3
   

Fear sells Better than Sex

 
 
Reply Tue 15 Aug, 2006 04:14 pm
If like me, you're beginning to wonder about the sanity of your Government and the fate of the human race - take a break for five minutes and remind yourself that you are not alone.


Quote:
So Osama Walks Into This Bar

By Greg Palast

08/15/06 "Information Clearing House" - --- So, Osama Walks into This Bar, See? and Bush says, "Whad'l'ya have, pardner?" and Osama says...

But wait a minute. I'd better shut my mouth. The sign here in the airport says, "Security is no joking matter." But if security's no joking matter, why does this guy dressed in a high-school marching band outfit tell me to dump my Frappuccino and take off my shoes? All I can say is, Thank the Lord the "shoe bomber" didn't carry Semtex in his underpants.

Today's a RED and ORANGE ALERT day. How odd. They just caught the British guys with the chemistry sets. But when these guys were about to blow up airliners, the USA was on YELLOW alert. That's a "lowered" threat notice.

According to the press office from the Department of Homeland Security, lowered-threat Yellow means that there were no special inspections of passengers or cargo. Isn't it nice of Mr. Bush to alert Osama when half our security forces are given the day off? Hmm. I asked an Israeli security expert why his nation doesn't use these pretty color codes.

He asked me if, when I woke up, I checked the day's terror color.

"I can't say I ever have. I mean, who would?"

He smiled. "The terrorists."

America is the only nation on the planet that kindly informs bombers, hijackers and berserkers the days on which they won't be monitored. You've got to get up pretty early in the morning to get a jump on George Bush's team.

There are three possible explanations for the Administration's publishing a good-day-for-bombing color guidebook.

1. God is on Osama's side.

2. George is on Osama's side.

3. Fear sells better than sex.

A gold star if you picked #3.

The Fear Factory

I'm going to tell you something which is straight-up heresy: America is not under attack by terrorists. There is no WAR on terror because, except for one day five years ago, al Qaeda has pretty much left us alone.

That's because Osama got what he wanted. There's no mystery about what Al Qaeda was after. Like everyone from the Girl Scouts to Bono, Osama put his wish on his web site. He had a single demand: "Crusaders out of the land of the two Holy Places." To translate: get US troops out of Saudi Arabia.

And George Bush gave it to him. On April 29, 2003, two days before landing on the aircraft carrier Lincoln, our self-described "War President" quietly put out a notice that he was withdrawing our troops from Saudi soil. In other words, our cowering cowboy gave in whimpering to Osama's demand.

The press took no note. They were all wiggie over Bush's waddling around the carrier deck in a disco-aged jump suit announcing, "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED." But it wasn't America's mission that was accomplished, it was Osama's.

Am I saying there's no danger, no threat? Sure there is: 46 million Americans don't have health insurance. IBM is legally stealing from its employees' pension plan and United Airlines has dumped its pensions altogether. Four-million three-hundred thousand Americans were injured, made sick or killed by their jobs last year. TXU Corporation is right now building four monster-sized power plants in Texas that will burn skuzzy gunk called "lignite." The filth it will pour into the sky will snuff a heck of a lot more Americans than some goofy group of fanatics with bottles of hydrogen peroxide.

But Americans don't ask for real protection from what's killing us. The War on Terror is the Weapon of Mass Distraction. Instead of demanding health insurance, we have 59 million of our fellow citizens pooping in their pants with fear of Al Qaeda, waddling to the polls, crying, "Georgie save us!"

And what does he give us? In my own small town, the federal government has paid for loading an SUV with .50 caliber machine guns to watch for an Al Qaeda attack at the dock of the ferry that takes tourists to the Indian casino in Connecticut. The casino dock is my town's officially designated "Critical Asset and Vulnerability Infrastructure Point (CAVIP)." (To find the most vulnerable points to attack in the USA, Al Qaeda can download a list from the Department of Homeland Security -- no kidding.)

