On Juanita Broaddrick's accusations of rape by Bill Clinton

We're all getting too cranky about this election. Frankly I think Bill is one of Hillary's best assets. He understands people and voters better than just about anyone alive. He was a much more truly a bipartisan President than Ronald Reagan ever was. There are a lot of Republicans who would cooperate with another Clinton Presidency if Big Dog were associated with it. Not NeoCons or Teapublicans but honest Republicans.

But he does make poor personal decisions regarding sex. Don't a lot of us, though. The difference is we aren't the POTUS.

I think Bill is a pretty bad character all around, and it is not because of the election. When he was first elected, I was more than just enthusiastic. I loved the guy. By the end of his first term I held my nose so I could vote for him again. I was fooled by him at first.

There's a ruthlessness that seems pervasive in all of his (and now her) dealings. Laughs at very serious matters of state, like a child.

Quote Robert Gentel:

I like to use the internet to go to the source. I'm allowed to do that, no? I posted the number of black murders and the years they occurred, and guess what-the correlation between the legalization of abortion and the decline of back murders do NOT match up. Over 10% of the black murders committed are committed by people between 14 and 17, and yet the number of murders does not stop increasing until 19 years after abortion was legalized. That's not a matchup.

Quote Robert Gentel:

Nope, the number of black murders did not start dropping consistently until 1994. Once again, those between ages of 14 through 17 commit over 10% of the murders, therefore the number of black murders must start declining at 1988 at the latest. The decline might take on more intensity as the post-abortion generation hits the 18-24 year old age group, but the decline will begin when the post abortion age group hits 14-IF abortion is the key reason for the decline.

This decline did not happen until the post abortion generation hit 19, indicating that the decline is mostly due to something ELSE which occurred in 1994.

Quote Robert Gentel:

It might have happened to a degree, but the abortion analysis is clearly not a major driver of that drop in black murder rates.

I apologize to those who are offended by someone outside the criminology profession having the effrontery to commit arithmetic upon published official statistics and point out the claimed correlation is not there, but the fact is, the claimed correlation is not there.

Quote Robert Gentel:

First time you mentioned crack. But if crack supposedly masked the effects of abortion on the murder rate, how do we know the effects were there at all?

Take a look at this chart for jobs for blacks age 16-24. This is from the Bureau of Labor Statistics. It is obvious that jobs for young black people started moving sharply up right around 1994. For this, we can thank the Economic Stimulus Package introduced by Bill Clinton in 1993:

Quote Lash:


Quote Lash:


And you'd better get ready to see it a lot more, because when the usual anti-Clinton accusations appear from the usual sources, that stat will make a re-appearance. Often. And by the way, the numbers are not even remotely erroneous, though I don't blame you for being confused when confronted with actual data. Actual data is something you routinely eschew in favor of opinion pieces from blogs, so it's not surprising it's outside the realm of your experience.

The facts are widely known and irrefutable. Stop embarrassing yourself.

http://freakonomics.com/2005/05/15/abortion-and-crime-who-should-you-believe/

Bob, you seem to categorize consensual sex with sexual assault and rape.

Shouldn't we acknowledge they are quite different, and that rape is not a character flaw, but a vicious felony?

I consider you one of the sharpest pencils in this pack but I think you're missing the point regarding the relationship between abortion and crime.

Please look at this link and consider reading this book. If I hadn't already sent it on to someone else - I'd gladly send it along to you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freakonomics

There are several websites, including one by the authors where they defend and explain their conclusion that are well worth the googling.

Its statutory rape if its consensual and the victim is under 16 even if there's no violence. And its also rape if the victim is older than sixteen.

Its rape if the victim has no other choice, if the perpetrator uses any number of coercions that don't necessarily include physical violence.

If I compel or use my position of power to intimidate a younger person into sex, I'd be a rapist even without any element of physical violence implied. Violence isn't the defining component of rape. Its an element that can happen in a rape. If a drunk woman (or man) has sex without violence or explicit consent, hasn't she been raped? What about a woman (or man) who's compelled to have sex to keep a job or a promotion even if the threat was "only" implicit?

I think you define rape too narrowly.

No, we agree about the definition. The reason I mentioned it to you is - I've followed your comments, and you still speak wistfully of another chance to have "The Big Dog" as president.

I was hoping that wasn't an approval for rape, but maybe a misunderstanding of what he did to Broaddrick, Gracern, and in Clinton's own estimation, hundreds more.

The statutory was always consensual to me-if no one was coerced or forced...

No not at all. I recognize how flawed almost of our leaders and the choices for our leaders truly are.

The big dog also did some incredible good, too. He erased the deficit and produced a surplus that W squandered, the economy was good for everybody, there was a large growth in the up to then very small black middle-class that had a lot more to do with the falling numbers on the welfare rolls than "cleaning out" the undeserving welfare "cheats". A growth W stole.

He also did some damaging things - promulgating the image of "super-predators" to bring about a spate of prison construction, three strike laws, mandatory minimum sentences in face of already declining crime statistics. The creation of prison industries that mimic a plantation system as well as creating private correction corporations as a false solution to the costs created by ramping up the number of prisoners during a period of falling crime, when his economic policies and the availability of abortion had everything to do about it.

He also deregulated the banks which lead us to the credit default fiasco that came home to roost during W's turn and his even more disastrous inability to recognize the problem let alone ameliorate it.

And he started the NSA slide into intruding into everyone's life when he mimicked his pal, PM Tony Blair's "Raptor" program to suck up everybody's e-mail.

Yes. I do miss the Bill Clinton economy. No, I do not miss Bill Clinton the sexual harasser or Bill Clinton the perjurer or Bill Clinton the impeached.

Bill Clinton is a complex person, he's not all bad or all good.

My opinion is that nothing ameliorates rape.

My opinion, also. If you think that was my intent: you read it wrong or I write more poorly than I've suspected.

How do you choose between lesser of two evils?

I think rapists should be barred from the presidency.

I think he raped more than a few women, though one should be enough.

I surmise from your comments that you don't think he raped the women who claim he did.

Quote Lash:

The facts are irrefutable. When Bill Clinton first took office, black people were getting murdered at an increasing rate. Under Clinton's two terms, this rising tide of black homicides not only levelled off, but declined 37%.
Black Homicide Victims
Under Bush I
1987......8,998
1988......9,956
1989.....10,566
1990.....11,487
1991.....12,227
1992.....11,777

Bill Clinton Takes Office
1993.....12,433
1994.....11,854
1995.....10,442
1996.......9,473
1997.......8,841
1998.......7,933
1999.......7,139
2000.......7,425

Under Bush I's last year murder rate of black victims, there would be 94,216 black people murdered in the years 1993 through 2000. Instead, under Bill Clinton only 75,540 black people were murdered in those years. Bill Clinton's presidency saved over 18,000 black lives. This is why the Clintons are so justifiably liked by the African American community.

How about we indict them and convict them first?

Of course. The women said their lives were threatened. Our society makes great lip service about protecting women in these circumstances, most pointedly - HRC - but we vilify women who are raped or assaulted, especially by powerful, popular men.

You can see the responses by members here through the years as people have brought up these women and their stories.

No proof of the sex not being consensual, no reports from medical professionals corroborating any of her story, and it is documented, (Troopergate), that Clinton's enemies make monetary promises to people who invent sex scandals about Bill.

That is a fact.

It's how Cosby got his charges dropped...

Like I said, no proof the sex wasn't consensual, no medical report, and documented proof that conservatives were promising money to people who will make up sex stories about Clinton, (Troopergate).