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More from the lunatic fringe

 
 
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 08:45 am
Saddam given a cruel justice

By ROBERT FISK
THE INDEPENDENT

The lynching of Saddam Hussein -- for that is what we are talking about -- will turn out to be one of the determining moments in the whole shameful crusade upon which the West embarked in 2003. Only the president-governor George Bush and Lord Blair of Kut al-Amara could have devised a militia administration in Iraq so murderous and so immoral that the most ruthless mass murderer in the Middle East could end his days on the gallows as a figure of nobility, scalding his hooded killers for their lack of manhood and -- in his last seconds -- reminding the thug who told him to "go to hell" that the hell was now Iraq.

"Nothing in his life became him like the leaving it," Malcolm reported of the execution of the treacherous Thane of Cawdor in Macbeth. Or, as a good friend of mine in Ballymena said to me on the phone a few hours later, "The whole bloody thing was obscene." Quite so.

Of course, Saddam gave his victims no trial; his enemies had no opportunity to hear the evidence against them; they were mown down into mass graves, not handed a black scarf to prevent the hangman's noose from burning their neck as it broke their spine. Justice was "done," even if a trifle cruelly. But this is not the point. Regime change was done in our name and Saddam's execution was a direct result of our crusade for a "new" Middle East. To watch a uniformed U.S. general wheedling and whining at a news conference that his men were very courteous to Saddam until the very moment of handover to Muqtada al-Sadr's killers could only be appreciated with the blackest of humor.

Note how the best "our" Iraqi governments officials could do by way of reply was to order an "inquiry" to find out how mobile phones were taken into the execution room -- not to identify the creatures who bawled abuse at Saddam in his last moments. How very Blairite of the al-Maliki government to search for the snitches rather than the criminals who abused their power. And somehow, they got away with it; acres of agency copy from the Green Zone reporters were expended on the Iraqi government's consternation, as if al-Maliki did not know what had transpired in the execution chamber. His own officials were present -- and did nothing.

That's why the "official" videotape of the hanging was silent -- and discreetly faded out -- before Saddam was abused. It was cut at this point, not for reasons of good taste but because that democratically elected Iraqi government knew all too well what the world would make of the terrible seconds that followed. Like the lies of Bush and Prime Minister Tony Blair, butchery was supposed to have been presented as a solemn judicial execution.

Worst of all, perhaps, is that the hanging of Saddam mimicked, in ghostly, miniature form, the manner of his own regime's bestial executions.

Saddam's own hangman at Abu Ghraib, a certain Abu Widad, would also taunt his victims before pulling the trap door lever, a last cruelty before extinction. Is this where Saddam's hangmen learned their job? And just who exactly were those leather-jacketed hangmen last week, by the way? No one, it seemed, bothered to ask this salient question. Who chose them? Al-Maliki's militia chums? Or the Americans who managed the whole roadshow from the start, who so organized Saddam's trial that he was never allowed to reveal details of his friendly relations with three U.S. administrations and thus took the secrets of the murderous, decade-long Baghdad-Washington military alliance to his grave?

I would not ask this question were it not for the sense of profound shock I experienced when touring the Abu Ghraib prison after "Iraq's liberation" and meeting the U.S.-appointed senior Iraqi medical officer at the jail. When his minders were distracted, he admitted to me he had also been the senior "medical officer" at Abu Ghraib when Saddam's prisoners were tortured to death there. No wonder our enemies-become-friends are turning into our enemies again.

It's not about the wickedness of the hanged man. Unlike the Thane of Cawdor, Saddam did not "set forth a deep repentance" on the scaffold. We merely shamed ourselves in an utterly predictable way. Either you support the death penalty -- whatever the nastiness or innocence of the condemned. Or you don't.

______________________________________________________

Imagine my surprise to find out Fisk would be sympathetic towards the death of the Butcher of Baghdad? He calls it cruel and uses all the good buzzwords like "lynching" and "crusade" to rally all like-minded fools into feeling the same way.

I would say Fisk should be ashamed of this silly diatribe, but you can't change the mans nature.
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Type: Discussion • Score: 0 • Views: 1,534 • Replies: 36
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Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 08:53 am
the whole thing shows that there are no good guys.... just a power shift from time to time among bad guys.....you can choose to lie in **** with them or recognize all these "men of power" for what they are powe and weqlth merchants who care only fo themselves.