But that's not all. Bush is protecting us from English hijackers with a fearsome anti-terrorist tool: the Virginia-class submarine. The V-boat was originally meant to hunt Soviet subs. But there are no more Soviet subs. So, General Dynamics and Lockheed Martin have "refitted" these Cold War dinosaurs with new torpedoes redesigned to carry counter-terror commandoes. That's right: when we find Osama's beach house, we can shoot our boys right up under his picnic table and take him out. These Marines-in-a-tube injector boats cost $2.5 billion each -- and our President's ordered half a dozen new ones.

Lynn Cheney, the Veep's wife, still takes in compensation from Lockheed as a former board member. I'm sure that has nothing to do with this multi-billion dollar "anti-terror" contract.

Fear sells better than sex. Fear is the sales pitch for many lucrative products: from billion-dollar sailor injectors to one very lucrative war in Mesopotamia (a third of a trillion dollars doled out, no audits, no questions asked).

Better than toothpaste that makes our teeth whiter than white, this stuff will make us safer than safe. It's political junk food, the cheap filling in the flashy tube. What we don't get is safety from the real dangers: a life-threatening health-care system, lung-murdering pollution production and a trade deficit with China that's reducing mid-America to coolie status. Protecting us from these true threats would take a slice of the profits of the Lockheeds, the Exxons and the rest of the owning class.

War on Terror is class war by other means -- to keep you from asking for real protection from true menace, the landlords of our nation give you fake protection from manufactured dangers. And they remind you to be afraid every time you fly to see Aunt Millie and have to give up your hemorrhoid ointment to the underpaid guy in the bell-hop suit with a security badge.

Oh, hey, you never got the punch line.
So, Osama Walks into This Bar, See? and Bush says, "Whad'l'ya have, pardner?" and Osama says, "Well, George, what are you serving today?" and Bush says, "Fear," and Osama shouts, "Fear for everybody!" and George pours it on for the crowd. Then the presidential bartender says, "Hey, who's buying?" and Osama points a thumb at the crowd sucking down their brew. "They are," he says. And the two of them share a quiet laugh.

Greg Palast is the author of the just-released New York Times bestseller, ""Armed Madhouse": Who's Afraid of Osama Wolf?, China Floats Bush Sinks, the Scheme to Steal '08, No Child's Behind Left and other Dispatches from the Front Lines of the Class War" from which this is adapted. Go to www.GregPalast.com.


http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article14551.htm

***
I've just heard a rumour that Bush has asked for UN troops to seal off Syria's border -- and ports
Here we go
Back down to fuc king earth
  • Topic Stats
  • Top Replies
  • Link to this Topic
Type: Discussion • Score: 3 • Views: 2,437 • Replies: 39
No top replies

 
NickFun
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Aug, 2006 12:35 pm
I still like sex better.
0 Replies
 
fishin
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Aug, 2006 07:54 pm
Re: Fear sells Better than Sex
ENDYMION wrote:

***
I've just heard a rumour that Bush has asked for UN troops to seal off Syria's border -- and ports
Here we go
Back down to fuc king earth


Peddling your own brand of fear?
0 Replies
 
Endymion
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Aug, 2006 11:13 pm
Re: Fear sells Better than Sex
fishin wrote:
ENDYMION wrote:

***
I've just heard a rumour that Bush has asked for UN troops to seal off Syria's border -- and ports
Here we go
Back down to fuc king earth


Peddling your own brand of fear?



I hadn't thought of it like that, but now that you mention it, I can see why you might think so.

But I was voicing a fear - and although I'm no more proud of that, I can live with it.
0 Replies
 
Endymion
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Aug, 2006 03:00 pm
http://www.gregpalast.com/images/Buy-the-Book.jpg

OMG
Everyone, read this if you can get it.

http://www.gregpalast.com/



Bio

5Greg Palast is the author of the New York Times bestseller, "Armed Madhouse" (Penguin 2006). When Palast, an investigator of corporate fraud and racketeering, turned his skills to journalism, he was quickly recognized as, "The most important investigative reporter of our time" [Tribune Magazine] in Britain, where his first reports appeared on BBC television and in the Guardian newspapers.

