Why arent they all just considered ridiculous?

nimh wrote:

Wow. Filling 18 pages about how stupid religious believers are? Whats the point?

And in case some smart aleck asks, whats the point of my post here: it's wondering why people get such satisfaction from smacking down believers that they'd fill 18 pages with it.

I mean, in a thread like this its hardly like you were provoked - no Christian or Muslim came to you to bother you with his religion in this thread - the whole point was apparently from the start to come on in and say believers are stupid. At length.

I wouldn't say that.

The most intriguing off-shoot of the original question, for me, is discussing the phenomenon of religious believers of Faith A brushing off the believers of of Faiths B, C, D and E as being "false" or "ridiculous" or whatever, yet refuse to hold similar mirror up to their own creeds.

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Setanta wrote:

The author has come back to the thread to continue to insist that religious devotion is an intellectually and pyschologically suspect belief set. I have for my part, said that this is not something which matters in my "real world" life, and that the internet is a special circumstance.

So far I fully agree with you.

Setanta wrote:

...The discussion has largely been benign, except between Snood and me, because he can't keep a civil tongue in his head if he thinks i've not been civil about religion.

But i'm sick to death of Snood and his arrogance and his special pleading. So i've gone out of my way to be offensive to him on the subject, because it seems to me that he came back to this thread looking for a fight. I hope it pisses him off.

Hey Snood, people who think they've seen alien space vessels are about the only people as loony or loonier than the religious nut cases.

I think you have many fine qualities Set. - (and I value & enjoy the dialogue with you) - However this is not one of them. I try (not always successfully) to avoid reacting to what I find annoying or offensive in others here, precisely because it is a somewhat artificial dialogue with no personal encounter, and because the aggrivation doesn't do me (or anyone) any good. Several times I have been rewarded by later discovering something interesting in some of the folks who initially (or occasionally ) annoy me. I'm confident that, in my own way, I probably return both the favor and the annoyance to others - often without realizing it.

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stlstrike3 wrote:

[
I wouldn't say that.

The most intriguing off-shoot of the original question, for me, is discussing the phenomenon of religious believers of Faith A brushing off the believers of of Faiths B, C, D and E as being "false" or "ridiculous" or whatever, yet refuse to hold similar mirror up to their own creeds.

Arrogance and hypocrisy are pretty much the same whether one starts with a secular or a religious perspective on this question.

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OK, sure - I could have guessed that half or more of the thread was made up of defenses against the argument that religious people are stupid (basically).

I still dont see the point of going back and forth about how dumb religious people are. I mean, a thread of RexRed's where he starts off dissing non-believers - ok, you respond. Also doesnt yield anything, but there's the element of defence. But a thread specifically starting off to be all about how dumb religious people are?

Anyway. Let me not add to that myself, and stick to an unrelated question.

Setanta wrote:

I have for my part, said that .. the internet is a special circumstance.

Why?

I mean, I think (but my memory may be faulty) that Ive seen you posit before that internet is special somehow in the sense that it doesnt require the same civility as real life.

But why wouldnt one be as civil online as IRL? Its still people you're dealing with either way. I dont see how the medium, in itself, would create an excuse to be rude, offensive and agressive in ways you wouldnt be in in-person communication.

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Civility in real life means that i will not discuss religion or politics in polite company. It also means that i will insist that political or religious discussions not be foisted off on me in "real life." I consider it incivility to insist upon a discussion that others do not wish to engage in. But this is a discussion board--it is a venue specifically intended for discussions, and there is no requirement that people display civility.

Tell me, Habibi--how many times have you shown up to insist upon civility toward non-believers? How many times have you taken on Frank because he says that atheists are idiots? How many times have you shown up to take on RexRed for the vile things he says to those who do not agree with him?

Great barking hypocrite . . .

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Setanta wrote:

I pointed out that i had specified the religious fanatic, and not all people of religious devotion. Soz couldn't let it alone, though, and wanted to get all indignant

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O'George, Snood has so often attempted to pick fights with me, even though there are many subjects upon which we do agree, that i have reached the point that i don't give a rat's ass what he thinks of me, and i don't give a rat's ass what anyone thinks of how i address Snood.

I consider that he is at least as responsible as i for this state of affairs--and actually allege that he is more responsible. He and his asshole buddy Intrepid followed me around for weeks for a while trying to get under my skin. Snood has been banned from the site for the content of PMs which he has sent me. He has jumped into countless threads in which i had not addressed him to attack me for what i said to or about others.

I no longer give a **** about Snood--and i don't care whether or not you think that is admirable. You claim to be Irish--think about it O'George--i have reached the point at which i genuinely hope that i piss Snood off.

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Setanta wrote:

I no longer give a **** about Snood...............................i have reached the point at which i genuinely hope that i piss Snood off.

If you don't care about Snood, why do you want to piss him off? When I don't care about a person, I simply ignore him/her. IMO,
it is not worth the effort to lock horns with that person.

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Setanta wrote:

Civility in real life means that i will not discuss religion or politics in polite company. It also means that i will insist that political or religious discussions not be foisted off on me in "real life." I consider it incivility to insist upon a discussion that others do not wish to engage in. But this is a discussion board--it is a venue specifically intended for discussions, and there is no requirement that people display civility.

Tell me, Habibi--how many times have you shown up to insist upon civility toward non-believers? How many times have you taken on Frank because he says that atheists are idiots? How many times have you shown up to take on RexRed for the vile things he says to those who do not agree with him?

Great barking hypocrite . . .

I agree. You are correct in pointing out my lapses. I would, though, style it as ... "moderate barking hypocrite".

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Setanta wrote:

Tell me, Habibi--how many times have you shown up to insist upon civility toward non-believers? How many times have you taken on Frank because he says that atheists are idiots? How many times have you shown up to take on RexRed for the vile things he says to those who do not agree with him?