I think you actually believe that in the eyes of Bin Laden, bush, Hussein, blair, or any other person of power you matter even in the slightest McGentrix. Your beloved president cares about the life of an Al Queda insurgent exactly as much as he cares about yours. Not a f*cking bit.

In that respect we have found common ground.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 09:08 am
Re: More from the lunatic fringe
McGentrix wrote:
...
Imagine my surprise to find out Fisk would be sympathetic towards the death of the Butcher of Baghdad? He calls it cruel and uses all the good buzzwords like "lynching" and "crusade" to rally all like-minded fools into feeling the same way.

I would say Fisk should be ashamed of this silly diatribe, but you can't change the mans nature.
Its your comprehension skills that are lacking. Fisk illustrates very well the utter shambles that the US has created in Iraq. Through their own incompetence the US and the puppet regime they installed have made a martyr and noble resistance hero out of the one man in Iraq who should have been universally reviled. Robert Fisk has won numerous prizes for his journalism. His book The Great War for Civilisation is well worth reading.
0 Replies
 
LoneStarMadam
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 09:28 am
Robert Fisk? ROTFLMAO He's an excuse for a know anything
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 09:49 am
LoneStarMadam wrote:
Robert Fisk? ROTFLMAO He's an excuse for a know anything
what you think about Fisk matters for nothing http://www.robert-fisk.com/introduction_robert_fisk.htm
0 Replies
 
blueflame1
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 09:59 am
Former Reagan aide compares Bush to Hitler

RAW STORY
Published: Tuesday January 9, 2007

An economist who once served as President Reagan's Assistant Secretary of the Treasury compares President George W. Bush to Adolf Hitler in a column at the libertarian website Anti-war.com.

"Bush is like Hitler," Paul Craig Roberts writes in a column entitled The Surge: Political Cover or Escalation?. "He blames defeats on his military commanders, not on his own insane policy."

"Like Hitler, he protects himself from reality with delusion," Roberts continues. "In his last hours, Hitler was ordering non-existent German armies to drive the Russians from Berlin."

According to his Wikipedia entry, Roberts is "considered a Reagan conservative."

Excerpts from column:
http://www.rawstory.com/news/2007/Former_Reagan_aide_compares_Bush_to_0109.html
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 10:18 am
LoneStarMadam wrote:
Robert Fisk? ROTFLMAO He's an excuse for a know anything

As opposed to know nothings from Texas?
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 10:23 am
DrewDad wrote:
LoneStarMadam wrote:
Robert Fisk? ROTFLMAO He's an excuse for a know anything

As opposed to know nothings from Texas?


somewhere in texas are regular people who mind their own and live and let live...<sigh>edgar imediately comes to mind along with shewolfn..
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 10:25 am
LoneStarMadam wrote:
Robert Fisk? ROTFLMAO He's an excuse for a know anything


I'm sure. you beat him with your knowledge, academic credentials and intellect.
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 10:33 am
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:
DrewDad wrote:
LoneStarMadam wrote:
Robert Fisk? ROTFLMAO He's an excuse for a know anything

As opposed to know nothings from Texas?


somewhere in texas are regular people who mind their own and live and let live...<sigh>edgar imediately comes to mind along with shewolfn..

I think I've been insulted....
0 Replies
 
blueflame1
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 10:39 am
More from the lunatic fringe, Oliver North says Bush plan 'eerily like Vietnam escalation'

RAW STORY
Published: Tuesday January 9, 2007

Appearing on The O'Reilly Factor, retired Lt. Colonel Oliver North, who hosts Fox News Channel's War Stories, said that he doesn't support President Bush's plan to for 20,000 additional ground troops in Iraq.

In this clip, O'Reilly quips that the conservative military analyst, best known for his key role in the Iran-Contra affair, is aligning himself with Democratic Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi when he claims that Bush's "surge" plan "sounds eerily like Lyndon Johnson's plan to save Vietnam in the 60s by gradual escalation as a way not to lose."
http://www.rawstory.com/news/2007/Oliver_North_says_Bush_plan_eerily_0109.html
0 Replies
 
blueflame1
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 10:41 am
http://www.rawstory.com/images/new/iraqhelmet.jpg
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 11:00 am
blueflame1 wrote:
More from the lunatic fringe, Oliver North says Bush plan 'eerily like Vietnam escalation'

RAW STORY
Published: Tuesday January 9, 2007

Appearing on The O'Reilly Factor, retired Lt. Colonel Oliver North, who hosts Fox News Channel's War Stories, said that he doesn't support President Bush's plan to for 20,000 additional ground troops in Iraq.