Author of another New York Times bestseller, The Best Democracy Money Can Buy, Palast is best known in his native USA as the journalist who, for the Observer (UK), broke the story of how Jeb Bush purged thousands of Black Florida citizens from voter rolls before the 2000 election, thereby handing the White House to his brother George. His reports on the theft of election 2004, the spike of the FBI investigations of the bin Ladens before September 11, the secret State Department documents planning the seizure of Iraq's oil fields have won him a record six "Project Censored" for reporting the news American media doesn't want you to hear. "The top investigative journalist in the United States is persona non grata in his own country's media." [Asia Times.] He returned to America to report for Harper's Magazine.

Palast's Sam Spade style television and print expos'es about elections manipulations, War on Terror and globalization, as seen on BBC 's Newsnight and Amy Goodman's Democracy Now!

Palast, who has led investigations for government on three continents, has an academic side: the author of Democracy and Regulation, a seminal treatise on energy corporations and government control commissioned by the United Nations based on his lectures at Cambridge University and the University of Sao Paulo.

Beginning in the 1970s, having earned his degree in finance studying under Milton Friedman and free-trade luminaries, Palast went on to challenge their vision of a New Global Order, working for the United Steelworkers of America, the Enron workers' coalition in Latin America and consumer and environmental groups worldwide. As an investigator for the Chugach Natives of Alaska, he uncovered the oil company frauds which led to the grounding of the Exxon Valdez. His racketeering probe of a nuclear plant operator led to one of the largest jury judgments in US history

In 1998 Palast went undercover for Britain's Observer, worked his way inside the prime minister's inner circle and busted open Tony Blair's biggest scandal, "Lobbygate," chosen by Palast's press colleagues in the UK as "Story of the Year." As the Chicago Tribune said, became a "fanatic about documents-especially those marked "secret and confidential" from the locked file cabinets of the FBI, the World Bank, the US State Department and other closed-door operations of government and industry-which regularly find their way into Palast's hands. The inside information he obtained on Rev. Pat Robertson won him a nomination as Britain's top business journalist.

Palast, Guerrilla News Network's Guerrilla of the Year, is Patron of the Trinity College Philosophical Society, an honor previously held by Jonathan Swift and Oscar Wilde. His writings have won the Financial Times David Thomas Prize-and inspired the Eminem video, Mosh. "An American hero," said Martin Luther King III. In the BBC documentary, Bush Family Fortunes, Palast exposed George Bush Jr.'s dodging the Vietnam War draft. Greg Palast, says Noam Chomsky, "Upsets all the right people."

Palast won the George Orwell Courage in Journalism Award for his BBC documentary, Bush Family Fortunes.
What they're saying …

"The greatest investigative reporter of our time" -Tribune magazine

"Twisted" -Katherine Harris

"We hate that sonuvabitch." -The White House

Michael Moore says Palast's reporting for BBC Television is "courageous."

In England, Tribune Magazine calls him, "The most important investigative reporter of our time."

"Greg Palast is investigative journalism at its best. No one has exposed more truth about the Bush Cartel and lived to tell the story." - Baltimore Chronicle

"To Americans who cannot read his stories printed in Britain's Observer, he is America's journalist hero of the Internet." - Alan Colmes, Fox Television

After exposing on BBC TV the contents of a stack of documents from inside The World Bank and the World Trade Organization, the WTO called his report, "Rubbish rubbish rubbish," and CNN reported, "The World Bank hates Greg Palast" for stories the Wall Street Journal's Jude Wanniski called, "Extraordinary reporting on the IMF," and Nobel Laureate Joesph Stiglitz called, "Excellent on the WTO."

