The Flood

Get outta town, NF - you really think it's BS???

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NickFun wrote:

Last night I read that if the Poles melted the w\entire Earth would be covered in water!

I know a very cool Pole. He's in no danger of melting.

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Nick Nick Bo Bick.

If the ice caps and Greenland would melt, wed have about another 160 ft more or less amsl. That would mean that only New Jersey and Florida , parts of Louisiana, Texas , some of New England and parts of theMaritmes would be underwater. As far as Bangladesh,Holland and other countries, they would also be fishing ground. The earth would be at about 83% water surface.
But wed also have antarctica and Greenland emergent as well as some of the deep northern Canadian and Russian lands

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wooow its stupid guys!
mkai, so.. the "flood" yeah well im not trying to ehm.. offend?? neone but come on a flood? and its not only the flood to me its the WHOLE effing bible. (btw, this is mi opinion, it may not be urs, so dont judge me!!) well.. this is a nice fairytale :wink: but its SO UNTRUE!! people only made the bible to help them get over their fears of dying Crying or Very sad

.. and thats the short form of it, i can write on like 243987 pgs. of it but i wont waste mi time on some gay book. GET OVR URSELVES PPL! jesus isnt real. he is fake. a PHONY. thats right-io bible preachers.
--Jennxxxooo

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are you a regular on South Park?

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ehmagawd!! ur so mean >: ( and no..

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Steve 41oo wrote:

Quote:
So you agree. Indoctrination.

yes very much so. And very effective indoctrination in the sense that few adults can throw off completely religious imprinting as a child. Presenting myth and legend to a child as fact is abuse of that child's trust. And its still child abuse even if the adult believes it to be fact.

Indoctrination of children with atheism had a long and glorious history in the Soviet Union.

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And since 1989 the Russian Orthodox Church has turned that all around?

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I heard that Noah wore very short pants. He was humiliated when one of the local girls said to him, "Nice pants Noah. Expecting a flood?"

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real life wrote:

Indoctrination of children with atheism had a long and glorious history in the Soviet Union.

I don't support that either. But just out of curiosity, what did the athiest parents say to indoctrinate their kids into athiesm? There's no burning in hell for athiests, and no punishment for thinking any other way, is there?

I do support giving kids personal opinions about what we (adults) think about the world (it's unavoidable), and explaining to them as they grow older that they have choices.

Religious parents will certainly expose their kids to religion, even if they don't indocrtinate them, just as non-religious people will expose their kids to a non-religious view of things. It's inevitible that the environment a child grows up in will be partial in some way. It's unavoidable, and doesn't bother me very much.

As noted above, I'm not sure what threats an athiest might use to get a child to think like an athiest, but the christian threat of burning in hell forever if you don't believe what you're told (purely on faith), is certainly an effective threat.

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My daughter chose to go to Sunday School with some friends of hers when she was 8. It lasted till she was about 10, at which point her Sunday School Teacher told her she would go to heaven and I would be going to hell because I was a non-believer. This upset my daughter greatly so I asked her teacher to stop telling her that. She refused so I removed her from that influence. Had it been a different church, or a different teacher, she may still be going to church.

I then took her to three other churches to see if she liked any of them, but since she didn't have any friends there, and I refused to go, she was out of luck.

So, there's an example of an aethiest providing a religious opportunity to someone with no interest in the outcome (spiritually, I mean). Why this teacher couldn't have toned down her message of doom I have no idea. Stupid on her part.

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Mame wrote:

My daughter chose to go to Sunday School with some friends of hers when she was 8. It lasted till she was about 10, at which point her Sunday School Teacher told her she would go to heaven and I would be going to hell because I was a non-believer. This upset my daughter greatly so I asked her teacher to stop telling her that. She refused so I removed her from that influence. Had it been a different church, or a different teacher, she may still be going to church.

I then took her to three other churches to see if she liked any of them, but since she didn't have any friends there, and I refused to go, she was out of luck.

So, there's an example of an aethiest providing a religious opportunity to someone with no interest in the outcome (spiritually, I mean). Why this teacher couldn't have toned down her message of doom I have no idea. Stupid on her part.

What a horrible story....typical...but still horrible.

I think that the message "Your going to heaven, but your mom is going to hell" would have been unavoidable at some point however. I mean the basic fundamental belief of that religion is that unless you're saved through Christ, you're hell-bound. There really is no other option for those who beleive in that myth.

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Mame wrote:

So, there's an example of an aethiest providing a religious opportunity to someone with no interest in the outcome (spiritually, I mean). Why this teacher couldn't have toned down her message of doom I have no idea. Stupid on her part.

(I'm sure you probably already know this, but) She probably thought she was helping your daughter by making her believe.

Dawkins would say that indoctrination is a meme which flows from generation to generation. It happens to be a very powerful meme because it uses basic and absolute elements such as fear and faith to embed itself.

Fear of physical pain is a substantial threat, especially if it's supposed to be eternal. It's the motivator.

Faith is a way to turn off the ability of the victim (sorry, couldn't think of a better word) to question the information without fear of reprisal. It's the lock.

Very strong motivation to believe, very strong lock to prevent escape.