In this clip, O'Reilly quips that the conservative military analyst, best known for his key role in the Iran-Contra affair, is aligning himself with Democratic Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi when he claims that Bush's "surge" plan "sounds eerily like Lyndon Johnson's plan to save Vietnam in the 60s by gradual escalation as a way not to lose."
http://www.rawstory.com/news/2007/Oliver_North_says_Bush_plan_eerily_0109.html

"If you're not with us, you're against us."
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 12:24 pm
DrewDad wrote:
blueflame1 wrote:
More from the lunatic fringe, Oliver North says Bush plan 'eerily like Vietnam escalation'

RAW STORY
Published: Tuesday January 9, 2007

Appearing on The O'Reilly Factor, retired Lt. Colonel Oliver North, who hosts Fox News Channel's War Stories, said that he doesn't support President Bush's plan to for 20,000 additional ground troops in Iraq.

In this clip, O'Reilly quips that the conservative military analyst, best known for his key role in the Iran-Contra affair, is aligning himself with Democratic Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi when he claims that Bush's "surge" plan "sounds eerily like Lyndon Johnson's plan to save Vietnam in the 60s by gradual escalation as a way not to lose."
http://www.rawstory.com/news/2007/Oliver_North_says_Bush_plan_eerily_0109.html

"If you're not with us, you're against us."


If you want to know why we lost Vietnam talk to the hippies who were siding with the Communists in the fight. A top general with the NVC said that they were ready to give up the fight before they heard about the anti-war protests. That gave them the will to hold on. As the general said if we hold out long enough the defeat will come from the protestors at home and not from us.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 12:27 pm
Baldimo wrote:
If you want to know why we lost Vietnam talk to the hippies who were siding with the Communists in the fight.


Hippies fighting with Vietcong? Any online/offline source for that?
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 12:38 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Baldimo wrote:
If you want to know why we lost Vietnam talk to the hippies who were siding with the Communists in the fight.


Hippies fighting with Vietcong? Any online/offline source for that?


You know what I meant. Now your just being silly. They didn't want the US involved in Vietnam and wanted us to leave the poor NVC alone. Well we did and it only cost millions of Vietnamese their lives when the north invaded.

How many of those same hippies are now going against the US in the war on terror. In another thread Drewdad said we should just stay out of their lives and we wouldn't have to worry about terrorists attacking the US. Well 9/11 showed us how well that worked now didn't it.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 12:43 pm
Obviously, Baldimo, you neither lived then nor read a lot about the anti-Vietnam protesters.
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 12:50 pm
Baldimo wrote:
DrewDad wrote:
blueflame1 wrote:
More from the lunatic fringe, Oliver North says Bush plan 'eerily like Vietnam escalation'

RAW STORY
Published: Tuesday January 9, 2007

Appearing on The O'Reilly Factor, retired Lt. Colonel Oliver North, who hosts Fox News Channel's War Stories, said that he doesn't support President Bush's plan to for 20,000 additional ground troops in Iraq.

In this clip, O'Reilly quips that the conservative military analyst, best known for his key role in the Iran-Contra affair, is aligning himself with Democratic Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi when he claims that Bush's "surge" plan "sounds eerily like Lyndon Johnson's plan to save Vietnam in the 60s by gradual escalation as a way not to lose."
http://www.rawstory.com/news/2007/Oliver_North_says_Bush_plan_eerily_0109.html

"If you're not with us, you're against us."


If you want to know why we lost Vietnam talk to the hippies who were siding with the Communists in the fight. A top general with the NVC said that they were ready to give up the fight before they heard about the anti-war protests. That gave them the will to hold on. As the general said if we hold out long enough the defeat will come from the protestors at home and not from us.


of all the dumbass **** that's about the dumbest that's been posted here...
I can't even think of a wise ass remark for it....
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 01:43 pm
Baldimo wrote:
How many of those same hippies are now going against the US in the war on terror. In another thread Drewdad said we should just stay out of their lives and we wouldn't have to worry about terrorists attacking the US. Well 9/11 showed us how well that worked now didn't it.


9/11 showed us the consequences of not staying out of their lives.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jan, 2007 02:27 pm
Damn that hippie Walter Cronkite.
0 Replies
 
 

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