"The information is a hand grenade." - John Pilger, New Statesman

"What does a multi-award winning reporting investigator do when he has a huge story to break? If it's Greg Palast, one of America's foremost journalists, he goes to England! Greg Palast has repeatedly scooped the U.S. networks, and newspaper elites, reporting for London's Guardian newspaper, and BBC television's current affairs flagship program, Newsnight. He's reported on the truth behind George W. Bush's theft of the 2000 presidential election, the attempted theft of Venezuelan democracy, the World Bank's willful destruction of Argentina, Enron's looting of California, and the cozy relationship between the Bush and Bin Laden dynasties. The problem is: The men behind the curtain of America's media don't want you to know about these, or any of the other stories he has to tell. Undeterred by the sucking vacuum of America's mainstream media, Greg put together a few of his greatest journalistic hits in the book, "The Best Democracy Money Can Buy: the Truth About Corporate Cons, Globalization, and High-Finance Fraudsters." Ironically, the stories the New York Times didn't find fit to print have become a New York Times best-seller. Now Greg Palast is releasing a DVD, "Bush Family Fortunes," based on "The Best Democracy Money Can Buy," and featuring some of his reports from Britain." - Chris Cook, Canadian Broadcasting Corporation

"The world's greatest investigative reporter you've never heard of." -Cleveland Free Times

Awards

Patron of the Philosophical Society, Trinity College (an award previously given to Oscar Wilde and Jonathan Swift)

The Upton Sinclair Freedom of Expression AwardThe American Civil Liberties Union

George Orwell Courage in Journalism Award: Freedom Cinema Fest at The Sundance Film Festival

The Financial Times David Thomas Prize

Nominated for Business Journalist of the Year 1998 (UK)

Politics Story of the Year on Salon.com 2001

Guerilla News Network's Reporter of the Year

The Peace and Justice Award -Office of the Americas

Path Breaking Investigative Journalism Award-Long Island Progressive Coalition

National Press Club's Arthur Rowse Award for Press Criticism, Book Category, First Place.

http://www.gregpalast.com/about-greg/



******************************************************


FALLUJA ARITHMETIC LESSON
Sunday Dec 11, 2005
by Prof. Greg Palast

New York Times, page 1:
"American commanders said 38 service members had been killed and 275 wounded in the Falluja assault."
New York Times, page 11:
"The American military hospital here reported that it had treated 419 American soldiers since the siege of Falluja began."
Questions for the class:
1. If 275 soldiers were wounded in Falluja and 419 are treated for wounds, how many were shot on the plane ride to Germany?
2. We're told only 275 soldiers were wounded but 419 treated for wounds; and we're told that 38 soldiers died. So how many will be buried?
3. How long have these Times reporters been embedded with with military? Bonus question: When will they get out of bed with the military?
New York Times, page 1:
"The commanders estimated that 1,200 to 1,600 insurgents had been killed."
New York Times, page 11:
"Nowhere to be found: the remains of the insurgents that the tanks had been sent in to destroy. ...The absence of insurgent bodies in Falluja has remained an enduring mystery."
"Every time I hear the news
That old feeling comes back on;
We're waist deep in the Big Muddy
And the Big Fool says to push on."
- Pete Seeger, 1967 Happy New Year.
0 Replies
 
Endymion
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Aug, 2006 05:34 pm
Here in Britain

Eleven charged over 'bomb plot'

DAC Peter Clarke:

"The threat from terrorism is real. It is here, it is deadly and it is enduring.

"As we all look for explanations, we cannot afford to be complacent and ignore the reality of what we face".

"However the investigation is far from complete. The scale is immense, inquiries will span the globe.

"The enormity of the alleged plot will be matched only by our determination to follow every lead and line of inquiry."

"I would like to reassure the public that we are doing everything we can to keep you safe so that you can live your lives without being in constant fear.

