Any serious Christians left?

Arella Mae wrote:

snood wrote:
Why insinuate or hint about it at all - why not just leave it be?

Why? I was hoping a certain person might remember what they had said and corrected a few misstated comments, but I guess that won't happen. Will I post the email? No way. Never had the slightest intention of doing so. Just reminding someone of what they had said.

Arella Mae wrote:

.... But I know one thing, I'm sick and tired of the nasty little namecalling that goes on with a particular person more than others.

So tell y'all what, y'all clean your front porches and I'll clean mine. Y'all stay off my porch and I'll stay off yours. :wink: But as I have been told quite often, if I know of direct evidence proving something said is incorrect or in direct opposition to something stated earlier, I am going to point it out.

And I told snood that I thought you'd take the high road, Arella, guess I was wrong. I've read everything here and unless I missed something, I don't see where Lash (or anyone else) antagonized you in any way. It amazes me that someone who goes around defining true Christianity for others would start a sparring match just to do so. You see, I have a much different definition of true Christian than you do. I was hoping that my poke would get you to look at your own involvement in fanning the fires - guess not. You're sick and tired of it? Then why instigate it?

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maporsche wrote:

Arella Mae wrote:
maporsche wrote:
Arella Mae wrote:
I want to make one thing perfectly clear to everyone. I, in no way, feel I am superior to anyone for any reason.

I have a faith and belief in God, yes. But that hardly qualifies me for any superiority status. I will not compromise my beliefs. But I know one thing, I'm sick and tired of the nasty little namecalling that goes on with a particular person more than others.

So tell y'all what, y'all clean your front porches and I'll clean mine. Y'all stay off my porch and I'll stay off yours. :wink: But as I have been told quite often, if I know of direct evidence proving something said is incorrect or in direct opposition to something stated earlier, I am going to point it out.

Well, I need to point out that the claim that you know the only way to get to heaven and that everyone who doesn't follow your beliefs will burn in hell is one heck of a superior statement. While you may not feel superior, I think deep down you believe you are, or you have faith that you are.

I just love it when I tell people how I really feel and they turn around and tell me it's not what I feel NOT! That is what the Bible says (believing in Jesus Christ). I didn't make up the rules. God did. You get to decide what you want to do just like anyone else so I'd say that puts us on an even plane, wouldn't you?

You made the choice to believe in god. You then made the choice to believe in Christ as the son of god. You then made the choice to believe in your particular beliefs about the bible. You then made the choice to believe that your interpretation of the bible is the correct one.

You've made several choices out of the possibility of hundreds. You think god made the rules, but you've chosen to follow THAT god.

You believe your choice is superior or you would have made a different one. Please show me how I'm wrong here.

Isn't the correct choice superior to the incorrect choice? You believe that you've made the correct choice, which means that the incorrect choice is inferior.

I'm sick of Christians and really all other religions trying to lie about their beliefs on superiority to others.

Does anyone else agree with me regarding this statement, or am I completely off base?

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maporsche wrote:

maporsche wrote:
Arella Mae wrote:
maporsche wrote:
Arella Mae wrote:
I want to make one thing perfectly clear to everyone. I, in no way, feel I am superior to anyone for any reason.

I have a faith and belief in God, yes. But that hardly qualifies me for any superiority status. I will not compromise my beliefs. But I know one thing, I'm sick and tired of the nasty little namecalling that goes on with a particular person more than others.

So tell y'all what, y'all clean your front porches and I'll clean mine. Y'all stay off my porch and I'll stay off yours. :wink: But as I have been told quite often, if I know of direct evidence proving something said is incorrect or in direct opposition to something stated earlier, I am going to point it out.

Well, I need to point out that the claim that you know the only way to get to heaven and that everyone who doesn't follow your beliefs will burn in hell is one heck of a superior statement. While you may not feel superior, I think deep down you believe you are, or you have faith that you are.

I just love it when I tell people how I really feel and they turn around and tell me it's not what I feel NOT! That is what the Bible says (believing in Jesus Christ). I didn't make up the rules. God did. You get to decide what you want to do just like anyone else so I'd say that puts us on an even plane, wouldn't you?

