0
   

Willing to send his son

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Feb, 2007 01:40 pm
mysteryman wrote:

And what corner was that?


Heh, you can't be so knock-out that can't recognise the colour anymore: you are in the red corner.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Feb, 2007 01:47 pm
mysterman said
Quote:
I cant answer you,I'm not a member of the right.


Apparently, this is a multi-dimensional universe after all. Hitlerian-socialist? Authority-appreciating-freedom-fighter?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Feb, 2007 03:57 pm
mm only looks like and talks like one.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Feb, 2007 04:03 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
mm only looks like and talks like one.


I freely admit to being a conservative,and I have never denied that.

However,the "right" as you like to use the term is derogatory and meant to insinuatethat conservatives are somehow morally wrong and without compasson of any kind.

I do not fit that description and never have.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Feb, 2007 04:08 pm
That's what I used to think; conservatives were for smaller government, less intrusion into our lives, and self-sufficiency.

The reality is that the republicans have only watched out for the rich, and made it much worse for the middle class and the poor.

"Morally wrong" is in the eye of the beholder. What the republicans have done to the middle class and the poor is "morally wrong" in my eyes.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Feb, 2007 04:13 pm
Thanks for clarifying that, mm.

Here, in Europe, conservatives are centre-right (a few) to right of the political spectrum. And from our political point of view, the American Republcans are right to 'righter'.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Feb, 2007 05:45 am
Walter,
You and CI are confused.
Conservative does NOT mean republican.
Just as liberal does NOT mean democrat.

I admit that many people,including me at times,do interchange the words,but thats wrong.
The republica leadership in Washington right now is not now nor have they ever been conservative,in my view.

Please do not confuse republican with conservative.
I am a conservative,but I have never been a republican,nor will I ever be.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Feb, 2007 06:15 am
Well, MM, thanks for clearing that up.

Btw: actually, I never mix up the terms "liberals" and "conservative" voluntarily.

Both, the Democrats as well as the Republicans have some liberal ideas - and both are some/many issues conservatives.

However, while there are liberals as well on the left (more seldom) as on the right side (most liberal parties here in Europe) of the political spectrum, conservatives are generally thaught to be mostly on the right.

Exceptions might be when you call someone e.g. a "conservative Social-Democrat" - that's someone more purely on the union's/worker's side.

If the actual Republican leadership is not conservative we are using that term differently as well.

At least, the Republicans themselves think that they are conservatives .... they are a member party of the International Group of Conservative Parties - IDU


The Democrats aren't a member party of the Liberal International nor the Socialists International
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Feb, 2007 12:03 pm
blatham wrote:
OCCOM BILL wrote:
For those of you so blinded by hyper-polarity, that you think only a right-winger can recognize the inherent wrongness in abandoning Iraqis; take pause. This is a thinking position; not just a Republican position or a Bushie position as hyper-partisan idiots would have you believe. To make this easier to swallow, I offer a post by a well respected (by me for sure, and everyone I believe) poster who disagrees with my politics as vehemently as anyone. Click here.


I no longer share nimh's position on this point... see here http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=83525&start=30

Or, one can listen to Lt. Gen. William Odom, the former director of the National Security Agency under Ronald Reagan and head of Army intelligence. The first link below is to an op ed in the WP written Feb 11. The second link is to a radio interview re that op ed done by Hugh Hewitt and posted on Townhall...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/09/AR2007020901917_pf.html

http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/Transcript_Page.aspx?ContentGuid=d7f52e21-cf46-4115-b397-ed1dc70fcdab
Okay Blatham, I read both and I cannot imagine what you're missing. Odom in no way suggests Nimh's wrong. It isn't that he disagrees that genocide will take place; he doesn't care. His "solution" is:
A. Pull out the troops as fast as possible.
B. Watch the Shia annihilate the Sunni in a horrendous genocide, even if it means escalation of violence 30 fold.
C. Wait for the world to decry that's a shame and go in and mop up the blood.