***************** Was I in Constant Fear????***********
Actually no. Only constant anger at being patronised. Of course there are going to be unhappy Muslims in Britain wanting revenge. What does this government think? That their illegal war on Iraq, that their failure to demand a cease-fire in Lebanon, that their turning a blind eye to the bombs going out of Scotland to Israel isn't going to have repercussions?

There's only one way to stop the terror - and that is to stop being terrorists.
0 Replies
 
Endymion
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 Aug, 2006 05:24 am
http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?ItemID=21261


Geov Parrish
WorkingForChange.com
08.22.06



Quote:
Was British terror plot a load of crap?
Liquid explosives very difficult to make; Orange Alert a political move?


An article posted last Thursday in the British online outlet The Register raises a very good question I haven't seen posed anywhere else, certainly not in our sycophantic American media: was the exposed British "plot" to bring down commercial airliners by mixing harmless household chemicals in the lavatory even remotely possible from the standpoint of basic chemistry?

To address that question, it's worth quoting from The Register's article:

"We're told that the suspects were planning to use TATP, or triacetone triperoxide, a high explosive that supposedly can be made from common household chemicals unlikely to be caught by airport screeners. A little hair dye, drain cleaner, and paint thinner -- all easily concealed in drinks bottles -- and the forces of evil have effectively smuggled a deadly bomb onboard your plane. ... Making a quantity of TATP sufficient to bring down an airplane is not quite as simple as ducking into the toilet and mixing two harmless liquids together.

First, you've got to get adequately concentrated hydrogen peroxide. This is hard to come by, so a large quantity of the three per cent solution sold in pharmacies might have to be concentrated by boiling off the water. Only this is risky, and can lead to mission failure by means of burning down your makeshift lab before a single infidel has been harmed.

But let's assume that you can obtain it in the required concentration, or cook it from a dilute solution without ruining your operation. Fine. The remaining ingredients, acetone and sulfuric acid, are far easier to obtain, and we can assume that you've got them on hand.

Now for the fun part. Take your hydrogen peroxide, acetone, and sulfuric acid, measure them very carefully, and put them into drinks bottles for convenient smuggling onto a plane. It's all right to mix the peroxide and acetone in one container, so long as it remains cool. Don't forget to bring several frozen gel-packs (preferably in a Styrofoam chiller deceptively marked "perishable foods"), a thermometer, a large beaker, a stirring rod, and a medicine dropper. You're going to need them.

It's best to fly first class and order Champagne. The bucket full of ice water, which the airline ought to supply, might possibly be adequate -- especially if you have those cold gel-packs handy to supplement the ice, and the Styrofoam chiller handy for insulation -- to get you through the cookery without starting a fire in the lavvie.

Once the plane is over the ocean, very discreetly bring all of your gear into the toilet. You might need to make several trips to avoid drawing attention. Once your kit is in place, put a beaker containing the peroxide/acetone mixture into the ice water bath (Champagne bucket), and start adding the acid, drop by drop, while stirring constantly. Watch the reaction temperature carefully. The mixture will heat, and if it gets too hot, you'll end up with a weak explosive. In fact, if it gets really hot, you'll get a premature explosion possibly sufficient to kill you, but probably no one else.

After a few hours -- assuming, by some miracle, that the fumes haven't overcome you or alerted passengers or the flight crew to your activities -- you'll have a quantity of TATP with which to carry out your mission. Now all you need to do is dry it for an hour or two.

The genius of this scheme is that TATP is relatively easy to detonate. But you must make enough of it to crash the plane, and you must make it with care to assure potency. One needs quality stuff to commit "mass murder on an unimaginable scale," as Deputy Police Commissioner Paul Stephenson put it. While it's true that a slapdash concoction will explode, it's unlikely to do more than blow out a few windows. At best, an infidel or two might be killed by the blast, and one or two others by flying debris as the cabin suddenly depressurizes, but that's about all you're likely to manage under the most favorable conditions possible."

