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This is going in the relationship forum because it deals with a good friend.
A long time friend. .. not sure of any where else for it to go..

Any who.

The problem is that I need to find a way and find the right words, to tell my 'best' friend that she really needs to get a reality check. She is absolutely unaware of how she treats people and gets raging mad when someone finally says enough, and walks out of her life.

What has happened is that her 'boyfriend' of a few years has been living with her, paying her bills, and supplying much needed health insurance for her through his job. She has had a belly dance class for a while, and has done a few other jobs along the way as well. Please don't hear me say she has done nothing.. he has just been the source of 'other' money.

She has cheated on him, insulted him, be littled him, and has told me more then once .. to the point that I could almost quote her " he has to stay here. He pays the bills and gives me insurance'
She would bring her 'flings' over to have dinner.. at their table.
Have them hang out like friends, and then insult him with said fling .
As usual, the fling goes sour and she will go out and find another one. And even the fling ends up , in her mind, being the one who fucked up by leaving her. It is THEM who had the problem. Not her.

Now, they were not talking marriage or anything. But I would think it was a serious enough relationship that , for him to find out would be devastating.

She has thought of kicking him out before, but would only come back to the conclusion that she could not afford to do so, and realized she would lose her insurance as well.

B/f finally left.

But, now, it is HIM who has made HER unhappy. HE made HER uncomfortable. And it is HIS fault.. all of it, though I have yet to hear what it was that truly happened.

All I know is that I am sitting here.... just stunned at her behavior. I can not get that she can not see how bad she treated him, and Im blown away that she really thinks ' he fucked up' by leaving her. When, all she kept him for was money and insurance.

I do love my friend. Very much.But, I feel that I need to bring this to her in hopes that she can stop treating people like this.
Everyone in her life ends up leaving after a short time because she does this to them.
Then, does not see what she is doing. She sees it as everyone else trying to hurt her. Yet she is rude, abrasive and abusive to the people who are close to her.
She is isolating her self as she gets older and Im worried.

I can not change her. But, I want to tell her...

I just don't quite know how, or if I even should.

Believe me, when I say I am only skimming the top of the behavior.
This is just the most obvious pattern for me to see in her.

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All I can say is good luck. You have pretty much described my ex to a t. Every single one of her boyfriends/flings/husbands ended up being "crazy" and "let her down" repeatedly. Oddly enough, every one of her employers was "crazy" too. Numerous friends have tried to clue her in... She just ditches them and finds sympathetic ones instead.

I'll be following this with much interest.

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I am pretty sure that, when I bring this to her attention, I too will be flung aside.

There will be aspects of her I will miss, but I cant handle pretending to agree, and being sympathetic while she hurts people the way she does.

I would hope that if I was like that, someone would tell me too.

Every time, it is all about how someone has screwed her. Someone is after her. Someone wants to BE her.
Never about what she has done to anyone else.

(sigh)

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This is a solipsistic person. That's not a diagnosis, just a comment. I've no good advice on how to clue her in so that she can see her behaviour relative to others. Among other things, it would be the messenger who would be "shot", which could be worth it if it worked, but somehow I'm guessing it wouldn't work.

Await wiser comments.

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I had to look up that word Osso.. hehe

but you are absolutely correct.

Definition #2-2. extreme preoccupation with and indulgence of one's feelings, desires, etc.; egoistic self-absorption.

I will be shot for it.
I will not have a friend any more.
But , I don't think I really have one to begin with.
I don't see her, I hardly hear from her, and she is over 800 miles away.

Well, I hear from her when she needs something. But rarely are our conversations about more then her life drama, issues, and heartaches.

When they are about me, it can get intense and she has been a real help when I have needed someone to just hear me. But it does feel like an almost onesided relationship most of the time.

My husband just passed out the word sociopath..

I argued.

Then he said " well not ALL sociopaths are murderers.. " Laughing

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There you are, Osso. I havn't seen evidence of you for a while.

Shewolf, it seems that by telling your friend the truth, you'll save yourself the pain of having to hide your putting up with her behavior and you'll give her a chance to test reality. Do not enable her to project onto others her own social garbage. If she flings you aside for doing her this favor, it's your gain, if you ask me.

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Yes, I thought of that word too.

I seem to remember psychologists don't make it a category, but that is a descriptive, but then, I don't know that kind of detail, much less how this behavior can be modified.

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Hi, JL, waves.

Shewolf, I agree on not just putting up with it, but don't know the best way, if there is one, to help her get a clue, if a clue would help, or if that is in any way your job. There may be a case for just stopping with the primarily one way friendship.

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There maybe no way to soften that kind of a blow.
I mean, Im going to be telling her she is selfish, that she is self centered, arrogant, and takes advantage of people.
I dont know anyone who would be ok with hearing that about themselves.

It may not be my place to do it.
But if I call myself her friend, then I owe her some honesty.

