The United States was not founded as a Christian nation

With logic like that, if you were to extended it just a couple more steps, a person could be saying only christians have these rights.

The founding fathers were deists

hephzibah wrote:

Chai Tea wrote:

maybe I'm dense hep, but where does it specifically mention chistian as opposed to other faiths?

You are right Chai. Because of the teachings through-out the last 17 years that I've submitted to it was very easy to fall into the belief that they must have been talking about the "Creator" that christianity is suppose to promote. Though it does not specifically say it. However I still stand that it was founded on a belief in a "Creator" of some sort that has given us certain "unalienable rights" that were being violated therefore it became the job of the government to protect those rights, regardless of their personal status within a "religion". And I personally still believe that "Creator" is the God that christianity is suppose to promote.

Well if they state that there is a Creator which gives you those rights, then it means that if there is no Creator then you don't have those rights.

Well, don't take this personally (because I know you're not the only person who thinks like this), but that is quite a reach.

With logic like that, if you were to extended it just a couple more steps, a person could be saying only christians have these rights.

It says what it says, not what you read into it.

Someone clever enough could start at point A and end up with a statement that pink elephants run the NRA, or AMA for that matter.

hephzibah wrote:

And I personally still believe that "Creator" is the God that christianity is suppose to promote.

The last time that we checked, The Creator created more than Christians.

Ephesians 4:6 One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.

That may be true.
But it is also true that MOST of the founder's believed in GOD.
So America may not have been founded as a CHRISTIAN nation, but it was founded as a nation with a GOD.

Actually the more intelligent the person, the more likely they will come to the realisation that there is a Creator.

'Of 43 studies carried out since 1927 on the relationship between religious belief and one's intelligence and/or educational level, all but four found an inverse connection. This is, the higher one's intelligence or education level the less one is likely to be religious or to hold "beliefs" of any kind.'

However I still stand that it was founded on a belief in a "Creator" of some sort that has given us certain "unalienable rights" that were being violated...

hephzibah wrote:

However I still stand that it was founded on a belief in a "Creator" of some sort that has given us certain "unalienable rights" that were being violated...

By whom? The British government? I think thats a charge you will have a great deal of difficulty proving...however I'm no student of the American wars of Independence...fire away tell me what inalienable rights were violated...I can only think of one and that was the rebels wish not to pay tax to London.

Mindonfire wrote:

Actually the more intelligent the person, the more likely they will come to the realisation that there is a Creator.

In a paper yet to be published Elizabeth Cornwell and Michael Stirrat of 1074 Fellows of the Royal Society...(the most prestigious scientific body probably in the world...(well it was the first)) only 3.3% agreed strongly with the statement that a personal god exists. The overwhelming majority of FRS are atheists as are member of the US Academicians.

Michael Shermer and Frank Sulloway in How we Believe describes a large survey of randomly selected Americans. They found religiousity to be negatively correlated to education (more highly educated are less likely to be religious).

Regarding IQ and religion, Paul Bell in Mensa Magazine concluded

Quote:

'Of 43 studies carried out since 1927 on the relationship between religious belief and one's intelligence and/or educational level, all but four found an inverse connection. This is, the higher one's intelligence or education level the less one is likely to be religious or to hold "beliefs" of any kind.'

Of course there are some very intelligent religious people, but the trend is clear.

Mindonfire wrote:

Actually the more intelligent the person, the more likely they will come to the realisation that there is a Creator.

In a paper yet to be published Elizabeth Cornwell and Michael Stirrat of 1074 Fellows of the Royal Society...(the most prestigious scientific body probably in the world...(well it was the first)) only 3.3% agreed strongly with the statement that a personal god exists. The overwhelming majority of FRS are atheists as are member of the US Academicians.

Michael Shermer and Frank Sulloway in How we Believe describes a large survey of randomly selected Americans. They found religiousity to be negatively correlated to education (more highly educated are less likely to be religious).

Regarding IQ and religion, Paul Bell in Mensa Magazine concluded

Quote:

'Of 43 studies carried out since 1927 on the relationship between religious belief and one's intelligence and/or educational level, all but four found an inverse connection. This is, the higher one's intelligence or education level the less one is likely to be religious or to hold "beliefs" of any kind.'

Of course there are some very intelligent religious people, but the trend is clear.