I'm no chemist, but if The Register's description is true, it raises another question: was the dramatic inconveniencing this month of untold hundreds of thousands of air travelers around the US, and probably millions around the world, justified as a reaction to such an unlikely threat? Or is this all about the politics of fear, yet another in a long line of overhyped terrorist "plots" that got tons of government hype and, thus, media attention, but which in reality never got much farther than the fertile yet bumbling imaginations of a few would-be jihadists?

The fact is, a number of the British plotters didn't even have passports yet (which in Britain, take months to obtain), let alone plane tickets, so not only was a "catastrophe" not likely, but it also wasn't "days away." Even if they had the technical know-how to develop the bomb as described, which seems like, um, a stretch. Certainly, the plot was not developed or imminent enough to justify the panicky overreaction of US and other Western authorities.

These plots and lurid announcements accumulate; each necessarily has to be a bit more lurid than the last, as in this year's Miami, Canadian, and now British busts, so as to properly frighten a public plagued by a short attention span. In most cases, the "plots" turn out to be far less credible than originally advertised (remember Jose Padilla, the dirty bomber?), with charges quietly either reduced or dropped entirely. Their fantasies become fodder in a still larger war, the endless war for political power.

Meanwhile, a truly well-trained team of commandos could probably commandeer an airplane with their bare hands. And if you truly want to smuggle explosives on board, all you'd really need is to blow yourself up -- literally. Line up a sympathetic jihadist surgeon and anesthesiologist, and insert the bomb in your abdominal cavity. Let it heal a bit, don't forget your cell phone detonator, and happy travels. Good luck stopping it. Or, forget a plane; T-bone a boatful of explosives into one of those floating cities called cruise ships, somewhere in international waters. That's the sort of serious, militarily-minded terrorist activity authorities should be worried about.

There have been credible reports that British authorities, unconcerned about any imminent threat, wanted to wait and let the plot unfold, so as to gather more information and evidence regarding the people involved, but that Washington pushed hard for early arrests. Gee, I wonder why? A November election that is likely to turn on Republican mismanagement of the so-called "Global War On Terror" wouldn't have anything to do with the timing of arrests and the unprecedented (and helpfully color-coded) security alert, would it?

Would it?
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 Aug, 2006 05:30 am
A very cynical take on a simple, and reasonable attempt to protect us from real danger. Sorry, but the world is a dangerous place, and that's not a conspiracy to frighten you, just an unfortunate fact.
0 Replies
 
Endymion
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 09:56 am
Yes, I know the world's a dangerous place. You don't have to tell me that. I may sound like a soft piece of shite - but I've got plenty of scars.

Yes the world is dangerous
My point is that it doesn't have to be

I'm not afraid ( and I don't know anyone who is) of being blown up by a fanatic - why should I be? We've been through worse with the IRA.

What I am concerned about is this Government trashing any hopes for peace, ruining our foreign reputation, driving fanatics (and desperados) into retaliation and stocking up a whole pile of revenge to be heaped on the unknowing heads of our children.

Not to mention steering us towards nuclear war
Ignoring the billions of worldwide poor
Lying, cheating, patronising and manipulating.

I'm not afraid - I'm f........ angry.


Just wish people would start addressing the truth that's all.
It's hard to face up to the fact that we are being used to reap profits for the corporate war-mongers....
But it's been like this throughout history. Eisenhower saw it coming... so did George Orwell
I find it sickening - not only that we haven't changed our ways, but that people fail to want to discover the truth.

That people make money out of sending youths to war and killing thousands of civilians - all because of the price of a barrel ....
Man, I find that hard to come to terms with.
But after reading Noam Chomsky and others, it's the only fair conclusion I can come to.

Churchill once suggested that Britain test out its poison gases on Iraq. He said that he didn't see a problem with testing on "tribesmen"
Who the f.... do these bastards in power think they are?

