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ISRAEL - IRAN - SYRIA - HAMAS - HEZBOLLAH - WWWIII?

 
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 09:38 am
Setanta wrote:
McG is here to play white knight, riding to the rescue of the confused Fox, and to spew atrabilious vituperation.

You didn't actually expect him to read the material linked, did you? You don't actually believe that Fox has read it, do you?


Of course not. They gotta stick together, after all.

In Republicanville, it's 'hateful' to point out when people are consistently wrong. Wow, I just figured out why everyone is a Bush 'hater'...

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 11:02 am
The leflibs allege that the USA caused and/or causes the development and expansion of ICT by defending itself and others against ICT. The leflibs imply that the development and expansion of ICT would have been less or non-existent if the USA had not defended itself and others against ICT.

The leflibs allege that Israel's efforts to protect itself against its destruction by ICT were excessive.

ICT are evil enemies of humanity.

ICT = Islama Caliphate Totalitarians (e.g., al-Fatah, Hamas, Hezbollah, al-Qaeda, Taliban, Baathists, et al).

ICT are waging war against non-combatants.

Protectors of non-combatants are waging war against ICT to end ICT's war against non-combatants.

ICT are waging war against Israeli, Iraqi and Afghan non-combatants.

Israeli, Iraqi, and Afghan protectors of non-combatants are waging war against ICT to end ICT's war against Israeli, Iraqi, and Afghan non-combatants.

ICT are waging war against American non-combatants.

American protectors of non-combatants are waging war against ICT to end ICT's war against Israeli, Iraqi, Afghan, and American non-combatants.

ICT must be exterminated, because ICT's evil is not negotiable.

ICT are evil enemies of humanity.

All our efforts to exterminate ICT are not excessive efforts to defend ourselves.


The leflibs are frauds and/or fools and/or schizophrenics.

Are you a leflib?
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 11:48 am
Using the logic that some of the 'experts' seem to be using, we would have won WWII splendidly by NOT attacking the Germans or Japanese, etc. and just look at how many lives would have been saved had we just imposed sanctions and let it go at that.

And in Israel's case, they have to be really sure that any sanctions they impose don't impose on anybody too.
0 Replies
 
Asherman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 12:45 pm
BTW, I don't find Foxfire's position to be unreasonable, or particularly flawed in its reasoning. Of course, both of us being conservative supporters of U.S. policies, that would be expected. Looking back over Foxfires posts, it seems to me she has taken a lot of un-necessary verbal abuse from people who should know better. For what its worth, I don't agree with Foxfire on all matters, but her positions are far less wacky than those of Solve Coagula, Pachelbell, MarionT, and many others left of the aisle.

It is disingenuous to insult her for holding opinions different from those held by the Democratic Party. She gives an opinion and is challenged for citations. Generally, she supplies lengthy citations that are within the four corners of the question. Many of those citations come from editorializing writers from a conservative point of view and are no better nor worse than the citations given by our more liberal, leftish colleagues.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 12:49 pm
Thanks Ash. I do have to take gentle issue with one of your comments though. I do think Conservative citations are better than Leftist ones or I wouldn't be Conservative. But it's a minor point. Smile
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 12:55 pm
As far as MarionT is concerned, there are many people here who consider that this member is the latest incarnation of Italgato/Massagato/Chizaria/Mortkat/BernardR, and whatever other aliases he has used at this site. There is good inferential textual evidence for that. Given that he has always attacked (sometimes and often rising to the level of hysteria) people he percieves to be on the left, the inference would be that he has come up with this wacky left-wing fringe rhetoric in order to discredit "leftists."

Like so many assumptions of those on the right, this is based upon a flawed perception--in this case that there is any such thing as a monolithic "leftist" point of view. At all events, even as a member of the rightwing lunatic fringe, I/M/C/M/B was sufficiently off the edge of the map as to be the sole member of his own lunatic fringe group.

That was a good short list of leftwingnut lunatic fringe representatives at this site, but you left out three of their big stars--the leftwingnut lunatic fringe infield, as it were: Detano Inipo, Blueflame and Freedom4free.

***************************************************

As for the abuse of that consumate weaver of strawmen and touter of her own wisdom and virtue, Fox--she is being taken to task for stating that an Israeli human rights group quoted by Walter is wrong. When she first arrived at this site, she told us we should take her word for things because she is well-informed and well-educated, the obvious inference being that the rest of us aren't. This is just the latest example of this attitude on her part.

Given the choice to believe a group of Israeli professional people, including members of the Knesset, on the subject of human rights abuses in Israel, or believing a rightwing, internet political propaganda hack, i'll go with the Israelis every time.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 01:01 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
Using the logic that some of the 'experts' seem to be using, we would have won WWII splendidly by NOT attacking the Germans or Japanese, etc. and just look at how many lives would have been saved had we just imposed sanctions and let it go at that.