Chai Tea wrote:

maybe I'm dense hep, but where does it specifically mention chistian as opposed to other faiths?

You are right Chai. Because of the teachings through-out the last 17 years that I've submitted to it was very easy to fall into the belief that they must have been talking about the "Creator" that christianity is suppose to promote. Though it does not specifically say it. However I still stand that it was founded on a belief in a "Creator" of some sort that has given us certain "unalienable rights" that were being violated therefore it became the job of the government to protect those rights, regardless of their personal status within a "religion". And I personally still believe that "Creator" is the God that christianity is suppose to promote.

Treaty with Tripoli draftedn 1796 under George Washington and signed by John Adams in 1797:

Quote:

As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion;

Steve 41oo wrote:

Mindonfire wrote:

Actually the more intelligent the person, the more likely they will come to the realisation that there is a Creator.

In a paper yet to be published Elizabeth Cornwell and Michael Stirrat of 1074 Fellows of the Royal Society...(the most prestigious scientific body probably in the world...(well it was the first)) only 3.3% agreed strongly with the statement that a personal god exists. The overwhelming majority of FRS are atheists as are member of the US Academicians.

Michael Shermer and Frank Sulloway in How we Believe describes a large survey of randomly selected Americans. They found religiousity to be negatively correlated to education (more highly educated are less likely to be religious).

Regarding IQ and religion, Paul Bell in Mensa Magazine concluded

Quote:

'Of 43 studies carried out since 1927 on the relationship between religious belief and one's intelligence and/or educational level, all but four found an inverse connection. This is, the higher one's intelligence or education level the less one is likely to be religious or to hold "beliefs" of any kind.'

Of course there are some very intelligent religious people, but the trend is clear.

Ah! yes the most presitgious scientific body in the world and yet they are still unable to explain the Bible. They are still unable to figure out the rudiments of time. They are still unable to unlock the secrets of the number One. Can they explain how and why a miracle occurs? LOL You all are still unable to add, subtract and divide correctly. They are not as intelligent as they think themselves to be.


Romans 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

Ah! yes the most presitgious scientific body in the world and yet they are still unable to explain the Bible

Alright rosborne. The treaty signed specifically says:

"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..."

The government OF the nation, not the nation itself. So then please explain to me why it is they even mentioned any of the following if it was not of any importance to anyone:

Mindonfire wrote:

Ah! yes the most presitgious scientific body in the world and yet they are still unable to explain the Bible

unable to explain?

not so much.

you simply don't care for what historians have to say about the book.

Mindonfire wrote:

Steve 41oo wrote:

Mindonfire wrote:

Actually the more intelligent the person, the more likely they will come to the realisation that there is a Creator.

In a paper yet to be published Elizabeth Cornwell and Michael Stirrat of 1074 Fellows of the Royal Society...(the most prestigious scientific body probably in the world...(well it was the first)) only 3.3% agreed strongly with the statement that a personal god exists. The overwhelming majority of FRS are atheists as are member of the US Academicians.

Michael Shermer and Frank Sulloway in How we Believe describes a large survey of randomly selected Americans. They found religiousity to be negatively correlated to education (more highly educated are less likely to be religious).

Regarding IQ and religion, Paul Bell in Mensa Magazine concluded

Quote:

'Of 43 studies carried out since 1927 on the relationship between religious belief and one's intelligence and/or educational level, all but four found an inverse connection. This is, the higher one's intelligence or education level the less one is likely to be religious or to hold "beliefs" of any kind.'

Of course there are some very intelligent religious people, but the trend is clear.

Ah! yes the most presitgious scientific body in the world and yet they are still unable to explain the Bible. They are still unable to figure out the rudiments of time. They are still unable to unlock the secrets of the number One. Can they explain how and why a miracle occurs? LOL You all are still unable to add, subtract and divide correctly. They are not as intelligent as they think themselves to be.


Romans 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

Did I call that or what!? Yes!

hephzibah wrote:

Alright rosborne. The treaty signed specifically says:

"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..."

The government OF the nation, not the nation itself. So then please explain to me why it is they even mentioned any of the following if it was not of any importance to anyone:

Because it is important. It just doesn't say anything about Christianity. It just says "by their creator". Creator could easilty be deific, and it probably is.