Don't answer any of that B
I'm not in the mood for anymore right now

I'm fuc king off

(no offence meant)

Endy
0 Replies
 
blacksmithn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 10:25 am
"They sell us the president the same way
They sell us our clothes and our cars
They sell us every thing from youth to religion
The same time they sell us our wars
I want to know who the men in the shadows are
I want to hear somebody asking them why
They can be counted on to tell us who our enemies are
But they're never the ones to fight or to die."

--Jackson Browne
0 Replies
 
Endymion
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 01:09 am
Endymion wrote:


I'm not afraid - I'm f........ angry.


Nothings changed
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 11:00 pm
Nothing sells better than sex.

Just because I am paranoid, doesn't mean someone isn't following me.
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Dec, 2007 05:32 pm
In a civilized poverty stricken world. sex is the last subject.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Dec, 2007 11:06 pm
Ramafuchs wrote:
In a civilized poverty stricken world. sex is the last subject.


No, it is the first.
0 Replies
 
anton
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Dec, 2007 02:08 am
Brandon9000 wrote:
A very cynical take on a simple, and reasonable attempt to protect us from real danger. Sorry, but the world is a dangerous place, and that's not a conspiracy to frighten you, just an unfortunate fact.


Why legitimize terrorists by declaring war on them, anyone who uses terror to wage war against the masses is an outright criminal; they are nothing less than murdering thugs and they should be identified as such. The Bush regime has used the fear of terrorism to control the populace and manipulate the American judicial system; the Bush administration obviously doesn't understand that torture is terrorism and those who execute the barbaric practice are no better than the terrorists they are against. The world was a much safer place before the GW Bush presidency, I am more afraid of the Bush regime than I am of Osama Bin Laden!
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Dec, 2007 06:31 pm
anton wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
A very cynical take on a simple, and reasonable attempt to protect us from real danger. Sorry, but the world is a dangerous place, and that's not a conspiracy to frighten you, just an unfortunate fact.


Why legitimize terrorists by declaring war on them, anyone who uses terror to wage war against the masses is an outright criminal; they are nothing less than murdering thugs and they should be identified as such. The Bush regime has used the fear of terrorism to control the populace and manipulate the American judicial system; the Bush administration obviously doesn't understand that torture is terrorism and those who execute the barbaric practice are no better than the terrorists they are against. The world was a much safer place before the GW Bush presidency, I am more afraid of the Bush regime than I am of Osama Bin Laden!


Frankly, it is absurd to suggest that by declaring war on terrorists, they are legitimized.

The US actually declared war on Nazi Germany. Did that represent a legitimization of Nazi Germany?

Somehow I doubt that you would approve of alternative phrasing like "We declare we will eradicate, obliterate, render unto nothingness terrorists."

It is ironic in the extreme when Liberals urge us to consider terrorists as criminals rather than enemies because the latter legitimizes them. Since when did a Liberal not consider a criminal "legitimate?" In fact, Liberals tend to demand that we recognize that criminals are "legitimate" human beings.

If you are more afraid of Bush led America that Bin Laden led Al Queda, your are, undoubtedly, a person without serious thought.
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Dec, 2007 07:11 pm
Finn
"The US actually declared war on Nazi Germany. Did that represent a legitimization of Nazi Germany? "
Delaring war against a nsty regime is something but declaring a war against omnipoten, omnipresent group of criminals is something else.
Is it not foolish to wage a war against invisible hidden barbaric group which has no address?
Nazi Germany has location and address while terrorists have none
0 Replies
 
anton
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Dec, 2007 10:46 pm
Finn dAbuzz wrote:
anton wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
A very cynical take on a simple, and reasonable attempt to protect us from real danger. Sorry, but the world is a dangerous place, and that's not a conspiracy to frighten you, just an unfortunate fact.