You made the choice to believe in god. You then made the choice to believe in Christ as the son of god. You then made the choice to believe in your particular beliefs about the bible. You then made the choice to believe that your interpretation of the bible is the correct one.

You've made several choices out of the possibility of hundreds. You think god made the rules, but you've chosen to follow THAT god.

You believe your choice is superior or you would have made a different one. Please show me how I'm wrong here.

Isn't the correct choice superior to the incorrect choice? You believe that you've made the correct choice, which means that the incorrect choice is inferior.

I'm sick of Christians and really all other religions trying to lie about their beliefs on superiority to others.

Does anyone else agree with me regarding this statement, or am I completely off base?

How is this different from you believing that your choice is superior?

You believe that of all the choices to be made, you have made the best (superior) choice, correct?

So 'deep down', do you believe that you are superior? (same question you asked Momma Angel)

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Irrelevant, red Herring, and implicational straw man, rl - nothing was said to indicate maporsche claimed to have made a superior choice personally, or a choice of any sort, for that matter. What maporsche may or may not believe, may or may not perceive to be superior, is not at issue; the matter at discussion is A M's practice, and by extension the practice typical of ther demographic to which she belongs refererence the assertion of superior position on the basis of "knowing and understanding god's word and will as revealed in the bible".

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Can I ask you guys something?

Are there Christians you know who are "serious", like the thread title says, but whose views don't rub you wrong?

Besides Neo, of course.

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I think that's a fair question, snood, but mebbe not one with an easy answer. There are lotsa "Serious Christians", I s'pose, or at least lotsa Christians that take themselves completely seriously. I wouldn't say their views, per se, "rub me wrong", but rather that I object to the manner in which many express and promote those views; its pretty uncommon for a self-professed "Serious Christian", most particularly those of evangelical/fundamentalist bent, to discuss as opposed to proselytize Christianity. I'd say I take issue not with Christians as a homologous group, but more specifically and in distinct particular I take issue with the fundies ... there's a luddite arrogance there I find most irritatingly presumptive and hypocritical.

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There is a man on my street. He is extremely religious, to the point where he conducts bible classes in his home. Whenever I talk to him, we usually discuss computers, an interest of which we both have in common.

I have no problem with him.

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JPB wrote:

Arella Mae wrote:
snood wrote:
Why insinuate or hint about it at all - why not just leave it be?

Why? I was hoping a certain person might remember what they had said and corrected a few misstated comments, but I guess that won't happen. Will I post the email? No way. Never had the slightest intention of doing so. Just reminding someone of what they had said.

Arella Mae wrote:
.... But I know one thing, I'm sick and tired of the nasty little namecalling that goes on with a particular person more than others.

So tell y'all what, y'all clean your front porches and I'll clean mine. Y'all stay off my porch and I'll stay off yours. :wink: But as I have been told quite often, if I know of direct evidence proving something said is incorrect or in direct opposition to something stated earlier, I am going to point it out.

And I told snood that I thought you'd take the high road, Arella, guess I was wrong. I've read everything here and unless I missed something, I don't see where Lash (or anyone else) antagonized you in any way. It amazes me that someone who goes around defining true Christianity for others would start a sparring match just to do so. You see, I have a much different definition of true Christian than you do. I was hoping that my poke would get you to look at your own involvement in fanning the fires - guess not. You're sick and tired of it? Then why instigate it?

That particular person did not instigate anything with me directly, no. Some statements were made about a situation that I knew to be let's say, a little less than the whole truth, and it hit a nerve with me because that person rarely misses a chance to point out to me exactly how she feels about me. Now, I should have taken the high road and never said a single thing but in this instance I didn't. I was the one this time pointing out that something someone had said was "less than the whole truth". I do apologize for instigating anything. I have no excuse for that.

