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Martha Stewart: Has she been unfairly targeted...

 
 
Phoenix32890
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 07:47 am
Great way to put it, dlowan. There is a perverse delight that some people get when the rich and famous are toppled. And when she is a woman...............................

http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7641
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dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 07:55 am
Yes - it always has some of the satisfaction found in pure tragedy - the hubris, the fatal flaw....

We are in the midst of a similar case over here. Rene Rivkin, a larger than life, very theatrical, financial adviser - who has been very successful and well exposed in the media - was recently convicted of insider trading worth about $300.

He insists that he has been targeted because of his fame - perhaps to get the message across to the financial world, perhaps because of petty jealousy - I am not sure what his belief about this is - but it is an interesting situation.
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 07:58 am
Could it also be that she broke the law and now is being tried for it? And, that because she is a celebrity, the MEDIA is over hyping it, not the government?
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dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 08:01 am
McGentrix - I can only respond for me - it was the media/gossip fest that I spoke of.
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cavfancier
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 08:18 am
I think that if Martha had just fessed up at the time of the original investigation, she would have been better off. Something to the tune of : "Hey, somebody told me to sell, I'm no idiot, I'm gonna sell. Other than that, I know nothing."
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 08:30 am
McGentrix: Martha Stewart is currently charged with obstruction of justice, based on a contention that she lied to Federal investigators. Those investigators were trying to come up with evidence of securities fraud on her part ("insider trading") but failed to do so; she lied to no grand jury because none was ever empaneled, and she was not hailed before a court, so it is not a case of perjury. The entire exercise has a bad odor-even if convicted, this is really a small time affair. The Securities industry looks very bad these days, and by extension, so does the Securities and Exchange Commission. It appears that the SEC has not been doing its job, because of scandals such as Enron and it's accounting firm. The Feds recently settled with a large group of brokerage houses and accounting firms who would otherwise have been indicted for securities fraud and criminal accounting practices. The settlement was for hundreds of millions of dollars; however, brokerage houses who have not violated securities regulations, and accounting firms which have kept honest and open books, playing by the rules, contend that these firms cost investors at least billions of dollars, and possibly tens of billions of dollars. They are justifiably indignant that the bad apples smear the reputations of all securities traders and their accounting partners, and that the SEC appears weak in their oversight responsibilities, and flaccid in enforcement, accepting a settlement for a fraction of what the illegal activities have cost the public. I tend to see this as a case of the Feds trying to burnish their law-enforcement image, and picking on Miss Stewart precisely because she has a high public profile, but no real clout either financially or politcally.
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cavfancier
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 08:34 am
I am guessing she will get off with just a fine, and it does seem to me now that she is being used as an example. The reason they wont go after the Enron people is simply that it would be too problematic, so if they are picking on Martha instead, it does indeed seem they are not doing their jobs.
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blueveinedthrobber
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 08:35 am
Hello, I'm Martha Stewart. On todays' show, I'll be showing you how I transformed this dull, drab, gray 6 by 12 foot cell into an explosion of color with this cunning decoupage wall treatment that I made using nothing but cafeteria trays and sanitary napkins......
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cavfancier
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 08:37 am
Just to add to BPB's post: "Where's my staff! You don't really think I can do this myself, do you?"
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 08:58 am
Maintaining icon status while alive is a difficult prospect. The feds want to send a message that perceived lies will not be tolerated; only the white house is allowed. c.i.
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 09:09 am
Setanta wrote:
McGentrix: Martha Stewart is currently charged with obstruction of justice, based on a contention that she lied to Federal investigators. Those investigators were trying to come up with evidence of securities fraud on her part ("insider trading") but failed to do so; she lied to no grand jury because none was ever empaneled, and she was not hailed before a court, so it is not a case of perjury. The entire exercise has a bad odor-even if convicted, this is really a small time affair. The Securities industry looks very bad these days, and by extension, so does the Securities and Exchange Commission. It appears that the SEC has not been doing its job, because of scandals such as Enron and it's accounting firm. The Feds recently settled with a large group of brokerage houses and accounting firms who would otherwise have been indicted for securities fraud and criminal accounting practices. The settlement was for hundreds of millions of dollars; however, brokerage houses who have not violated securities regulations, and accounting firms which have kept honest and open books, playing by the rules, contend that these firms cost investors at least billions of dollars, and possibly tens of billions of dollars. They are justifiably indignant that the bad apples smear the reputations of all securities traders and their accounting partners, and that the SEC appears weak in their oversight responsibilities, and flaccid in enforcement, accepting a settlement for a fraction of what the illegal activities have cost the public. I tend to see this as a case of the Feds trying to burnish their law-enforcement image, and picking on Miss Stewart precisely because she has a high public profile, but no real clout either financially or politcally.


See indictment here

Quote:
JUNE 4--Martha Stewart was named today in a nine-count indictment charging her with obstruction of justice and lying to federal investigators in connection with a government probe of her alleged insider trading of ImClone stock. The indictment, which you'll find below, alleges that Stewart, 61, lied to federal investigators when questioned about the circumstances of her December 2001 stock sale, which came just before ImClone's share price collapsed (a move that saved the multimillionaire a whopping $45,000). Peter Bacanovic, Stewart's former Merrill Lynch broker, was also named in the 41-page indictment.


While I agree that there are definitly bigger fish to fry (I would persoanlly like to see Kenneth Lay behind bars as Jon Stewart mentioned last night Very Happy ) she shouldn't be given any more or less attention than her crimes deserve. She broke the law. Now she will be judged. Remember that this thread is about Martha Stewart, not the impotence of the SEC.
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 09:12 am
Well, i would only note that Martha Stewart might not be the issue, were the SEC not so impotent.
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 09:14 am
Setanta wrote:
Well, i would only note that Martha Stewart might not be the issue, were the SEC not so impotent.


Noted.
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dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 09:16 am
McGentrix - yes - but there is something so horrible about watching the slavering mob delight in the carving up of a falling celebrity, that it almost always makes me want to excuse them ... irrational, I know.

No better description of that process, I think, than in the book "Bonfire of the Vanities".
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Mapleleaf
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 09:34 am
Thank-you'all for an interesting thread. Apparently, several other events are running parallel with our interaction; one being the full page add in USA TODAY; I'm not sure which day.
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Letty
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 10:37 am
There's no such thing as bad publicity. The press has pictured Martha as being hurt by the obvious glee that the public has taken in seeing Ms. "Suzie home-maker" stripped of her frilly apron.

As to whether she's being unfairly targeted,(and I agree, Setanta, the SEC has been doing a piss poor job, and that has everything to do with everything)probably, because she's a marvelous scape goat. She'll get a slap on the wrist and go home and ask the cook to prepare a late supper.
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 10:40 am
I read some of the coverage of this on the way in to work this a.m. It's not just about Cousin Martha. She is not named alone, she is part of a group facing charges. She's probably the 'most interesting' to the general public, but that's her problem, she wanted her face everywhere. There is a risk to putting yourself out there. It's not a particular effect of being a woman.

You want publicity? You can have it. Good and bad.
0 Replies
 
Letty
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 10:49 am
Amen, ehBeth. Once again the wisdom of Harry S. Truman breaks through the cloud formations.

"If you can't stand the heat; get out of the kitchen"

Sorry. Couldn't resist. Smile
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cavfancier
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 10:50 am
Anyone remember "Martha Stewart Syndrome?" Maybe now they can all heal....
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dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 10:53 am
I still think there is something gross about the celebrity carve-up process...
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