And in Israel's case, they have to be really sure that any sanctions they impose don't impose on anybody too.


http://shoutluton.com/attractions/images/strawman.jpg

http://www.picpop.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10059/jeez.jpg

In fact, the only way to correlate what Israel did to Lebanese civilians to the second world war would have been to suggest that the United States would have been justified in nuking Holland because there were Germans there launching V-rockets at England and using the Dutch as "human shields."

But this not below your usual low standard of rhetoric, which lower than a snake's belly.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 01:15 pm
FLAME TROLL

http://redwing.hutman.net/~mreed/Assets/bigdog.jpg

Big Dog is a bully who doesn't hesitate to use his superior strength to intimidate other combatants. Big Dog may be smart, articulate or just plain mean, but in any case he is a remorseless bully, brutally ripping into even the weakest of combatants. Once Big Dog securely fastens his powerful jaws on a hapless victim, bIG dOG'S Me-Too toady will join the attack. Me-Too is far too weak and insecure to engage in single combat, and must ally himself with Big Dog or a pack of other bullies to bring down his quarry.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 01:19 pm
I see . . . so that explains why McG rushed into the thread . . . he's your rightwingnut Big Dog, huh?

Makes sense.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 02:09 pm
Whatever McG is, he is not a bully. Nor is he any kind of troll.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 02:15 pm
I beg to differ with you.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 02:23 pm
Setanta wrote:
I beg to differ with you.


Of course you do. It's probably what gets you up in the morning.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 02:26 pm
My love for my Sweetiepie Girl and for the two little doggies gets me up in the morning. Dealing with ignorant rightwing clowns is just for the comic relief.
0 Replies
 
timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Sep, 2006 07:47 pm
<chuckle>
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Sep, 2006 03:51 am
Quote:
Like so many assumptions of those on the right, this is based upon a flawed perception--in this case that there is any such thing as a monolithic "leftist" point of view. At all events, even as a member of the rightwing lunatic fringe, I/M/C/M/B was sufficiently off the edge of the map as to be the sole member of his own lunatic fringe group.



But you do seem to think that the "right" has a monolithic view of everything.

Both sides have as many different views of everything as there are people.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Sep, 2006 08:53 am
I wrote "so many assumptions"--not all assumptions. I know you don't do subtlety or distinctions well, but do try to keep up.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Sep, 2006 09:57 am
mysteryman wrote:
Quote:
Like so many assumptions of those on the right, this is based upon a flawed perception--in this case that there is any such thing as a monolithic "leftist" point of view. At all events, even as a member of the rightwing lunatic fringe, I/M/C/M/B was sufficiently off the edge of the map as to be the sole member of his own lunatic fringe group.



But you do seem to think that the "right" has a monolithic view of everything.

Both sides have as many different views of everything as there are people.


There are many different ways to be wrong on a single issue, and the Right never fails to show the spectrum given a chance.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Sep, 2006 02:25 pm
Quote:
Hezbollah:

04/18/1983 -- crashes van bomb into U.S. Embassy in
..................... Beirut, killing 63 including 17 Americans;
10/23/1983 -- explode truck bomb at U.S. Marine Barracks in
...................... Beirut killing 241 Marines in peace keeping force;
03/16/1984 -- kidnaps and murders CIA station chief, William F.
...................... Buckley;
04/12/1984 -- bombs Torrejon, Spain restaurant near U.S. Air
...................... Force Base, killing 18 U.S. servicemen;
09/20/1984 -- car-bombs U.S. Embassy annex in east Beirut
...................... killing 2 Americans, injuring ambassador;
12/04/1984 -- hijacks Kuwait Airlines plane and murder 2 American
...................... passengers;
06/14/1985 -- hijacks TWA flight 847, Athens to Rome with 153
...................... passengers, mostly Americans, beats passenger
...................... Robert Stethem U.S. Navy diver to death and
...................... dumps onto Beirut Airport ramp;
02/17/1988 -- kidnaps and subsequently murders Col. William
...................... Higgins, U.S. Marine in Lebanon serving in
...................... UN truce monitoring group;
03/17/1992 -- bomb, with help of Iranian intelligence agents,
...................... Israeli embassy in Buenos Aires, wounding about
...................... 300, killing 28;
[Oslo accords in 1993, established Palestinian rule within Israel in return for not attacking Israelies]
07/18/1994 -- bomb the Jewish Community Center in in Buenos
...................... Aires, wounding about 200, killing 86;
11/28/1995 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
03/30/1996 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
06/25/1996 -- bomb Kobar Towers apartment complex in Saudi
...................... Arabia, killing 19 U.S. servicemen;
08/19/1997 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
12/28/1998 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
05/17/1999 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
06/24/1999 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
[05/24/2000, Israel completes pull out from Lebanon.]
10/07/2000 -- kidnaps 3 Israeli soldiers patrolling Israel's border
...................... with Lebanon, and their bodies are subsequently
...................... exchanged for 400 Arab prisoners;
[12/23/2000, Arafat rejects Israel's offer to pull out of Gaza and parts of the West Bank in return for recognizing Israel's right to exist.]
04/09/2002 -- bombards northern Israel towns with Katyusha
...................... rockets;
[05/02/2003, Israel accepts "Road Map" for peace.]
08/10/2003 -- bombards northern Israel towns with rockets,
...................... killing 16-year old Israeli boy;
[08/15/2005, Israel pulls out of Gaza and parts of the West Bank.]
07/12/2006 -- kidnaps 2 Israeli soliers, kills 8 Israeli soldiers
..................... on Israeli soil, and bombards northern Israel
..................... towns with rockets.