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rosborne979 wrote:

Mame wrote:
So, there's an example of an aethiest providing a religious opportunity to someone with no interest in the outcome (spiritually, I mean). Why this teacher couldn't have toned down her message of doom I have no idea. Stupid on her part.

(I'm sure you probably already know this, but) She probably thought she was helping your daughter by making her believe.

Dawkins would say that indoctrination is a meme which flows from generation to generation. It happens to be a very powerful meme because it uses basic and absolute elements such as fear and faith to embed itself.

Fear of physical pain is a substantial threat, especially if it's supposed to be eternal. It's the motivator.

Faith is a way to turn off the ability of the victim (sorry, couldn't think of a better word) to question the information without fear of reprisal. It's the lock.

Very strong motivation to believe, very strong lock to prevent escape.

Belief through fear........wow, what a great religion.

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Not all faiths are fear-based, though, are they? I know of a spiritualist church and a Unitarian one who preach through love. In either of those churches, they would have stressed the rewards a believer would get, not the punishment end of things.

There's also a way to talk to children about these sorts of things without frightening them half to death. It wasn't HER eventual fate they were talking about; it was mine, and sadly, she has no influence over me, so they needn't have put it so baldly.

In light of all that, I thought it was very sort-sighted of the teacher.

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I have to disagree with maporsche's earlier comment about the statement of hell being unavoidable. It is not only avoidable, but preferrable. All of the instances of the word hell in the Bible are either corruptions, such as the introduction of Hades and Tartarus in the New Testament due to the influence of the Greeks, symbolism that has been taken overboard by the fundamentalists, such as the gnashing of teeth, or translation errors, such as the pit of fire outside Jerusalem called Gehenna that is called Hell many times over in the Bible. If you correct the translation errors, remove the Greek mythology, and correctly interpret the symbolism then there is nothing left of the idea of hell as a place of eternal punishment. I've discussed many of the verses relating to hell and how they were poorly translated, or corrupted, in the thread "For Those That Are Christians."

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megamanXplosion wrote:

I have to disagree with maporsche's earlier comment about the statement of hell being unavoidable. It is not only avoidable, but preferrable. All of the instances of the word hell in the Bible are either corruptions, such as the introduction of Hades and Tartarus in the New Testament due to the influence of the Greeks, symbolism that has been taken overboard by the fundamentalists, such as the gnashing of teeth, or translation errors, such as the pit of fire outside Jerusalem called Gehenna that is called Hell many times over in the Bible. If you correct the translation errors, remove the Greek mythology, and correctly interpret the symbolism then there is nothing left of the idea of hell as a place of eternal punishment. I've discussed many of the verses relating to hell and how they were poorly translated, or corrupted, in the thread "For Those That Are Christians."

I guess this signifies part of my problem with the Theory of Christianity. The Bible is supposed to be some perfect book to explain exactly what god wants us to do, how he wants us to live our lives, what we need to do to be saved, etc. If the book was so damn perfect, then why the hell are the 50,000 different ways to interpret it? A perfect book would tell you exactly what needs to be done. I hear all the time that 80% of America is Christian, but really no more than 2-3% can agree on the same issues with each other. This group believes in hell, this one doesn't, this one doesn't know, etc.

How can a religion that is supposed to have my entire faith and devotion not be more clear with the only book that means anything.

I've heard time and time again how the Bible is a perfect book, how there are no inconsitencies, how the prophecies have come true, but really, the bible is a shitty book if you're looking for the ultimate truth or guidence in this life.

I'm sick of American being called a Christian nation, we are a nation of hundreds of religions (dozens of Christian type religions even).

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Mame wrote:

My daughter chose to go to Sunday School with some friends of hers when she was 8. It lasted till she was about 10, at which point her Sunday School Teacher told her she would go to heaven and I would be going to hell because I was a non-believer. This upset my daughter greatly so I asked her teacher to stop telling her that. She refused so I removed her from that influence. Had it been a different church, or a different teacher, she may still be going to church.

I then took her to three other churches to see if she liked any of them, but since she didn't have any friends there, and I refused to go, she was out of luck.

So, there's an example of an aethiest providing a religious opportunity to someone with no interest in the outcome (spiritually, I mean). Why this teacher couldn't have toned down her message of doom I have no idea. Stupid on her part.

Sad story. I have a friend who is a catholic and went to a lutheran school at the time, when she was in 2nd grade her teacher said she was going to hell b/c she was a catholic. Even in the same religion their is some horror stories.

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I had an uncle Stashu who was a geologist and a college prof. He was my favorite uncle cause he took me prospecting in the hills of new Mexico. One of my friends < who was a NON_CATHOLIC, told me that all Catholics will go to hell because we worship Stashus. This indeed had me seriously vexed. Sure I loved my Uncle Stash, but nobody really worshipped him. Of this I was certain. So , next time I was with Uncle Stash I told him the story of what my friend said. He told me that all non Catholics beleived that stashus were evil and unGodly. When I got ho,me and saw my friend, I kicked the crap out of him . So much for the debate whether Catholics or Non Catholics had the principle support of Jesus.

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When did you figure it out, FM?

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