Some hero you've got there Blatham. Rolling Eyes

Then, on Iran, he admits he isn't familiar with the religion, but insists it's all rhetoric anyway. He admits they regularly supply weapons to terrorists, believes they are seeking Nuclear weapons and will get them, but thinks we should do nothing about it.

Some hero you've got there Blatham. Rolling Eyes

Perhaps you should re-read your hero's views and see what a despicable position it is he's actually forwarding.
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Feb, 2007 12:56 pm
Let's take a look at was this jerkoff actually has to say.

Quote:
HH: Here's John Burns on that subject from last week.

JB: If the United Nations is correct in saying that 3,700 Iraqi civilians died in October, and that's a morgue's count. It may be an underestimate, we don't know. But he said if it's correct that 3,700 people died in October across Iraq, think about this. You take the American troops away in this situation, leaving Shiite death squads to move into Adamiya in force, without any kind of protection, he said it won't be 3,700 dead in the month, it will be 3,700 dead in the night in Adamiya. Now that may be an exaggeration, but it reflects the kind of fears that are quite widespread, amongst Sunnis in particular, but also to some extent amongst Shiites in Iraq about the consequences of an American troop withdrawal.

HH: So General, should we be indifferent to that?

WO: Yes.
Here he show's he doesn't care if the violence escalates 30 times, we should just turn the blind eye. Rolling Eyes

Quote:
HH: Did you see any hope for Saddam's regime to change, General?

WO: No.

HH: Would his sons have been at least as worse as he was if…

WO: Sure.
Here he admits Saddam wouldn't change and that the next generation would be no better.
Quote:
HH: And so…

WO: And I can think if dictators much worse than him that we don't bother with.

HH: But of course, he had attempted…

WO: So why do we pick out this one among all the dictators in the world we could pick out and go overthrow?
Standard liberal Tu Quoque. (So what she was raped... it's not as bad as that rape over there... and there's lots of rapes, so, so what.)


Quote:
HH: Well, because he shot at American planes because he…

WO: He…who…we shot at him.

HH: Well, he had U.N. resolutions that were being enforced by American planes…

WO: And we were doing a pretty good job of containing him.
Evades the question, then offers an answer to a question that wasn't asked... but then gets pinned down.

Quote:
HH: But that's one…he was clearly hostile to the United States, right, General?

WO: Sure.
He goes on to admit Iraq did provide the Casus Belli for the war by attacking U.S. planes.

Quote:
HH: I'm actually just trying to figure out what you think Iraq would look like if after four months hence, we leave, what it would look like in a year?

WO: It's going to look worse if we stay.

HH: I know that, but what do you think it will look like? I know you believe that…

WO: I don't know. I don't know. You don't know, and it's just a guess. And I don't see killing more Americans based on your guess.

HH: Did you see Cambodia coming, General?

WO: And following…let me ask you. Are you enthusiastic enough to put on a uniform and go?
Standard liberal dodge of the question. He continues to dodge for a while, but HH does a pretty good job of boxing him in...
Quote:
HH: I want to hear it, and I want…but I want to know what you think it's going to look like, because I'm not indifferent to the aftermath.


WO: I don't know. I'm prepared to accept whatever it looks like, if it's not killing Americans, and we're not losing U.S. resources, because eventually, it will settle out out there, and our capacity to help it settle out earlier with allies will be greatly improved. I think actually, that it will come out much better than these scare pictures you're describing, and I include John Burns as somewhat of a scaremonger in this regard.
Here he clearly demonstrates he doesn't care what happens when we leave; we'll be in a better position after the slaughter.

ON IRAN:
Quote:
HH: All right. Next in your article, you wrote, "We must continue the war to prevent Iran's influence from growing in Iraq." That's one of the arguments you attribute to proponents of staying. And I do believe that's a very important issue. Do you believe that Iran is intent on acquiring nuclear weapons?

