

A liberal does not support the surge or the stay in Iraq.

A liberal does not support extending Bush's tax cuts.

A liberal does not get the endorsements of Tom Coburn, Jack Kemp, Steve Forbes, Rudy Giuliani, Sam Brownback, Tim Pawlenty, Phil Gramm, Jeff Flake, Jon Kyl, and Ted Olson.

Senator McCain may have some liberal positions, but he is not a liberal. He is a conservative with some liberal positions. But on life, taxes, and national defense, his record is, in fact, very strong.

Let us repeat. We know the "yes, but," argument against Senator McCain ?- and agree with some of it. But let us not fool ourselves that there is no difference between Senator McCain and whomever the Democrats nominate. (What we have written above about Senator Clinton holds true of Senator Barack Obama as well).

Over the past two years, the conservative movement has lifted Senator Joe Lieberman onto their shoulders higher and higher (rightly, in our view), and yet many of the same people who have done that have sworn off of Senator McCain. Notwithstanding much of our praise for Senator Lieberman, he is far to the left of Senator McCain ?- with a lifetime ACU rating of 17 percent and an ADA (Americans for Democratic Action, a liberal counter-part to the ACU ratings), in 2006, of 75 percent.

Senator Clinton's respective ratings? Nine percent from the ACU and 95 percent from the ADA.

Senator Obama's respective ratings? Eight percent from the ACU and 95 percent from the ADA.

Senator McCain's respective ratings? 82.3 percent from the ACU and 15 percent from the ADA.

We do not have perfect nominees and never have. As John Hinderaker pointed out recently, since Calvin Coolidge, we haven't even had a pure "conservative ideologue" in our party elected president. And even that one "purist" was not free of blemishes and criticism, much as we rightly venerate him.

Let's admit the concern: Some people predict that a President McCain will open the borders, close Guantanamo, and tie our policies to some false premises related to global warming. We hope he doesn't, but even critics must admit it is just as likely ?- if not more so ?- that his legacy will be the following: He pursued al-Qaeda to the ends of the Earth and vanquished them; he cut deficit spending and vetoed pork-barrel spending over and over again; he appointed four good justices to the Supreme Court; and he reinvigorated a sense of thoughtful patriotism, citizenship, and unselfish devotion to the Republic.

Senator John McCain has a great deal to recommend him. He has a great deal more to offer the country, and it is our sincere hope that, as we move toward the general election, more and more people will see that. In the interim, it is our equal hope that Senator McCain will take the next several months to build his support among conservative doubters within our party. We deserve that, too, so that ?- come September ?- we will all be confident we have nominated the right man.

We have endorsed no candidate in our party as of yet, but we wholeheartedly unendorse any notion that either Senator John McCain or Governor Mitt Romney will ruin the party, the movement, or, for that matter, the election. They are both heads and shoulders above would-be presidents Senator Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama, and once we see the whole record, and these men in the totality of their careers and records, we will, we pray, realize that.

?- William J. Bennett is the Washington fellow of the Claremont Institute and the host of Bill Bennett's Morning in America. Seth Leibsohn is a fellow of the Claremont Institute and the producer of Bill Bennett's Morning in America.

McCain has been -- has so radicalized key conservatives that some have vowed to turn themselves into suicide voters next November by pulling the lever for Hillary Clinton.

Everyone "breaks" under determined torture. The only question is how long a prisoner can holdout, and how little useful information he will divulge.

John McCain was tortured, really tortured by serious men who knew how to inflict pain and suffering, and without the least restraint. He didn't "have" to fly dangerous missions over North Vietnam, but he did it because he regarded those missions as his duty. The Left has criticized Bush for using his connections to avoid going in Harm's Way. Now they would like to make light of McCain's courage and dedication.

He was badly injured leaving his aircraft, and made prisoner immediately on hitting the ground. There he was beaten brutally, bayoneted, and dragged through the streets as a trophy. He was denied medical treatment for his wounds and multiple broken bones for weeks, or months. Once his captors discovered who they had as a hostage, the treatment worsened as they pressured McCain to provided propaganda for them. All they asked in return for a bit of rice and an aspirin was that McCain condemn the United States as an imperialistic outlaw nation out to enslave Vietnam. If you had multiple untreated wounds and broken bones, had been starved and kept in solitary confinement for weeks on end, would you be able to resist? John McCain did.

He could have been repatriated and ended his suffering, gotten proper medical care, but chose to remain as a mistreated POW until every POW who had been in custody longer than he had were released. All he had to do was get on the freedom bird, but he remained loyal to his comrades and the code.

Even today John McCain bears the marks of his courage, gallantry and dedication to upholding the honor of our country. His hair turned white in captivity. His face is misshapen from being bones beaten and crushed by enemy rifle butts. He can no longer lift his arms more than shoulder high because the bones never healed properly. Every day he has to live with some residual pain, yet he has dedicated his civilian life to serving the country. He has been a major player in the Senate involved in domestic and foreign affairs for 20 years. He holds traditional conservative values, but has never been an extremist trying to force reality into theoretical molds. He is strong enough, confident enough in his own beliefs, to stand alone against Party when necessary, and yet knows when conciliation and compromise are necessary.

Who will vote for John McCain? He will get the votes of moderates in both Parties. Older and more mature voters, the largest single reliable block of voters will prefer John McCain to the kid with a lot of charisma, but virtually no experience in life or the brutal practical world of national politics. Those who believe in individual responsibility and want a Federal government that is not all pervasive will prefer John McCain, to a woman betrayed by her husband who would like to insinuate even more Federal government controls into every American's life, and make them pay for it with greater taxes. Those who want to redistribute the wealth, won't vote for McCain, but those who support our military fighting a dedicated enemy will vote for John McCain.

I will vote for John McCain.

Now they would like to make light of McCain's courage and dedication.