I'm pretty tired of being jabbed at for "my Christianity" and called a liar, hypocrite, etc., and then someone turns right around and does the same thing. If it's okay to do it because that person is not a Christian then someone should let me know so I can get the rules straight. When I state my beliefs, opinions, etc., they are what I believe that I should do in my life. I don't tell anyone else that they are going to hell because they don't do what I say or think. I don't call them names if they don't, etc.

Again, I do apologize for saying a thing about it. I really was wrong in doing that and won't deny I was wrong.

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Phoenix32890 wrote:

There is a man on my street. He is extremely religious, to the point where he conducts bible classes in his home. Whenever I talk to him, we usually discuss computers, an interest of which we both have in common.

I have no problem with him.

Phoenix, this is probably, in my opinion, the most enlightening thing stated on this thread yet. I do have friends that are not Christian. I know their beliefs and they know mine, but we don't talk about them. It's a live and let live thing much like I'd say you are saying in your statement.

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I think that it is a matter of respect. I may not respect his views on religion, but I respect the right for him to have them.

If the subject were ever broached by him, I would certainly tell him my views, but in a non-threatening and non-confrontive way. Hey, I can't control the world, but I can do my best to maintain peace and civility on my block!

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I have a question and I'm not sure it is totally appropriate for this thread. If it isn't please just tell me and I can start another one about it. This is my question:

So many today say things like "all roads lead to God", "it's all the same God we all pray too", etc. If this is how they really feel (for those that believe that) why would they still want to take God out of the Pledge, schools, etc.? Do you think it is honestly for only reasons of separation of church and state or do you think it is because it is widely understood it is the Christian God being spoken of?

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Quote:

So many today say things like "all roads lead to God", "it's all the same God we all pray too", etc.

Arella Mae- Yes, some people DO say that. I think that attitude is better than an exclusionary, sectarian one. But even being more inclusive, does not take in the beliefs of all the people.

Some people DON'T pray (I, for one). My moral compass does not include the concept of a god. So why would I want to see a god referred to in schools, in the courts, etc.?

Good grief. I was a kid of 15 (do the math :wink: ) when "under god" was inserted into the pledge. I remember very clearly when that happened. Although I had not yet developed a codified body of thought about religion, I felt very uncomfortable, and can remember remaining silent when the "under god" was recited in school.

If a country is a country of ALL the people, it must include EVERYONE!

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I think I might be able to relate to that feeling somewhat, Phoenix.

In grade school (2nd, 3rd, or 4th grade, can't remember (doing the math here myself Laughing

) we sang the Little Drummer Boy in a school pageant. I remember we were supposed to sing "Baby Yay-zoo" (for pronounciation). Now, I had a problem with it because I knew His name to be Jesus. I asked my mom about this and she told me when it came to that part of the song to just be silent. She told me that not everyone would feel the same way about it and I needed to respect them for that.

I wanted to tell the teacher how I felt about it but my mom told me, "No, you will only stir up trouble by disrespecting other people. It is better for the one individual to just remain silent in some circumstances than it is to get the masses stirred up." But, I felt kind of like you seemed to have. I wasn't happy about it but I did it.

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Arella Mae are you ignoring me?

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Arella Mae- As far as I know, Jesus an English name. Here is another "take" on the subject, whose followers believe that Jesus is NOT the proper name for the man whom they worship.

[quote]Yeshua is the original Hebrew proper name for Jesus of Nazareth, a Jewish Rabbi (and more) who lived from about 6 B.C.E. to 27 C.E. (A.D.) In other words, Yeshua was the name His mother called Him when shall called Him for supper.

Jesus is a mis-transliteration of the Greek mis-transliteration, Yeysu. (Some say the name Jesus probably developed from the name of the pagan god Zeus, but there is little or no evidence for this.) It is true that Emporer Constatine mistook Jesus for the Greek god Apollo, but that is another story.

It is the most proper to call Him Yeshua, since only in the Hebrew does His name have any meaning. In Hebrew Yeshua means both "Salvation," and the concatenated form of Yahoshua, the "L-RD who is Salvation." The name Jesus has no intrinsic meaning in English, except as it is known as His name in English. (Therefore, we cannot deny the name Jesus, since this name commonly identifies the Messiah to English speaking people.) [/quote]

http://www.messianic.com/articles/yeshua.htm

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maporsche wrote:

Arella Mae are you ignoring me?