WO: Sure. They're going to get them.

HH: And should we do anything to stop that?

WO: No.
Great plan, that. Rolling Eyes

Quote:
HH: Do you believe that they were responsible for the massacre of the Jews at the synagogue in South America?

WO: They might well have been.

HH: Do you believe that they have armed Hezbollah with the rockets that rain down on Israel?

WO: Yes.
So they regularly supply weapons to terrorists, but that's OK. Rolling Eyes

Overall, the undertone is quite clear. If Americans aren't dying, General Odom couldn't care less what the magnitude of suffering around the world is. This isn't really your philosophy, Blatham, so you should trot this imbecile out to make your points. Whether Iraq turns into Cambodia or Rwanda, this A-hole couldn't care less... as long as Americans aren't included in the deaths. Think about it. 30 times worse than today's killing numbers. That's front row seat to a genocide proportions, and this guy thinks that's A-OK... because in the aftermath; the world community might actually be willing to step in and help. And who cares if religious extremists who already supply terrorists acquire nuclear weapons. I'm glad this fool is retired.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Feb, 2007 12:56 pm
From Wikipedia:

The Republican Party is composed of Fiscal Conservatives, Evangelicals, Social Conservatives, Neoconservatives, Libertarians, Moderates, Liberals (sometimes derided as Republican In Name Only, or RINOs, by more conservative Republicans), and Log Cabin Republicans.

The Republican Party is often the more socially conservative and economically libertarian of the two major parties, and has closer ties to both Wall Street (large corporations) and Main Street (locally owned businesses) (small mom & pop businesses)[citation needed]; it has little support among labor union leadership, but more support from blue collar workers[citation needed]. The party generally supports lower taxes and limited government in some economic areas, while preferring government intervention in others.


mm usually doesn't know his own party politics. Not only ironic, but funny!
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Feb, 2007 09:47 am
cicerone imposter wrote:
From Wikipedia:

The Republican Party is composed of Fiscal Conservatives, Evangelicals, Social Conservatives, Neoconservatives, Libertarians, Moderates, Liberals (sometimes derided as Republican In Name Only, or RINOs, by more conservative Republicans), and Log Cabin Republicans.

The Republican Party is often the more socially conservative and economically libertarian of the two major parties, and has closer ties to both Wall Street (large corporations) and Main Street (locally owned businesses) (small mom & pop businesses)[citation needed]; it has little support among labor union leadership, but more support from blue collar workers[citation needed]. The party generally supports lower taxes and limited government in some economic areas, while preferring government intervention in others.


mm usually doesn't know his own party politics. Not only ironic, but funny!


Well,since I'm not a member of the republican party,their beliefs and views dont matter to me,and arent important.

I repeat my claim,republican does not equal conservative.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Feb, 2007 09:55 am
mysteryman wrote:

I repeat my claim,republican does not equal conservative.


Well, in that case someone should inform them - and the IPU.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Feb, 2007 09:59 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
mysteryman wrote:

I repeat my claim,republican does not equal conservative.


Well, in that case someone should inform them - and the IPU.


So,if according to you and CI,if being a conservative automatically means being a republican,then being a leberal automatically means being a democrat?

So,since the terms ARE interchangeable,according to you,then why dont the dems call themselves liberals,with al of the negative connotations that go with it?
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Feb, 2007 10:03 am
I find the little tiff between Cheney and Pelosi somewhat interesting. It should be noted that each served in the military for the same length of time -- zilch. But Pelosi didn't receive five deferments during the war in Nam.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Feb, 2007 10:10 am
mysteryman wrote:
So,if according to you and CI,if being a conservative automatically means being a republican,then being a leberal automatically means being a democrat?


Where did I ever say or claim such a nonsense?
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 Feb, 2007 10:14 am
Prince Harry deserves considerable credit. Therefore, isn't it time for someone in the Bush family to serve in Iraq?
0 Replies
 
 

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