Why does the god of the Bible consider slavery to be moral??

It is kind of pathetic to watch. Although, I do admire Mesquite's ability to whack Neo's dreamy sense of the myth.
"They lost their physical perfection...."
"Where does God say he made them perfect?"
(He doesn't, but it must seem nicer somehow to Neo.

And you're right, Steve, this whole thread the Biblists have danced like angels on the head of a pin around the question asked by Frank so long ago. They offered variants of "Tweren't real slavery" to "Okay, there were slaves, but you couldn't beat them to death." As if that makes everything hunkydory morally. No one can explain how a just god would entertain for an instant the enslavement of one human by another.

So, they ask different questions: How many Gods are there in the Bible? What is the power of Satan? Is the Tree of Life still guarded by angels?
As if the answers to any of these questions brings any clarity to reality.

Some friends and I once spent a semester of college debating the various aspects of Superman and his life. One of the hot topics was "Where did Clark Kent put his clothes when he changed into Superman?"

Joe(Fun, and no one was killed because they didn't believe in the power of Green Kryptonite.)Nation

neologist wrote:

It is obvious from the language of Genesis that God does not always measure days in terms of 24 hours.
First of All, Genesis 2:4 lumps all of the creative days into one: "This is a history of the heavens and the earth in the time of their being created, in the day that Jehovah God made earth and heaven."
The seventh day has never been recorded as having ended.
"For a thousand years are in your eyes but as yesterday when it is past,
And as a watch during the night." (Psalm 90:4)

The creation days were clearly 24 hour days as the Hebrew word yom was used with a number and the phrasing evening and morning. Whenever yom is used with a number modifier it refers to a literal 24 hour day. This is true in the 359 uses of that word outside chapter one of Genesis. The seventh day fits this pattern the same as all the others associated with a number. The psalm quote merely refers to the perception of time.

neologist wrote:

A&E, lost their physical perfection and began to die as soon as they disobeyed. You have heard the term 'dead man walking', have you not?

.
Perfection? Where does god say he made them perfect? In Genesis 1:31 God said he made them very good not perfect.

[31]And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

They didn't even know good from bad. Had they been made perfect God would not have had to boot them out of Eden.

neologist wrote:

As far as the tree of life is concerned, the fact that I am not willing to speculate does not mean there is no explanation. If it's so important, I will spend some time on it.

It is important because it is given as the reason for booting A&E out of Eden. lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

It is kind of pathetic to watch. Although, I do admire Mesquite's ability to whack Neo's dreamy sense of the myth.
"They lost their physical perfection...."
"Where does God say he made them perfect?"
(He doesn't, but it must seem nicer somehow to Neo.

And you're right, Steve, this whole thread the Biblists have danced like angels on the head of a pin around the question asked by Frank so long ago. They offered variants of "Tweren't real slavery" to "Okay, there were slaves, but you couldn't beat them to death." As if that makes everything hunkydory morally. No one can explain how a just god would entertain for an instant the enslavement of one human by another.

So, they ask different questions: How many Gods are there in the Bible? What is the power of Satan? Is the Tree of Life still guarded by angels?
As if the answers to any of these questions brings any clarity to reality.

Some friends and I once spent a semester of college debating the various aspects of Superman and his life. One of the hot topics was "Where did Clark Kent put his clothes when he changed into Superman?"

Joe(Fun, and no one was killed because they didn't believe in the power of Green Kryptonite.)Nation

Dear oh dear, I have already told you I have no ****ing idea why the god of the Old Testament considers slavery to be moral...

and to be blunt neither do you guys

but the religionists could at least direct the question upwards for us, then perhaps we might get a definitive answer and call a halt to this very silly thread.

ok rant over

If creation was not 24-hour days, then why did god not rest on the seventh as he said he would. He evidently "worked" when he instructed A&E not to eat the fruit of knowledge(good and evil). Which one is it?

You mean all those "miracles" were man-made? 1) World flood, 2) Moses separating the sea, 3) turning a woman into a pile of salt, 4) the burning bush that talked. LOL

er

mesquite wrote:

neologist wrote:

It is obvious from the language of Genesis that God does not always measure days in terms of 24 hours.
First of All, Genesis 2:4 lumps all of the creative days into one: "This is a history of the heavens and the earth in the time of their being created, in the day that Jehovah God made earth and heaven."
The seventh day has never been recorded as having ended.
"For a thousand years are in your eyes but as yesterday when it is past,
And as a watch during the night." (Psalm 90:4)

The creation days were clearly 24 hour days as the Hebrew word yom was used with a number and the phrasing evening and morning. Whenever yom is used with a number modifier it refers to a literal 24 hour day. This is true in the 359 uses of that word outside chapter one of Genesis. The seventh day fits this pattern the same as all the others associated with a number. The psalm quote merely refers to the perception of time.

Really?! Even in Genesis 2:4? Genesis 5:1? And BTW, for that matter, there was no number associated with Genesis 2:17.

mesquite wrote:

neologist wrote:

A&E, lost their physical perfection and began to die as soon as they disobeyed. You have heard the term 'dead man walking', have you not?

.
Perfection? Where does god say he made them perfect? In Genesis 1:31 God said he made them very good not perfect.

[31]And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

Also written by the same author but different book "He is the Rock, his work is perfect. . ." (Deuteronomy 32:4) If you wish to impeach me using the bible, you will need to read the bible.

mesquite wrote:

They didn't even know good from bad. Had they been made perfect God would not have had to boot them out of Eden.

Had they been made according to your definition of perfect, they would have been robots, incapable of error. "

mesquite wrote:

neologist wrote:

As far as the tree of life is concerned, the fact that I am not willing to speculate does not mean there is no explanation. If it's so important, I will spend some time on it.