Ignoring what? Your comment about how I consider myself superior to you or others because I'm a Christian? I already answered that question and you turned right around and then told me that's not what I really feel.

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Phoenix32890 wrote:

Arella Mae- As far as I know, Jesus an English name. Here is another "take" on the subject, whose followers believe that Jesus is NOT the proper name for the man whom they worship.

[quote]Yeshua is the original Hebrew proper name for Jesus of Nazareth, a Jewish Rabbi (and more) who lived from about 6 B.C.E. to 27 C.E. (A.D.) In other words, Yeshua was the name His mother called Him when shall called Him for supper.

Jesus is a mis-transliteration of the Greek mis-transliteration, Yeysu. (Some say the name Jesus probably developed from the name of the pagan god Zeus, but there is little or no evidence for this.) It is true that Emporer Constatine mistook Jesus for the Greek god Apollo, but that is another story.

It is the most proper to call Him Yeshua, since only in the Hebrew does His name have any meaning. In Hebrew Yeshua means both "Salvation," and the concatenated form of Yahoshua, the "L-RD who is Salvation." The name Jesus has no intrinsic meaning in English, except as it is known as His name in English. (Therefore, we cannot deny the name Jesus, since this name commonly identifies the Messiah to English speaking people.)

http://www.messianic.com/articles/yeshua.htm[/color][/b][/quote]

Thank you for the link Phoenix. I have been having some very interesting conversations with a person of the Jewish faith recently. He is a graduate of MIT and his knowledge base is something else. I may not agree with everything he believes but I do find his take on the history of the Bible, etc., extremely interesting and enlightening.

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Arella Mae wrote:

maporsche wrote:
Arella Mae are you ignoring me?

Ignoring what? Your comment about how I consider myself superior to you or others because I'm a Christian? I already answered that question and you turned right around and then told me that's not what I really feel.

Not just my comment on your feeling of superiority, but also the reasoning behind how I came to that conclusion.

I would like you to admit that you do indeed feel that your beliefs are superior to others because you 'know' the truth, and the truth is superior to the un-truth.

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maporsche wrote:

Arella Mae wrote:
maporsche wrote:
Arella Mae are you ignoring me?

Ignoring what? Your comment about how I consider myself superior to you or others because I'm a Christian? I already answered that question and you turned right around and then told me that's not what I really feel.

Not just my comment on your feeling of superiority, but also the reasoning behind how I came to that conclusion.

I would like you to admit that you do indeed feel that your beliefs are superior to others because you 'know' the truth, and the truth is superior to the un-truth.

Well, all I can say is this: I'm not going to lie to you and tell you I feel superior to you or anyone else when I don't. Do I tell you that you feel superior because you don't believe? Nope. Hmmm, could be because I believe this is something each individual decides for themself and that is between them and God and I have no right or reason to think either of us are superior to the other.

If you liked the Green Bay Packers and I liked the Dallas Cowboys does that make either of us superior to the other? Nope. Same thing. Your life is yours and between you and God or whoever you determine it is between. My life is mine and is between me and God. Doesn't make either of us anything other than individuals who have made a choice.

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Arella Mae wrote:

Well, all I can say is this: I'm not going to lie to you and tell you I feel superior to you or anyone else when I don't. Do I tell you that you feel superior because you don't believe? Nope. Hmmm, could be because I believe this is something each individual decides for themself and that is between them and God and I have no right or reason to think either of us are superior to the other.

I guess my point is that you must know that you position is superior to my position otherwise you would follow my position (or you would be doing yourself a disservice).

Whether you feel superior or not is irrelevant, the fact is that you know your position is superior to mine (I would argue that my position is superior to yours).

Quote:

If you liked the Green Bay Packers and I liked the Dallas Cowboys does that make either of us superior to the other? Nope. Same thing.

Very much NOT the same thing, and you know it.

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Any serious Christians left?

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