Israelies were finally pissed-off enough to go on a real offensive to defend themselves.

What the hell took them so long?
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Sep, 2006 02:59 pm
And here's what they've been up to in the last year or two when they aren't lobbing rockets into Israel:

Jan 5, 2005 - A terrorist infiltrated the Erez crossing terminal in the Gaza Strip, activated an explosive device, hurled grenades and opened fire. An IDF force shot and killed the terrorist. The Islamic Jihad and the Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades claimed responsibility for the attack.

Jan 12, 2005 - One Israeli civilian was killed and three IDF soldiers wounded when a bomb was detonated as a military vehicle patroled the route near Morag in the southern Gaza Strip. Two terrorists were killed by IDF forces. The area was booby-trapped with explosive devices, in addition to the bomb that exploded. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Jan 13, 2005 - On Thursday night, shortly before the closing of the Karni Crossing, terrorists activated an explosive device on the Palestinian side of the crossing, blowing a hole in the door through which Palestinian terrorists infiltrated the Israeli side of the crossing and opened fire at Israeli civilians. As a result of the explosion and during exchanges of fire, six Israeli civilians and three Palestinian terrorists were killed, and five Israeli civilians were wounded. Hamas and the Fatah al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades claimed joint responsiblity for the attack.

Jan 18, 2005 - An ISA officer was killed, an IDF officer seriously wounded, and 4 IDF soldiers and 3 members of the ISA were lightly wounded in a suicide bombing attack at the Gush Katif junction in the central Gaza Strip. While search procedures were being carried out, the suicide bomber with explosives strapped to his body detonated himself. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

Feb 25, 2005 - Five people were killed and 50 wounded Friday night, when a suicide bomber blew himself up outside the Stage club on the Tel Aviv promenade at around 11:20 P.M., on the corner of Herbert Samuel and Yonah Hanavi streets. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

July 12, 2005 - Five people were killed and about 90 wounded when a suicide bomber detonated himself outside Hasharon Mall in Netanya. The bomber was identified as Ahmed Abu Khalil, 18, from the West Bank village of Atil. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Aug 28, 2005 - A suicide bomber detonated himself outside the Beersheba Central Bus Station. Two security guards who stopped the bomber were severely wounded and about 50 people were lightly wounded or treated for shock. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

Oct 26, 2005 - Six people were killed and 55 wounded, six seriously, in a suicide bombing at the Hadera open-air market. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Dec 5, 2005 - Five people were killed and over 50 wounded in a suicide bombing at the entrance to the Sharon shopping mall in Netanya. The terrorist detonated the bomb when he was stopped by security guards, one of whom was killed. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Dec 29, 2005 - Lt. Ori Binamo, 21, of Nesher was killed when a terrorist en route to carry out an attack in Israel detonated himself at roadblock set up near Tulkarm following an intelligence tip. A second intended suicide terrorist was also killed in the blast as well as the taxi driver and a third passenger. Three soldiers and seven Palestinians were wounded.

Jan 19, 2006 - Thirty-one people were wounded in a suicide bombing in a shawarma restaurant near the old central bus station in Tel Aviv. The Jerusalem Battalions of the Palestinian Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Mar 30, 2006 - Four people were killed when a suicide bomber hitchhiker disguised as an ultra-Orthodox yeshiva student detonated his explosive device in a private vehicle near the entrance to Kedumim.

Apr 17, 2006 - Eleven people were killed and over 60 wounded in a suicide bombing during the Passover holiday near the old central bus station in Tel Aviv, at the Rosh Ha'ir shawarma restaurant, site of the Jan 19 bombing. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.
SOURCE

BACKUP SOURCE
0 Replies
 
blueflame1
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Sep, 2006 03:01 pm
The dispute among IAEA and U.S. on Iran's nuclear program http://www.tehrantimes.com/Description.asp?Da=9/30/2006&Cat=14&Num=003
0 Replies
 
 

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