Why legitimize terrorists by declaring war on them, anyone who uses terror to wage war against the masses is an outright criminal; they are nothing less than murdering thugs and they should be identified as such. The Bush regime has used the fear of terrorism to control the populace and manipulate the American judicial system; the Bush administration obviously doesn't understand that torture is terrorism and those who execute the barbaric practice are no better than the terrorists they are against. The world was a much safer place before the GW Bush presidency, I am more afraid of the Bush regime than I am of Osama Bin Laden!


Frankly, it is absurd to suggest that by declaring war on terrorists, they are legitimized.

The US actually declared war on Nazi Germany. Did that represent a legitimization of Nazi Germany?

Somehow I doubt that you would approve of alternative phrasing like "We declare we will eradicate, obliterate, render unto nothingness terrorists."

It is ironic in the extreme when Liberals urge us to consider terrorists as criminals rather than enemies because the latter legitimizes them. Since when did a Liberal not consider a criminal "legitimate?" In fact, Liberals tend to demand that we recognize that criminals are "legitimate" human beings.

If you are more afraid of Bush led America that Bin Laden led Al Queda, your are, undoubtedly, a person without serious thought.


To begin with the US did not declare war on Nazi Germany, Adolf Hitler declared war on the US at the same time the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbour, it was then that a state of war existed between the US and Germany; initially the US wanted nothing to do with the war which they referred to as "that European war" … Britain and her Commonwealth stood alone against the might of the Third Reich for just over two years before America was dragged into the fray.

How do you declare war on terror, my wife is terrified of snakes, are they included in this war and what about my Dentist, I'm no too fond of him?
How can you declare war on terror, terrorism is not an enemy it is a method, war is made on an identifiable enemy; by declaring war on thugs and murderers you are giving them an identity, you are recognising them as a legitimate military opponent.
A terrorist act is a brutal, inhumane, barbaric method of terrifying people just as the act of torture is and you can't fight one with the other, no more than you can spread democracy at the point of a gun.

Incidently I am not a Liberal, I vote Labor in Australia and if anything I am a realist!
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 Dec, 2007 12:40 pm
Quote:
To begin with the US did not declare war on Nazi Germany, Adolf Hitler declared war on the US at the same time the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbour, it was then that a state of war existed between the US and Germany; initially the US wanted nothing to do with the war which they referred to as "that European war" … Britain and her Commonwealth stood alone against the might of the Third Reich for just over two years before America was dragged into the fray.


You need to retract your statement.
The US DID declare war on Germany,on Dec 11, 1941.
For your education, here is a copy of that declaration...

http://207.61.100.164/cantext/wwii/1941usde.html
0 Replies
 
anton
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 Dec, 2007 04:53 pm
mysteryman wrote:
Quote:
To begin with the US did not declare war on Nazi Germany, Adolf Hitler declared war on the US at the same time the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbour, it was then that a state of war existed between the US and Germany; initially the US wanted nothing to do with the war which they referred to as "that European war" … Britain and her Commonwealth stood alone against the might of the Third Reich for just over two years before America was dragged into the fray.


You need to retract your statement.
The US DID declare war on Germany,on Dec 11, 1941.
For your education, here is a copy of that declaration...

http://207.61.100.164/cantext/wwii/1941usde.html


Perhaps you should read my post again where I said, "Adolf Hitler declared war on the US at the same time the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbour, it was then that a state of war existed between the US and Germany; that is a fact and if Hitler had not declared war on the US America would never have declared war on Germany, they would have continued to sit on the fence counting the dollars.
I am still wondering how you declare war on terror, perhaps it is an American thing?
Incidently I lived through the Second World War bombing and I thank God the US was dragged into the fight, it would have been a different story without their help but please do not believe your own fiction, America didn't save the world, the war was all but won when the US came in.
Please excuse me for getting off thread, I just find it so exasperating when some American's put their country forward as God's gift to mankind ... it is the only country that got rich of the back of the war!
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
GAFFNEY: Whose side is Obama on? - Discussion by gungasnake
 
  1. Forums
  2. » Fear sells Better than Sex
Copyright © 2019 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 10/15/2019 at 08:34:57