Many times, I hear her cry, and I used to be able to hug her while she would go through horrible depression about being alone. Missing people in her life. How everyone leaves her.

I truly, TRULY dont think she sees what she does.

And this is another of those times.

I heard her voice over the phone, just cracking saying " ____" left me "
And I about cried with her.
She sounded so hurt, so betrayed.

If took me about a day to remember all she has said about him,all I know that they have done, and how she felt about him.

About a week and a half later she is pissed at him saying it is his fault, and he has to lay in the bed he made. THat he made a bad decision for leaving her.

And it felt like I was watching her being presented to ME as someone I would never want to know.
It was a strange feeling.
I know her patterns so well, I know for a fact , in about 2 more weeks, she will cry again and have her eyes on a perspective man.

I would put up a vegas size bet on that pattern.

I dont know , Maybe it isnt my place.

maybe my words will mean nothing.
But she is 42 and wondering why she is alone. Hating that she is alone, and doesnt want to BE alone.
If she will listen to anyone, Im hoping she will listen to me.

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[quote="LionTamerX"]All I can say is good luck. You have pretty much described my ex to a t. Every single one of her boyfriends/flings/husbands ended up being "crazy" and "let her down" repeatedly. Oddly enough, every one of her employers was "crazy" too. Numerous friends have tried to clue her in... She just ditches them and finds sympathetic ones instead.

I'll be following this with much interest.[/quote]

All I can say is good luck. You have pretty much described my ex to a t. Every single one of his friends ended up being "crazy" and "let him down" repeatedly. Oddly enough, every one of his employers was "crazy" too.
Numerous friends have tried to clue him in... He just ditches them and finds sympathetic ones instead.

I'll be following this with much interest.

Additionally I now (with nearly ten years since the end of our relationship) can say, that I am sure he neither was aware of what he was doing!
He would treat people (me for example) like ****, but everything that happened was the other person's fault.
It was my fault he cheated, my fault the tent was too small, my fault his daughter was confused as to who to turn to.
But he seemed to live in his little phantasie world and believe all of the stories he made up!

I would just tell her and say good-bye gladly, if it came to it!

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I agree, Bohne.

Shewolfn, if not for her, do it for yourself. Do you really have time for that kind of relationship? At best you can tell her that you care for her and how much you would hate to have her reject you, but that you cannot go on without trying to help her in a realistic way (as opposed to letting her think you agree with her projective rationalizations about other people's failings).
Then if/when she breaks off with you she will at least go away with the "gift" of understanding that you love her.

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Sometimes we don't get to keep the people in our lives we want to keep because what's best for them and for us is to walk away from the friendship.

I've lost a lot of friends in my life, not by choice so much as by circumstance.

It says a lot about you that you are willing to forfit the relationship with her to be honest enough to try and help her. It's like the whole 'tough love' thing.

In time, she may realize that what you did was not out of spite but out of love.

Perhaps she will realize it when you tell her. Maybe no one has told her before. She might not realize what a bitch she is being.

Either way, I don't envy you.

Good luck.

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Good message, Bella Dea.
AND, Shewolfn, what do you think of sending a card reminding your friend (after she has rejected you because you told her what you believed to be in her best interest) that, while you do not deny the truth of what you told her, you love her and miss her friendship?

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I dont know that I would want to be on the receiving end of her wrath frankly.

I have watched her chase an ex for almost 2 years because she wanted HIM to see HIS wrongs by HER

so she followed him. Emailed him. Called him. Flew to him.... you name it.

Then would come back just as pissed as a bee hive that had been kicked talking about making his life hell.

Quite frankly, the only way to make her truly understand something, and it sounds cruel.. but.. to send her a card that points out the fact that she just pushed away yet another person with her behavior..

I have been working on a letter most of the afternoon. Trying to figure out what to say when and where .
It bothers me that I will have to lose this friendship that I have had for.. 10+ years.
But, at the same time, it hasnt been a REAL friendship because it always weighs heavily to one side or another with us.

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shewolf, I'm sorry, but from what I've read, I'm not sure that this person is worth the effort. Maybe you can explain why you want her as a friend.

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shewolfnm wrote:

...I have been working on a letter most of the afternoon. Trying to figure out what to say when and where .
It bothers me that I will have to lose this friendship that I have had for.. 10+ years...

Oh, shewolf. Sad

How many times have I been through this sort of thing. (sigh)

Don't count on making any sort of impact with her. She's already demonstrated again and again that she doesn't listen to people who are important in her life. You'll be no different.

It is so much easier for her to blame others than accept responsibility for her own mistakes. And after all this practice, it's become her coping mechanism for dealing with loss.

Say whatever you feel like you need to say, though. (I say that for your benefit, not hers.) And console yourself with the thought that this is simply someone you've known for 10+ years. She's not a real friend. Save your caring for "friends" who enrich your life. Not people who are such a burden.

(I'm talking to myself here as much as to you.)

(((((HUGS)))))

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