It is important because it is given as the reason for booting A&E out of Eden. lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Not the reason - a reason, perhaps, but the (apparently metaphorical) flaming sword would have sufficed in case they tried to sneak back in. (Genesis 3:24)

The timing of Satan's rebellion was determined only by Satan. By inciting A&E to join him in his revolt, he raised many issues he may have thought would give him an upper hand.

If God forgave Adam and Eve, he could be accused of lying about the death penalty. This would also call into question his standard of justice.

If he destroyed all rebels immediately, as he could have, it would mean that he was unable to carry out his purpose to have humans inhabiting the earth - at least humans who were descended from Adam and Eve, who he had already declared 'good'.

neologist wrote:

mesquite wrote:

neologist wrote:

It is obvious from the language of Genesis that God does not always measure days in terms of 24 hours.
First of All, Genesis 2:4 lumps all of the creative days into one: "This is a history of the heavens and the earth in the time of their being created, in the day that Jehovah God made earth and heaven."
The seventh day has never been recorded as having ended.
"For a thousand years are in your eyes but as yesterday when it is past,
And as a watch during the night." (Psalm 90:4)

The creation days were clearly 24 hour days as the Hebrew word yom was used with a number and the phrasing evening and morning. Whenever yom is used with a number modifier it refers to a literal 24 hour day. This is true in the 359 uses of that word outside chapter one of Genesis. The seventh day fits this pattern the same as all the others associated with a number. The psalm quote merely refers to the perception of time.

Really?! Even in Genesis 2:4? Genesis 5:1? And BTW, for that matter, there was no number associated with Genesis 2:17.

Yes, really. Day (yom) can have multiple meanings in English as well as in Hebrew. It can mean a solar day or a longer period of time. If I were to say "back in my day things were done differently", day would be referring to a longer period of time. Context is what determines the meaning. In Genesis 2:4 the context is obviously rolling together a longer period of time and not a specific event that occurred on a singular day. Note the lack of a number assignment also. Genesis 2:17 however does tie it to a specific event (eating the fruit) so the context sets it to a single day.
Are you aware of the importance of the lack of the definite article in Genesis 1:5, Genesis 1:8, Genesis 1:13, Genesis 1:19, Genesis 1:23, and Genesis 1:31?

neologist wrote:

mesquite wrote:

neologist wrote:

A&E, lost their physical perfection and began to die as soon as they disobeyed. You have heard the term 'dead man walking', have you not?

.
Perfection? Where does god say he made them perfect? In Genesis 1:31 God said he made them very good not perfect.

[31]And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

Also written by the same author but different book "He is the Rock, his work is perfect. . ." (Deuteronomy 32:4) If you wish to impeach me using the bible, you will need to read the bible.

Don't blame me because your authors can't keep their stories straight. Within the context of the story we are discussing "very good" is the operative term. Deuteronomy is a different book, different style and almost certainly a different author. WHO WROTE THE PENTATEUCH? Moses is generally considered the author of all five books and the book of Job. God is referred to as perfect throughout the bible.

neologist wrote:

mesquite wrote:

They didn't even know good from bad. Had they been made perfect God would not have had to boot them out of Eden.

Had they been made according to your definition of perfect, they would have been robots, incapable of error. "

mesquite wrote:

neologist wrote:

As far as the tree of life is concerned, the fact that I am not willing to speculate does not mean there is no explanation. If it's so important, I will spend some time on it.

It is important because it is given as the reason for booting A&E out of Eden. lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Not the reason - a reason, perhaps, but the (apparently metaphorical) flaming sword would have sufficed in case they tried to sneak back in. (Genesis 3:24)

According to the Bible it is the reason. There may have been others, but that requires speculation. Keeping them away from the tree of life is the only reason given for their banishment.

Gen 3:22-24 (ESV)
[22]Then the Lord God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of us in knowing good and evil. "

[23]therefore the Lord God sent him out from the garden of Eden to work the ground from which he was taken.

[24]He drove out the man, and at the east of the garden of Eden he placed the cherubim and a flaming sword that turned every way to guard the way to the tree of life.

Moses is generally considered the author of all five books and the book of Job. God is referred to as perfect throughout the bible.

mesquite wrote:

Yes, really. Day (yom) can have multiple meanings in English as well as in Hebrew. It can mean a solar day or a longer period of time. If I were to say "back in my day things were done differently", day would be referring to a longer period of time. Context is what determines the meaning. In Genesis 2:4 the context is obviously rolling together a longer period of time and not a specific event that occurred on a singular day. Note the lack of a number assignment also. Genesis 2:17 however does tie it to a specific event (eating the fruit) so the context sets it to a single day.

Are you aware of the importance of the lack of the definite article in Genesis 1:5, Genesis 1:8, Genesis 1:13, Genesis 1:19, Genesis 1:23, and Genesis 1:31?

mesquite wrote:

Don't blame me because your authors can't keep their stories straight. Within the context of the story we are discussing "very good" is the operative term. Deuteronomy is a different book, different style and almost certainly a different author. WHO WROTE THE PENTATEUCH?

Moses is generally considered the author of all five books and the book of Job. God is referred to as perfect throughout the bible.

mesquite wrote:

According to the Bible it is the reason. There may have been others, but that requires speculation. Keeping them away from the tree of life is the only reason given for their banishment.

Gen 3:22-24 (ESV)
[22]Then the Lord God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of us in knowing good and evil. "

[23]therefore the Lord God sent him out from the garden of Eden to work the ground from which he was taken.

[24]He drove out the man, and at the east of the garden of Eden he placed the cherubim and a flaming sword that turned every way to guard the way to the tree of life.

If banishing them from the Garden was sufficient, why the cherubs?