Frank Apisa? Havent seen him around lately, but yes, I've commented on his seemingly purposeless rudeness a bunch of times in the past. And on yours too, by the way. So you can take that "Great barking hypocrite" of yours right back.

I mean, this is what I'm talking about. If I were to ask a question like the one I asked above, which was asked without any hint of impoliteness or even confrontationality, when meeting you at an A2K gathering, would you have snarled, you "great barking hypocrite", right off the bat like that?

I dont believe it for a second - from what Ive heard, you are a consistently friendly, charming, boisterous person when met "live".

So why would you do so here?

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georgeob1 wrote:

Setanta wrote:
Tell me, Habibi--how many times have you shown up to insist upon civility toward non-believers? How many times have you taken on Frank because he says that atheists are idiots? How many times have you shown up to take on RexRed for the vile things he says to those who do not agree with him?

Great barking hypocrite . . .

I agree. You are correct in pointing out my lapses. I would, though, style it as ... "moderate barking hypocrite".

He was addressing me, George - I'm "habibi". Goes back to my Abuzz screenname.

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Then I retract the confession.

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Setanta wrote:

O'George, Snood has so often attempted to pick fights with me, even though there are many subjects upon which we do agree, that i have reached the point that i don't give a rat's ass what he thinks of me, and i don't give a rat's ass what anyone thinks of how i address Snood.

I didn't know all that. It's OK, but is it really worth YOUR aggrivation?

Setanta wrote:

I no longer give a **** about Snood--and i don't care whether or not you think that is admirable. You claim to be Irish--think about it O'George--i have reached the point at which i genuinely hope that i piss Snood off.

An effective but underhanded tactic - the appeal to the tribal temperment. I understand and, as you know, often have my own lapses, but still believe that laughing it off is very often the best tactic.

Another old Navy saying ---- "Don't get in a fight with a pig. You both get dirty, but the pig likes it."

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georgeob1 wrote:

Setanta wrote:
Civility in real life means that i will not discuss religion or politics in polite company. It also means that i will insist that political or religious discussions not be foisted off on me in "real life." I consider it incivility to insist upon a discussion that others do not wish to engage in. But this is a discussion board--it is a venue specifically intended for discussions, and there is no requirement that people display civility.

Tell me, Habibi--how many times have you shown up to insist upon civility toward non-believers? How many times have you taken on Frank because he says that atheists are idiots? How many times have you shown up to take on RexRed for the vile things he says to those who do not agree with him?

Great barking hypocrite . . .

I agree. You are correct in pointing out my lapses. I would, though, style it as ... "moderate barking hypocrite".

These remarks were addressed to an about Habibi. If you wish to characterize yourself as a hypocrite, of whatever degree, you are of course entitled to do so. I have not, however, so characterized you.

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nimh wrote:

Setanta wrote:
Tell me, Habibi--how many times have you shown up to insist upon civility toward non-believers? How many times have you taken on Frank because he says that atheists are idiots? How many times have you shown up to take on RexRed for the vile things he says to those who do not agree with him?

Frank Apisa? Havent seen him around lately, but yes, I've commented on his seemingly purposeless rudeness a bunch of times in the past. And on yours too, by the way. So you can take that "Great barking hypocrite" of yours right back.

I mean, this is what I'm talking about. If I were to ask a question like the one I asked above, which was asked without any hint of impoliteness or even confrontationality, when meeting you at an A2K gathering, would you have snarled, you "great barking hypocrite", right off the bat like that?

I dont believe it for a second - from what Ive heard, you are a consistently friendly, charming, boisterous person when met "live".

So why would you do so here?

The snarling is all in your imagination, you overrate your significance to me. As it happens, i have not ever seen you take on Frank. I'll take your word for it, though. I've not ever seen you take on RexRed, either, nor Baddog, nor Muslim1, nor any of the others whom i have seen making attacks on people because they don't agree with the religious points of view of those they are attacking. If you claim that you do consistently object to their tone and their remarks, i would be willing to withdraw the remark, but i suspect that you have not done so.

When Snood and Intrepid were following me around in an attempt to get my goat (i suspect hoping that i would respond in a manner which they could report, hoping to get me banned for it), i didn't ever see you running in to comment on their behavior.

Because you found reason to comment here, but you have been more notable by your absence than your presence when these sorts of squabbles break out, i was, and remain, willing to characterize you as hypocritical, at least with regard to this topic.

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georgeob1 wrote:

Setanta wrote:
O'George, Snood has so often attempted to pick fights with me, even though there are many subjects upon which we do agree, that i have reached the point that i don't give a rat's ass what he thinks of me, and i don't give a rat's ass what anyone thinks of how i address Snood.

I didn't know all that. It's OK, but is it really worth YOUR aggrivation?

You misspelled aggravation.

You are wrong to assume that i am aggravated. I repeat, do you claim to be Irish? In fact, i've reached the point with Snood that i enjoy confrontations with him, and that is why i say i hope it pisses him off. The thought pleases me.

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Setanta wrote:

You misspelled aggravation.

screw you !

Setanta wrote:

You are wrong to assume that i am aggravated.

Well it IS hard to tell, given your usual disposition.

Setanta wrote:

I repeat, do you claim to be Irish?

I do - parents born there. Wanna make something of it? But I do enjoy laughing more than snarling.

Setanta wrote:

In fact, i've reached the point with Snood that i enjoy confrontations with him, and that is why i say i hope it pisses him off. The thought pleases me.

I guessed that :wink:

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georgeob1 wrote:

Well it IS hard to tell, given your usual disposition.

You make assumptions about my disposition which are unwarranted.

. . . bloody Paddy.

Why arent they all just considered ridiculous?

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